<html><body><div style="color:#000; background-color:#fff; font-family:HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif;font-size:16px"><div><span>John W</span></div><div><span><br></span></div><div><span>So we are left to conclude that there is a root photon with all sorts of types of photons possible through conditioning, constraints, and confinement. However, charge is the only enabler of morphing from one state to another whether it be photon to photon or photon to particle, electron in particular.</span></div><div><span><br></span></div><div><span>Should we count the ways?</span></div><div><span><br></span></div><div><span>David </span></div><br> <blockquote style="border-left: 2px solid rgb(16, 16, 255); margin-left: 5px; margin-top: 5px; padding-left: 5px;" id="yui_3_16_0_1_1439791077986_3273"> <div style="font-family: HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif; font-size: 16px;" id="yui_3_16_0_1_1439791077986_3272"> <div style="font-family: HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif; font-size: 16px;" id="yui_3_16_0_1_1439791077986_3271"> <div dir="ltr" id="yui_3_16_0_1_1439791077986_3270"> <hr size="1"> <font size="2" face="Arial" id="yui_3_16_0_1_1439791077986_3561"> <b><span style="font-weight:bold;">From:</span></b> John Williamson <John.Williamson@glasgow.ac.uk><br> <b><span style="font-weight: bold;">To:</span></b> Nature of Light and Particles - General Discussion <general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org> <br><b><span style="font-weight: bold;">Cc:</span></b> Nick Bailey <nick@bailey-family.org.uk>; Anthony Booth <abooth@ieee.org>; Kyran Williamson <kyran_williamson@hotmail.com>; Manohar . <manohar_berlin@hotmail.com>; Joakim Pettersson <joakimbits@gmail.com>; Ariane Mandray <ariane.mandray@wanadoo.fr> <br> <b><span style="font-weight: bold;">Sent:</span></b> Sunday, August 16, 2015 10:34 PM<br> <b><span style="font-weight: bold;">Subject:</span></b> Re: [General] Light from Light reflection<br> </font> </div> <div class="y_msg_container" id="yui_3_16_0_1_1439791077986_3276"><br><div id="yiv1709684791">
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<div class="yiv1709684791MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt;" id="yui_3_16_0_1_1439791077986_3338"><span style="" lang="EN-US">Dear all,</span></div>
<div class="yiv1709684791MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt;" id="yui_3_16_0_1_1439791077986_3567"><span style="" lang="EN-US" id="yui_3_16_0_1_1439791077986_3566">Before this degenerates into a free-for-all of wishful thinking – Al is spot-on.
At least to a very (very) good approximation. Experimentally, pretty much all the action takes place right next to (existing) charges. Even then, there pretty much needs to be at least two of them to get the coupling to photons (hence Al saying H2 in place
of e or P). Even near particles, notwithstanding the stupid numbers bandied about for the “energy” of the vacuum, the radiative corrections (due to virtual particles jumping about in the vacuum) are miniscule. In probability terms, to first order (usually
called zero’th order), the main interaction (a la Maxwell) gives you a probabilty factor of 1/137 for the emitter, 1/137 for the absorber and then the usual geometric effects giving inverse square. The corrections introduce an extra 1/137 squared AND give
you evanescent attenuation (exponential attenuation then) and all that to cope with their virtuality etc. Maxwells equations are very (very) under-constrained as they stand. They allow things to go not only in straight lines (our usual conception), but also
spheres, disks, cylinders, toroids, bispheres, parallel-plate capacitors (solved by Maxwell, conformally), twisted wave-guides … pretty much a spastic hamburger provided it is conformal and orthonormal so that the definition of div, grad and curl can be achieved
at a point. That is all you need. Just as well because that is all you have. You may hope that QED would fix this but this is a vain hope: QED only operates at all very near to the (point) particles it presumes. All the action is in charge-charge inter-actions.
That something was emitted and subsequently absorbed in an “event” is a-postiori. One can only say, a-priori, something about the probability (as Hans commented) of such an event occurring over-all. Even a-postiori one can only talk about the possible<a rel="nofollow" name="_GoBack" href=""></a>
paths allowed point-to-point by your world-view – your model.</span></div>
<div class="yiv1709684791MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt;"><span style="" lang="EN-US">Phased arrays (the sort of thing John M. was talking about) are not just theoretical
ideas. They are used, and have been used, in engineering applications, for decades to either send out or detect directed light (or radio waves more usually). One is still inter-acting with charges – albeit collectively – when one talks about such systems.
