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</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]--></head><body lang=EN-US link=blue vlink=purple><div class=WordSection1><p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:#444444'>Hello All,<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:#444444'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:#444444'>It was great meeting with all of you. <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:#444444'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:#444444'>I would like to introduce a different perspective to the discussion of the interaction of light with a thought experiment. Suppose that we have a billion small microwave antennas randomly distributed in space. The antennas on average are separated by a distance equal to about 10% of the wavelength that they will emit and the size of each antenna is much smaller than a wavelength. A billion of these antennas from a “cloud” about 100 wavelengths in diameter. If each antenna emits randomly, then the total cloud of antennas would emit an incoherent spherical emission pattern. However, if all antennas emit the same frequency and if the phase is properly controlled, then the emitted radiation can form a beam with a divergence angle of about 0.01 radian. Furthermore, the beam can be steered to propagate in any direction with proper phase adjustment. When the emission forms a coherent beam, then the cloud of antennas feels momentum in the opposite direction of the emitted radiation. This momentum would accelerate the cloud of antennas in the recoil direction.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:#444444'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:#444444'>The example just given is a simulation of what happens in a laser. Each atom in the excited state can either emit a photon by spontaneous emission or by stimulated emission. When stimulated emission occurs, the emission is still generally spherical, but the phase of emission is coordinated so that part of the spherical emission is coherently added to the beam causing the stimulated emission. The spherical emission of a single atom “interacts” with the other waves to form a collimated beam propagating in a particular direction. The force imparted to the emitting atom is random if the emission is spontaneous or in a particular direction if it is stimulated. <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:#444444'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:#444444'>In my way of looking at this, this example satisfies a loose definition of interaction of light waves. I assume that there might be a way of looking at this in which it can be argued that there was no interaction of waves, but this position will require stretching of definitions. <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:#444444'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:#444444'>John M.</span><span style='color:blue'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:blue'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div style='border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in'><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif'>From:</span></b><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif'> General [mailto:general-bounces+john=macken.com@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org] <b>On Behalf Of </b>David Mathes<br><b>Sent:</b> Friday, August 14, 2015 8:58 PM<br><b>To:</b> Nature of Light and Particles - General Discussion <general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org>; Andrew Meulenberg <mules333@gmail.com><br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [General] Light from Light reflection<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><div><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1439609808422_4409"><p class=MsoNormal style='background:white'><span style='font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black'>Andrew<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1439609808422_4410"><p class=MsoNormal style='background:white'><span style='font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1439609808422_4410"><p class=MsoNormal style='background:white'><span style='font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black'>One paper that might be of interest is:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1439609808422_4410"><p class=MsoNormal style='background:white'><span style='font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal style='background:white'><b><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black'><a href="http://arxiv.org/abs/1205.5897" title=Abstract id="yui_3_16_0_1_1439609808422_5064"><span style='text-decoration:none'>arXiv:1205.5897</span></a> [<a href="http://arxiv.org/pdf/1205.5897" title="Download PDF" id="yui_3_16_0_1_1439609808422_5066"><span style='text-decoration:none'>pdf</span></a>]</span></b><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1439609808422_5070"><div style='margin-top:3.0pt' id="yui_3_16_0_1_1439609808422_5072"><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in;mso-line-height-alt:16.2pt;background:white'><b><span style='font-size:18.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black'>Spin and Orbital Angular Momenta of Light Reflected from a Cone<o:p></o:p></span></b></p></div><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1439609808422_5074"><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in;line-height:14.05pt;background:white'><span style='font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black'><a href="http://arxiv.org/find/physics/1/au:+Mansuripur_M/0/1/0/all/0/1"><span style='text-decoration:none'>Masud Mansuripur</span></a>, <a href="http://arxiv.org/find/physics/1/au:+Zakharian_A/0/1/0/all/0/1" id="yui_3_16_0_1_1439609808422_5078"><span style='text-decoration:none'>Armis R. Zakharian</span></a>, <a href="http://arxiv.org/find/physics/1/au:+Wright_E/0/1/0/all/0/1" id="yui_3_16_0_1_1439609808422_5080"><span style='text-decoration:none'>Ewan M. Wright</span></a><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1439609808422_4412"><p class=MsoNormal style='background:white'><span style='font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black'>Another paper is:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1439609808422_4412"><p class=MsoNormal style='background:white'><span