[General] (no subject)

Sun Jan 24 14:17:56 PST 2016

Richard,

I like your approach (even tho I may not believe it). With the new twins, I
have only time enough to occasionally glance at these posts, & seldom
enough to reply,; but, I make a couple comments here.

You say:
"Let that circular radius go towards infinity and you get a photon
traveling in essentially a straight line, still having its inertial mass M
=hf/c^2 (where the photon frequency f decreases as the radius of the circle
increases) ."
I think that you need to define 2 frequencies, that of the photon, f, & the
photon 'orbital' frequency fo. In a stationary electron, f = fo (perhaps f
= 1/2 or 2 fo). The orbital frequency, fo, decreases as the radius of the
circle increases;* f does not*.

You also say:
"It can’t go faster or slower than c in a vacuum, so it can’t accelerate in
a linear direction, and in *normal* physics a photon doesn’t follow a
curved path (except with gravity), which would make it possible to measure
its centripetal acceleration c^2/R ."
If you allow the mass needed to create gravity to be part of your 'vacuum',
then you also need to allow the presence of a nucleus to be part of your
'vacuum'. This allows strong field gradients (E or H) to alter the local
refractive index, just as gravity alters the macroscopic index (defined as
c/v). It is only a matter of scale.

I have proposed this field-gradient-induced path curvature to be the source
of photon-to-lepton conversion. If true, then it might be possible to make
your measurement 'outside' of 'normal' physics.

Andrew
________________________________________

On Mon, Jan 25, 2016 at 1:12 AM, Richard Gauthier <richgauthier at gmail.com>
wrote:

> Hello Vladimir and Chandra and all,
>
>   Yes, I definitely support the idea of the ether as material space, and
> that all physical particles are derived from this ether. This ether can
> also be called a plenum or Cosmic Tension Field.
>
>    I don’t however think that it is necessary to explain the inertial mass
> of particles in relation to a "coefficient of inertia” or "the amount of
> momentum the ether resists." I have shown (
> https://www.academia.edu/19652036/The_Origin_of_the_Electrons_Inertia )
> by a very simple derivation that the inertial mass m of an electron may be
> derived from the momentum of the circling photon in a circulating-photon
> model of the electron, whose circling photon has momentum mc where m =
> Eo/c^2 = hf/c^2 ,  where Eo is the rest energy 0.511 MeV of the electron
> and f is the frequency of the circulating photon in the resting electron.
> Secondly, in a similar way I derived a linearly moving photon's inertial
> mass to be M-inertial = hf/c^2 , where f is the photon’s frequency, even
> though a photon has zero rest mass. Thirdly, I derived the inertial mass of
> a relativistic electron, whose momentum is p=gamma mv, to be  M-inertial =
> gamma m , even though the moving electron's rest mass is m.
>
>    I present these  derivations below, taken from the academia.edu session
> on my electron inertia article at
> https://www.academia.edu/s/a26afd55e0?source=link :
>
> "One reason people don’t think that a photon has any inertial mass
> (because it has no rest mass) is that how do you get a photon to change its
> momentum (i.e. accelerate) in order to measure its inertial mass. It can’t
> go faster or slower than c in a vacuum, so it can’t accelerate in a linear
> direction, and in normal physics a photon doesn’t follow a curved path
> (except with gravity), which would make it possible to measure its
> centripetal acceleration c^2/R . But as I showed in my short electron
> inertia article at
> https://www.academia.edu/19652036/The_Origin_of_the_Electrons_Inertia ,
> the electron model in a resting electron has the photon going in a circle,
> with momentum mc and speed c, and the electron's inertial mass is then
> calculated to be M-inertial =(dp/dt)/Acentrifugal =wmc/(c^2/r)= m which is
> the inertial mass of the electron. But this calculation of the circling
> charged photon's inertial mass is independent of the radius of the charged
> photon’s circular orbit. Let that circular radius go towards infinity and
> you get a photon traveling in essentially a straight line, still having its
> inertial mass M =hf/c^2 (where the photon frequency f decreases as the
> radius of the circle increases) . So according to this logic, a linearly
> moving photon DOES have inertial mass M-inertial =hf/c^2 even though a
> photon has zero rest mass. And when a relativistic electron with momentum
> p=gamma mv travels in a circle with speed v, the inertial mass calculation
> above gives M-inertial = gamma m for a circling relativistic electron, and
> not just m the electron’s rest mass . Extending the radius here towards
> infinity also gives a linearly moving electron an inertial mass M = gamma m
> and not just the electron's rest mass m."
>
>       As far as I know these are all original derivations of the inertial
> mass of a resting electron, a photon and a relativistic electron based on a
> circulating photon model of an electron. I would be pleased to be shown
> otherwise.
>
>   Richard
>
> On Jan 24, 2016, at 6:42 AM, Roychoudhuri, Chandra <
> chandra.roychoudhuri at uconn.edu> wrote:
>
> Yes, Vlad, that is also my viewpoint.
> I do not remember whether I have attached this paper while communicating
> with you earlier. I call the “plenum” Cosmic Tension Field (CTF), to be
> descriptive in its essential properties.
> Chandra.
>
> *From:* General [
> mailto:general-bounces+chandra.roychoudhuri=uconn.edu at lists.natureoflightandparticles.org
> <general-bounces+chandra.roychoudhuri=uconn.edu at lists.natureoflightandparticles.org>
> ] *On Behalf Of *Vladimir Tamari
> *Sent:* Saturday, January 23, 2016 7:00 PM
> *To:* Nature of Light and Particles - General Discussion
> *Subject:* Re: [General] (no subject)
>
> Hi Richard
> I barge into your discussion without knowing your views on a "plenum
> field" but if it is an ether I definitely think there is one. A "coefficent
> of inertia" might be defined as the amount of momentum the ether resists.
> In a charged or gravitational field this coefficent would increase...I
> think of this in terms of my Beautiful Universe ether of dielectric nodes,
> except this may give the wrong idea it is something matter wades in.. not
> so. Matter and ether are made if the selfsame nodes of energy!
> Cheers
> Vladimir
>
> _____________________
> vladimirtamari.com
>
>
> On Jan 21, 2016, at 7:41 AM, Richard Gauthier <richgauthier at gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> Hi Hodge,
>     I don’t remember asking that. But if I did, I’m glad the question was
> helpful.
>    I’m thinking about inertia these days. Do you or others have any
> insights about its nature?
>          Richard
>
>
> On Jan 20, 2016, at 1:43 PM, Hodge John <jchodge at frontier.com> wrote:
>
> Richard Gauthier:
> You asked if the galaxy redshift, Pioneer anomaly, Pound--Rebka experiment
> model had a velocity term. I looked at redshift data for 1 galaxy and found
> no indication of a velocity term.
>
> I had not noticed this in the equations. Your suggestion that the plenum
> field can look like the Higgs field seems valid. That is, the acceleration
> of the plenum field looks like it adds energy (mass) is a Higgs Field
> characteristic. Thus, the plenum is closer to the idea of a quantum field
> and Higgs field (weak force).
>
> Thanks for the insight.
>
> Hodge
> _______________________________________________
> If you no longer wish to receive communication from the Nature of Light
> and Particles General Discussion List at richgauthier at gmail.com
> <a href="
> http://lists.natureoflightandparticles.org/options.cgi/general-natureoflightandparticles.org/richgauthier%40gmail.com?unsub=1&unsubconfirm=1
> ">
> Click here to unsubscribe
> </a>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> If you no longer wish to receive communication from the Nature of Light
> and Particles General Discussion List atvladimirtamari at hotmail.com
> <a href="
> http://lists.natureoflightandparticles.org/options.cgi/general-natureoflightandparticles.org/vladimirtamari%40hotmail.com?unsub=1&unsubconfirm=1
> ">
> Click here to unsubscribe
> </a>
>
> <2012.2_JMP_Space as real field.pdf>
> _______________________________________________
> If you no longer wish to receive communication from the Nature of Light
> and Particles General Discussion List at richgauthier at gmail.com
> <a href="
> http://lists.natureoflightandparticles.org/options.cgi/general-natureoflightandparticles.org/richgauthier%40gmail.com?unsub=1&unsubconfirm=1
> ">
> Click here to unsubscribe
> </a>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> If you no longer wish to receive communication from the Nature of Light
> and Particles General Discussion List at mules333 at gmail.com
> <a href="
> http://lists.natureoflightandparticles.org/options.cgi/general-natureoflightandparticles.org/mules333%40gmail.com?unsub=1&unsubconfirm=1
> ">
> Click here to unsubscribe
> </a>
>
>
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://lists.natureoflightandparticles.org/pipermail/general-natureoflightandparticles.org/attachments/20160125/ae78b605/attachment.htm>