The coherence (and the constraints) is in the engineered system.</span></div>
<div class="yiv1709684791MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt;"><span style="" lang="EN-US">If you want to go further than this you need to go beyond Maxwell and QED. Not only
this but you need to able to point to, either existing experiment that is only explained by your new paradigm, or propose proper experiment to test it. Otherwise it is not real.</span></div>
<div class="yiv1709684791MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt;"><span style="" lang="EN-US">My extra constraints of “absolute relativity”, do constrain light to come in “lumps”
over any distance, but do not constrain an axis – it still could be anything (or everything at once!) provided the fixed-parameters of the emission and absorption are satisfied. It does not predict light must go in linear lines, but rather that non-quantised
photons (or differently quantized photons) should also exist if one can manipulate the emitter and absorber into suitable collective systems.</span></div>
<div class="yiv1709684791MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt;"><span style="" lang="EN-US"> </span></div>
<div class="yiv1709684791MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt;"><span style="" lang="EN-US">Regards, John W.</span></div>
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<div style="direction:ltr;" id="yiv1709684791divRpF738111"><font face="Tahoma" color="#000000" size="2"><b>From:</b> General [general-bounces+john.williamson=glasgow.ac.uk@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org] on behalf of af.kracklauer@web.de [af.kracklauer@web.de]<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Monday, August 17, 2015 2:16 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org<br>
<b>Cc:</b> Nature of Light and Particles<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [General] Light from Light reflection<br>
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<div>Hi all:</div>
<div> </div>
<div>Wave interaction (i.e., mutual modification of each other) only ocurrs where and when they meet at a charge, which can be in a cavity wall, mirror, lens, detector element, antenna, H2 in deep space, etc.. THERE IS NO WAY TO EMPIRICALLY TELL WHAT AN IMAGINED
WAVE IS DOING WHERE THERE IS NO CHARGE, even while Maxwell's equs. describe propagation sucessessfully in terms of what shows up at charges.</div>
<div> </div>
<div>Here again, I'm just the mail man---Maxwell is talking.</div>
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<div style="margin:0 0 10px 0;"><b>Gesendet:</b> Samstag, 15. August 2015 um 19:17 Uhr<br>
<b>Von:</b> "John Macken" <john@macken.com><br>
<b>An:</b> "Nature of Light and Particles" <general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org><br>
<b>Betreff:</b> Re: [General] Light from Light reflection</div>
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<div class="yiv1709684791MsoNormal"><span style="color:blue;">David and A. F.,</span></div>
<div class="yiv1709684791MsoNormal"><span style="color:blue;"> </span></div>
<div class="yiv1709684791MsoNormal"><span style="color:blue;">First I will answer David. You say that “</span><span style="color:black;">conservation of momentum needs to be conserved both externally
<i>and internally”</i></span><span style="color:blue;">. It appears as if you are referring to angular momentum when you say “internally”. I agree that both types of momentum must be conserved and they are independent of each other. When discussing the linear
momentum imparted to an atom or microwave antenna, it is possible to ignore angular momentum. The angular momentum can never mask the linear momentum that must be conserved. Similarly, it is possible to ignore linear momentum transfer when discussing angular
momentum transfer.</span></div>
<div class="yiv1709684791MsoNormal"><span style="color:blue;"> </span></div>
<div class="yiv1709684791MsoNormal"><span style="color:blue;">A.F. Kracklauer brings up an interesting point that I missed previously. He says, “</span>Isn't it the charges in the laser interacting, not the emitted photons?<span style="color:blue;">” One of the reasons that
I partially qualified my previous answer is because there is some interaction between the spherical waves being emitted in the opposite direction to the wave propagation direction and the charges in the atoms. In a laser oscillator, standing waves are formed
because there is propagation in both directions. However, in an laser amplifier the “propagating waves” are only propagating in one direction. Still any one atom is emitting waves in all directions. It is the waves with a backwards component that is imparting
momentum to the other atoms. Similarly, the microwave antennas are emitting waves in all directions and it is the backwards propagating components that are imparting momentum to other atoms.</span></div>
<div class="yiv1709684791MsoNormal"><span style="color:blue;"> </span></div>
<div class="yiv1709684791MsoNormal"><span style="color:blue;">However, this does not destroy the main point. It is the phased emission of spherical waves that results in a small component of the spherical wave coherently adding to the other waves. The intensity is amplitude
squared which results in the well-defined laser beam or well-defined microwave beam. Therefore, in my view this is an example of the interaction of waves.</span></div>
<div class="yiv1709684791MsoNormal"><span style="color:blue;"> </span></div>
<div class="yiv1709684791MsoNormal"><span style="color:blue;">On a related subject, I do not understand how it is possible to claim that photons only interact with themselves. When two different laser beams are superimposed in a beam splitter, the output beams are amplitude
modulated at the beat frequency between the two laser beams. I used to work with laser radar systems and this was a daily occurrence. The two different lasers clearly are generating different photons, yet they interact with each other when they are combined.