style='font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1439609808422_4412"><p class=MsoNormal style='background:white'><span style='font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black'>Fearn 2012 <a href="http://arxiv.org/abs/1212.4469" id="yui_3_16_0_1_1439609808422_4533">[1212.4469] Radiation Reaction Force on a Particle</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1439609808422_4412"><p class=MsoNormal style='background:white'><span style='font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1439609808422_4412"><p class=MsoNormal style='background:white'><span style='font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1439609808422_4412"><p class=MsoNormal style='background:white'><span style='font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black'>David<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1439609808422_4412"><p class=MsoNormal style='background:white'><span style='font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1439609808422_4412"><p class=MsoNormal style='background:white'><span style='font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1439609808422_4412"><p class=MsoNormal style='background:white'><span style='font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1439609808422_4412"><p class=MsoNormal style='background:white'><span style='font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #1010FF 1.5pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 4.0pt;margin-left:3.75pt;margin-top:3.75pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt' id="yui_3_16_0_1_1439609808422_4306"><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1439609808422_4305"><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1439609808422_4304"><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1439609808422_4392"><p class=MsoNormal style='background:white'><span style='font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1439609808422_4392"><p class=MsoNormal style='background:white'><span style='font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1439609808422_4392"><p class=MsoNormal style='background:white'><span style='font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1439609808422_4392"><p class=MsoNormal style='background:white'><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>From:</span></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'> Andrew Meulenberg <<a href="mailto:mules333@gmail.com">mules333@gmail.com</a>><br><b>To:</b> Nature of Light and Particles - General Discussion <<a href="mailto:general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org">general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org</a>>; Andrew Meulenberg <<a href="mailto:mules333@gmail.com">mules333@gmail.com</a>> <br><b id="yui_3_16_0_1_1439609808422_4530">Sent:</b> Friday, August 14, 2015 8:36 PM<br><b id="yui_3_16_0_1_1439609808422_4528">Subject:</b> Re: [General] Light from Light reflection</span><span style='font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1439609808422_4303"><p class=MsoNormal style='background:white'><span style='font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div id=yiv1131972355><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1439609808422_4302"><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1439609808422_4367"><p class=MsoNormal style='background:white'><span style='font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black'>Forgot the paper.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt;background:white'><span style='font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div id=yiv1131972355yqt51578><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1439609808422_4301"><p class=MsoNormal style='background:white'><span style='font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1439609808422_4300"><p class=MsoNormal style='background:white'><span style='font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black'>On Fri, Aug 14, 2015 at 11:33 PM, Andrew Meulenberg <<a href="mailto:mules333@gmail.com" target="_blank">mules333@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br><br><o:p></o:p></span></p><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0in'><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1439609808422_4309"><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1439609808422_4308"><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1439609808422_4307"><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt;background:white'><span style='font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black'>Gentlemen,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt;background:white'><span style='font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black'>In discussions after Bob Hudgins' presentation on Wednesday, I realized that we had been too close to the problem (and solution) and did not recognize the information gap that existed within the community. The reference was with regards to the nature of light-light interaction. The paper by Dowling (attached) identifies the problem between the NIW school and the light-light interaction school.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal style='background:white'><span style='font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black'>It is necessary to emphasize and clarify some points.<br><br><o:p></o:p></span></p><ol start=1 type=1><li class=MsoNormal style='color:black;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo1;background:white' id="yui_3_16_0_1_1439609808422_5193"><span style='font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'>Dowling proposed that IDENTICAL waves interact. However, <o:p></o:p></span></li><li class=MsoNormal style='color:black;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo1;background:white' id="yui_3_16_0_1_1439609808422_5353"><span style='font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'>he was unable to PROVE reflection, rather than transmission.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class=MsoNormal style='color:black;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo1;background:white' id="yui_3_16_0_1_1439609808422_5354"><span style='font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'>Mathematically the results are identical.