Even if the two beams from two lasers merely overlap with no beam splitter, the beat signal can be seen if a small detector is inserted into the region where the beams overlap. For greatest signal, the area of a detector must be small enough that it only
intercepts one interference fringe. Another alternative is to mask the detector so that it sees multiple fringes but only sees either the even or odd numbered fringes. One of my better patents is based on this principle.</span></div>
<div class="yiv1709684791MsoNormal"><span style="color:blue;"> </span></div>
<div class="yiv1709684791MsoNormal"><span style="color:blue;">Finally, I would like to comment on the transfer of angular momentum (David’s internal momentum). I once did a calculation where I looked at the torque force that needed to be exerted on a carbon monoxide molecule
to transfer the h bar angular momentum at the CO molecule’s fundamental rotational frequency. I do not remember the exact answer, but the torque momentum that needed to be transferred to the CO molecule to accomplish the angular momentum transfer was about
1,000,000 times greater than the linear momentum transferred if it was assumed that the torque was exerted over the radius of the CO molecule. It only made sense if you assumed an interaction radius equal to an object that was one wavelength in circumference.
This is the same area as the interaction cross-section that Chandra mentioned for an atom or molecule to absorption of a photon.
</span></div>
<div class="yiv1709684791MsoNormal"><span style="color:blue;"> </span></div>
<div class="yiv1709684791MsoNormal"><span style="color:blue;">I suspect that even linearly polarized photons have a wave structure that carries a specific angular momentum as orbital angular momentum. It requires a special type of experiment to prove or disprove this contention.
</span></div>
<div class="yiv1709684791MsoNormal"><span style="color:blue;"> </span></div>
<div class="yiv1709684791MsoNormal"><span style="color:blue;">John M. </span></div>
<div class="yiv1709684791MsoNormal"><span style="color:blue;"> </span></div>
<div class="yiv1709684791MsoNormal"><span style="color:blue;"> </span></div>
<div class="yiv1709684791MsoNormal"><span style="color:blue;"> </span></div>
<div class="yiv1709684791MsoNormal"><span style="color:blue;"> </span></div>
<div class="yiv1709684791MsoNormal"><span style="color:blue;"> </span></div>
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<div class="yiv1709684791MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri , sans-serif;">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri , sans-serif;"> General [mailto:general-bounces+john=macken.com@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org]
<b>On Behalf Of </b>David Mathes<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Saturday, August 15, 2015 12:34 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Nature of Light and Particles - General Discussion <general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [General] Light from Light reflection</span></div>
</div>
</div>
<div class="yiv1709684791MsoNormal"> </div>
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<div class="yiv1709684791MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;color:black;">John</span></div>
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<div class="yiv1709684791MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;color:black;"> </span></div>
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<div id="yiv1709684791yui_3_16_0_1_1439666383354_4207">
<div class="yiv1709684791MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="color:black;">For any particle - mass or massless - conservation of momentum needs to be conserved both externally
<i>and internally</i>. </span></div>
</div>
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<div class="yiv1709684791MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;color:black;"> </span></div>
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<div id="yiv1709684791yui_3_16_0_1_1439666383354_4207">
<div class="yiv1709684791MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="color:black;">Internal particle absorption of the recoil means one needs to attend to the
<i id="yiv1709684791yui_3_16_0_1_1439666383354_4518">coupling between internal and external systems</i> to provide a clear picture of linear and angular momentum conservation.</span></div>
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<div class="yiv1709684791MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;color:black;"> </span></div>
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<div class="yiv1709684791MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;color:black;">David</span></div>
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<div class="yiv1709684791MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial , sans-serif;color:black;">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial , sans-serif;color:black;"> John Macken <</span><a rel="nofollow" href=""><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial , sans-serif;">john@macken.com</span></a><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial , sans-serif;color:black;">><br>
<b>To:</b> Nature of Light and Particles <</span><a rel="nofollow" href=""><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial , sans-serif;">general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org</span></a><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial , sans-serif;color:black;">><br>
<b>Sent:</b> Saturday, August 15, 2015 12:28 PM<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [General] Light from Light reflection</span></div>
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<div class="yiv1709684791MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;color:black;"> </span></div>
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<div class="yiv1709684791MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;color:blue;">David,</span></div>
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<div class="yiv1709684791MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;color:blue;">I did not read all the article, but I read enough to conclude that it does not repeal the conservation of momentum. If a photon is emitted, it is carrying
away momentum. The emitting body must absorb the opposite moment. If the emitting body is an isolated atom, then the recoiling atom has de Broglie waves with exactly the same wavelength (same momentum) as the emitted photon when observed from the atom’s
original frame of reference.</span></div>
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<div class="yiv1709684791MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;color:blue;">However, this is somewhat off the major point which was that the interaction of waves can determine the direction of emission of a photon’s quantized energy.
In my way of looking at this, it is an example of waves interacting. </span></div>
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<div class="yiv1709684791MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;color:blue;">John M.
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<div class="yiv1709684791MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;color:black;">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;color:black;"> General [</span><a rel="nofollow" href=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;">mailto:general-bounces+john=macken.com@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org</span></a><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;color:black;">]
<b>On Behalf Of </b>David Mathes<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Saturday, August 15, 2015 11:57 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Nature of Light and Particles - General Discussion <</span><a rel="nofollow" href=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;">general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org</span></a><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;color:black;">><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [General] Light from Light reflection</span></div>
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<div class="yiv1709684791MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;color:black;">John M</span></div>
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<div class="yiv1709684791MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;color:black;">The method you propose is classical not in keeping with recent papers on radiation reaction, most notably a relativistic approach as derived by Fearn
2012 (one of Miloni's students now a professor)</span></div>
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<div class="yiv1709684791MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><a rel="nofollow" target="_blank" href="http://arxiv.org/abs/1212.4469"><span style="font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;">http://arxiv.org/abs/1212.4469</span></a></div>
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<div class="yiv1709684791MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;color:black;">The 3D amorphous phased array is a great gendanken. 2D phased arrays are well known. However, 3D optical arrays suffer from all sorts of fields, masses
and energy transfers as well as dispersion issues. The reason folks like the laser is due in part to the non-linearity effects that can be produced. </span></div>
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<div class="yiv1709684791MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;color:black;">Furthermore, any approach may not produce a visible recoil since conservation of momentum needs to be conserved both externally and internally to a particle.
Internal particle effects may "absorb" the recoil whether at the atomic or elementary particle level. So one needs to attend to both linear and angular momentum conservation.</span></div>
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<div class="yiv1709684791MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;color:black;">Add to this is the potential associated with certain models using scalar fields, and one ends up in GR where the speed of light is lower within the amorphous
array for whatever reason. </span></div>
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<div class="yiv1709684791MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;color:black;"> </span></div>
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<div class="yiv1709684791MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;color:black;">Finally, there is the question of NIH vs interference, especially at light like velocities.</span></div>
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<div class="yiv1709684791MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;color:black;">Other than that, a great idea!</span></div>
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<div class="yiv1709684791MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;color:black;">David</span></div>
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<blockquote style="border:none;border-left:solid rgb(16,16,255) 1.5pt;padding:0.0in 0.0in 0.0in 4.0pt;margin-left:3.75pt;margin-top:3.75pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt;">
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<div class="yiv1709684791MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;color:black;">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;color:black;"> John Macken <</span><a rel="nofollow" href=""><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;">john@macken.com</span></a><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;color:black;">><br>
<b>To:</b> Nature of Light and Particles <</span><a rel="nofollow" href=""><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;">general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org</span></a><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;color:black;">><br>
<b>Sent:</b> Saturday, August 15, 2015 9:50 AM<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [General] Light from Light reflection</span></div>
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<div class="yiv1709684791MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;color:black;">Hello All,</span></div>
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<div class="yiv1709684791MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;color:black;">It was great meeting with all of you.