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class=MsoNormal style='color:black;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo1;background:white' id="yui_3_16_0_1_1439609808422_5171"><span style='font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'>In Dowling's paper, he demonstrates that even identical <b>components</b> of colliding waves have this property.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class=MsoNormal style='color:black;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo1;background:white' id="yui_3_16_0_1_1439609808422_5173"><span style='font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'>The difference of the colliding waves always is transmitted, not reflected.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class=MsoNormal style='color:black;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo1;background:white' id="yui_3_16_0_1_1439609808422_5174"><span style='font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'>Therefore, when added to the identical portion (that is the reflected part), the sum becomes equivalent to a transmitted wave.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class=MsoNormal style='color:black;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo1;background:white' id="yui_3_16_0_1_1439609808422_5175"><span style='font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'>The paper showed that the differences could be in:<o:p></o:p></span></li></ol><ol start=7 type=1 id="yui_3_16_0_1_1439609808422_5177"><ol start=1 type=1><li class=MsoNormal style='color:black;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;mso-list:l0 level2 lfo1;background:white' id="yui_3_16_0_1_1439609808422_5176"><span style='font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'>phase<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class=MsoNormal style='color:black;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;mso-list:l0 level2 lfo1;background:white' id="yui_3_16_0_1_1439609808422_5178"><span style='font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'>amplitude<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class=MsoNormal style='color:black;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;mso-list:l0 level2 lfo1;background:white' id="yui_3_16_0_1_1439609808422_5184"><span style='font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'>polarity<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class=MsoNormal style='color:black;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;mso-list:l0 level2 lfo1;background:white' id="yui_3_16_0_1_1439609808422_5185"><span style='font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'>change in frequency<o:p></o:p></span></li></ol></ol><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1439609808422_5188"><p class=MsoNormal style='background:white'><span style='font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black'>Thus, while Chandra's NIW view is almost always correct, if based on numbers alone, there is a growing field (based on lasers), which proves that interaction of identical light goes beyond Dirac's statement that photons can only interact with themselves. With this new information, it is possible to view ordinary light from a different perspective. "Any identical portions of light beams can (and will) reflect from each other." <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1439609808422_5187"><p class=MsoNormal style='background:white'><span style='font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black'>An example of this can be demonstrated by an introductory-physics device (Newton's cradle, <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Momentum#Conservation" target="_blank">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Momentum#Conservation</a> ). Only if equal numbers of balls are dropped simultaneously will there be reflection of the same number as the input. If unequal numbers are dropped simultaneously, then it would appear that the larger number of balls is transmitted thru the set of balls. No one would say that the balls travel thru the stationary balls. Momentum reflection is the obvious answer in this case - and in the case of light. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1439609808422_5192"><p class=MsoNormal style='background:white'><span style='font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black'>Had Dowling remembered this demonstration, he would have been able to say with absolute authority that light can reflect from light. The appendix of our paper is a mathematical proof of the null-momentum point in the center of the 'dark' zone for equal waves. This is the wave equivalent of the equal-particle demonstration.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1439609808422_5191"><p class=MsoNormal style='background:white'><span style='font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black'>My task for the next conference may be to demonstrate how this reflection effect affects the photon structure within the electron.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1439609808422_5190"><p class=MsoNormal style='background:white'><span style='font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black'>Andrew<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></blockquote></div><p class=MsoNormal style='background:white'><span style='font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div></div></div></div><p class=MsoNormal style='background:white'><span style='font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div id=yqt99064><p class=MsoNormal style='background:white'><span style='font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black'>_______________________________________________<br>If you no longer wish to receive communication from the Nature of Light and Particles General Discussion List at <a href="mailto:davidmathes8@yahoo.com">davidmathes8@yahoo.com</a><br><a href="<a href="http://lists.natureoflightandparticles.org/options.cgi/general-natureoflightandparticles.org/davidmathes8%40yahoo.com?unsub=1&unsubconfirm=1" target="_blank" id="yui_3_16_0_1_1439609808422_5383">http://lists.natureoflightandparticles.org/options.cgi/general-natureoflightandparticles.org/davidmathes8%40yahoo.com?unsub=1&unsubconfirm=1</a>"><br>Click here to unsubscribe<br></a><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt;background:white'><span style='font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div></div></div></blockquote></div></div></body></html>