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<div class="yiv1709684791MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;color:black;">I would like to introduce a different perspective to the discussion of the interaction of light with a thought experiment. Suppose that we have a billion
small microwave antennas randomly distributed in space. The antennas on average are separated by a distance equal to about 10% of the wavelength that they will emit and the size of each antenna is much smaller than a wavelength. A billion of these antennas
from a “cloud” about 100 wavelengths in diameter. If each antenna emits randomly, then the total cloud of antennas would emit an incoherent spherical emission pattern. However, if all antennas emit the same frequency and if the phase is properly controlled,
then the emitted radiation can form a beam with a divergence angle of about 0.01 radian. Furthermore, the beam can be steered to propagate in any direction with proper phase adjustment. When the emission forms a coherent beam, then the cloud of antennas
feels momentum in the opposite direction of the emitted radiation. This momentum would accelerate the cloud of antennas in the recoil direction.</span></div>
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<div class="yiv1709684791MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;color:black;">The example just given is a simulation of what happens in a laser. Each atom in the excited state can either emit a photon by spontaneous emission or
by stimulated emission. When stimulated emission occurs, the emission is still generally spherical, but the phase of emission is coordinated so that part of the spherical emission is coherently added to the beam causing the stimulated emission. The spherical
emission of a single atom “interacts” with the other waves to form a collimated beam propagating in a particular direction. The force imparted to the emitting atom is random if the emission is spontaneous or in a particular direction if it is stimulated.
</span></div>
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<div class="yiv1709684791MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;color:black;">In my way of looking at this, this example satisfies a loose definition of interaction of light waves. I assume that there might be a way of looking
at this in which it can be argued that there was no interaction of waves, but this position will require stretching of definitions.
</span></div>
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<div class="yiv1709684791MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;color:black;">John M.</span></div>
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<div class="yiv1709684791MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;color:black;">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;color:black;"> General [</span><a rel="nofollow" href=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;">mailto:general-bounces+john=macken.com@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org</span></a><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;color:black;">]
<b>On Behalf Of </b>David Mathes<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Friday, August 14, 2015 8:58 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Nature of Light and Particles - General Discussion <</span><a rel="nofollow" href=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;">general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org</span></a><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;color:black;">>;
Andrew Meulenberg <</span><a rel="nofollow" href=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;">mules333@gmail.com</span></a><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;color:black;">><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [General] Light from Light reflection</span></div>
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<div class="yiv1709684791MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;color:black;">Andrew</span></div>
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<div class="yiv1709684791MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;color:black;">One paper that might be of interest is:</span></div>
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<div class="yiv1709684791MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><a rel="nofollow" target="_blank" href="http://arxiv.org/abs/1205.5897" id="yiv1709684791yui_3_16_0_1_1439609808422_5064" title="Abstract"><b><span style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;text-decoration:none;">arXiv:1205.5897</span></b></a><b><span style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;color:black;"> [</span></b><a rel="nofollow" target="_blank" href="http://arxiv.org/pdf/1205.5897" id="yiv1709684791yui_3_16_0_1_1439609808422_5066" title="Download PDF"><b><span style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;text-decoration:none;">pdf</span></b></a><b><span style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;color:black;">]</span></b></div>
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<div class="yiv1709684791MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><b><span style="font-size:18.0pt;font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;color:black;">Spin and Orbital Angular Momenta of Light Reflected from a Cone</span></b></div>
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<div class="yiv1709684791MsoNormal" style="line-height:14.05pt;background:white;"><a rel="nofollow" target="_blank" href="http://arxiv.org/find/physics/1/au:+Mansuripur_M/0/1/0/all/0/1"><span style="font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;text-decoration:none;">Masud Mansuripur</span></a><span style="font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;color:black;">, </span><a rel="nofollow" target="_blank" href="http://arxiv.org/find/physics/1/au:+Zakharian_A/0/1/0/all/0/1" id="yiv1709684791yui_3_16_0_1_1439609808422_5078"><span style="font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;text-decoration:none;">Armis
R. Zakharian</span></a><span style="font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;color:black;">, </span><a rel="nofollow" target="_blank" href="http://arxiv.org/find/physics/1/au:+Wright_E/0/1/0/all/0/1" id="yiv1709684791yui_3_16_0_1_1439609808422_5080"><span style="font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;text-decoration:none;">Ewan
M. Wright</span></a></div>
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<div class="yiv1709684791MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;color:black;">Another paper is:</span></div>
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<div class="yiv1709684791MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;color:black;">Fearn 2012 </span><a rel="nofollow" target="_blank" href="http://arxiv.org/abs/1212.4469" id="yiv1709684791yui_3_16_0_1_1439609808422_4533"><span style="font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;">[1212.4469]
Radiation Reaction Force on a Particle</span></a></div>
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<div class="yiv1709684791MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;color:black;">David</span></div>
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<div class="yiv1709684791MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;color:black;">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;color:black;"> Andrew Meulenberg <</span><a rel="nofollow" href=""><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;">mules333@gmail.com</span></a><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;color:black;">><br>
<b>To:</b> Nature of Light and Particles - General Discussion <</span><a rel="nofollow" href=""><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;">general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org</span></a><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;color:black;">>;
Andrew Meulenberg <</span><a rel="nofollow" href=""><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;">mules333@gmail.com</span></a><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;color:black;">><br>
<b id="yiv1709684791yui_3_16_0_1_1439609808422_4530">Sent:</b> Friday, August 14, 2015 8:36 PM<br>
<b id="yiv1709684791yui_3_16_0_1_1439609808422_4528">Subject:</b> Re: [General] Light from Light reflection</span></div>
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<div class="yiv1709684791MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;color:black;">Forgot the paper.</span></div>
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<div class="yiv1709684791MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;color:black;">On Fri, Aug 14, 2015 at 11:33 PM, Andrew Meulenberg <</span><a rel="nofollow" href=""><span style="font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;">mules333@gmail.com</span></a><span style="font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;color:black;">>
wrote:</span></div>
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<div class="yiv1709684791MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;color:black;">Gentlemen,</span></div>
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<div class="yiv1709684791MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;color:black;">In discussions after Bob Hudgins' presentation on Wednesday, I realized that we had been too close to the problem (and solution) and did not recognize
the information gap that existed within the community. The reference was with regards to the nature of light-light interaction. The paper by Dowling (attached) identifies the problem between the NIW school and the light-light interaction school.</span></div>
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<div class="yiv1709684791MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;color:black;">It is necessary to emphasize and clarify some points.</span></div>
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<span style="font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;">Dowling proposed that IDENTICAL waves interact. However,
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<span style="font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;">he was unable to PROVE reflection, rather than transmission.</span>
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<span style="font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;">Mathematically the results are identical.</span>
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<span style="font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;">In Dowling's paper, he demonstrates that even identical
<b>components</b> of colliding waves have this property.</span> </li><li class="yiv1709684791MsoNormal" id="yiv1709684791yui_3_16_0_1_1439609808422_5173" style="color:black;background:white;">
<span style="font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;">The difference of the colliding waves always is transmitted, not reflected.</span>
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<span style="font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;">Therefore, when added to the identical portion (that is the reflected part), the sum becomes equivalent to a transmitted wave.</span>
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<span style="font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;">The paper showed that the differences could be in:</span>
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<span style="font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;">phase</span> </li><li class="yiv1709684791MsoNormal" id="yiv1709684791yui_3_16_0_1_1439609808422_5178" style="color:black;background:white;">
<span style="font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;">amplitude</span> </li><li class="yiv1709684791MsoNormal" id="yiv1709684791yui_3_16_0_1_1439609808422_5184" style="color:black;background:white;">
<span style="font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;">polarity</span> </li><li class="yiv1709684791MsoNormal" id="yiv1709684791yui_3_16_0_1_1439609808422_5185" style="color:black;background:white;">
<span style="font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;">change in frequency</span> </li></ol>
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<div class="yiv1709684791MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;color:black;">Thus, while Chandra's NIW view is almost always correct, if based on numbers alone, there is a growing field (based on lasers), which proves that interaction
of identical light goes beyond Dirac's statement that photons can only interact with themselves. With this new information, it is possible to view ordinary light from a different perspective. "Any identical portions of light beams can (and will) reflect from
each other." </span></div>
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<div class="yiv1709684791MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;color:black;">An example of this can be demonstrated by an introductory-physics device (Newton's cradle,
</span><a rel="nofollow" target="_blank" href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Momentum#Conservation"><span style="font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Momentum#Conservation</span></a><span style="font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;color:black;">
). Only if equal numbers of balls are dropped simultaneously will there be reflection of the same number as the input. If unequal numbers are dropped simultaneously, then it would appear that the larger number of balls is transmitted thru the set of balls.
No one would say that the balls travel thru the stationary balls. Momentum reflection is the obvious answer in this case - and in the case of light.
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<div class="yiv1709684791MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;color:black;">Had Dowling remembered this demonstration, he would have been able to say with absolute authority that light can reflect from light. The appendix of our
paper is a mathematical proof of the null-momentum point in the center of the 'dark' zone for equal waves. This is the wave equivalent of the equal-particle demonstration.</span></div>
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<div class="yiv1709684791MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="font-family:Helvetica , sans-serif;color:black;">My task for the next conference may be to demonstrate how this reflection effect affects the photon structure within the electron.</span></div>
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