<html><head><meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html charset=utf-8"></head><body style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space;" class=""><div class="">Hello Albrecht,</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class=""> Thank you for your clarification. But I understand that no violation of the standard model has been found so far in this regard. Is that correct? Does the success of your electron model depend on an experimental violation of the standard model, allowing electrons to be affected by the strong nuclear force? And if such an experimental violation of the standard model is found, why would such a finding support your electron model? Please explain this briefly. Thanks.</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class=""> Richard</div><br class=""><div><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div class="">On Oct 16, 2015, at 12:54 PM, Dr. Albrecht Giese <<a href="mailto:genmail@a-giese.de" class="">genmail@a-giese.de</a>> wrote:</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><div class="">
<meta content="text/html; charset=utf-8" http-equiv="Content-Type" class="">
<div text="#000000" bgcolor="#FFFFFF" class="">
Hello Richard,<br class="">
<br class="">
sorry, this was imprecise wording. Of course there is (deep)
inelastic scattering possible between leptons and quarks. But if in
this case new particles are generated, then, according to the
Standard Model, the number of leptons and of quarks in not changed.
So, if there are additional leptons, then those are pairs of leptons
and anti-leptons. The same for quarks. The violation of the SM
addressed here means that, in this summary, additional leptons or
quarks are generated, or leptons are replaced with quarks and vice
versa. <br class="">
<br class="">
Leptoquarks, if existent, could explain why this happens.<br class="">
<br class="">
Albrecht<br class="">
<br class="">
<br class="">
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">Am 16.10.2015 um 18:52 schrieb Richard
Gauthier:<br class="">
</div>
<blockquote cite="mid:E13A074D-0A38-421F-A6B7-D2231815F288@gmail.com" type="cite" class="">
<meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=utf-8" class="">
<div class="">Hello Albrecht,</div>
<div class="">Please refer to the wikipedia article on deep
inelastic scattering at <a moz-do-not-send="true" href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deep_inelastic_scattering" class="">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deep_inelastic_scattering</a> and
its concluding sentence "<span style="color: rgb(37, 37, 37);
font-family: sans-serif; font-size: 14px; line-height: 22px;
background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);" class="">The
experiments were important because, not only did they confirm
the physical reality of quarks but also proved again that the
Standard Model was the correct avenue of research for particle
physicists to pursue"</span> . But you say "<span style="background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);" class=""><font class="" size="3" face="HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue,
Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif">Such
interactions are excluded in the Standard Model of particle
physics." </font></span></div>
<div class=""><span style="font-family: HelveticaNeue, 'Helvetica
Neue', Helvetica, Arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif;
font-size: 16px; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);" class=""><br class="">
</span></div>
<div class=""><span style="font-family: HelveticaNeue, 'Helvetica
Neue', Helvetica, Arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif;
font-size: 16px; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);" class="">How can I reconcile these two seemingly contradictory
statements? </span></div>
<div class=""><span style="font-family: HelveticaNeue, 'Helvetica
Neue', Helvetica, Arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif;
font-size: 16px; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);" class=""> Richard</span></div>
<div class=""><span style="font-family: HelveticaNeue, 'Helvetica
Neue', Helvetica, Arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif;
font-size: 16px; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);" class=""><br class="">
</span></div>
<div class=""><br class="">
</div>
<div class=""><span style="font-family: HelveticaNeue, 'Helvetica
Neue', Helvetica, Arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif;
font-size: 16px; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);" class=""><br class="">
</span></div>
<br class="">
<div class="">
<blockquote type="cite" class="">
<div class="">On Oct 16, 2015, at 7:49 AM, <<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:davidmathes8@yahoo.com" class=""></a><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:davidmathes8@yahoo.com">davidmathes8@yahoo.com</a>>
<<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:davidmathes8@yahoo.com" class="">davidmathes8@yahoo.com</a>>
wrote:</div>
<br class="Apple-interchange-newline">
<div class="">
<div style="font-style: normal; font-variant: normal;
font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height:
normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent:
0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows:
auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;
background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-family:
HelveticaNeue, 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, 'Lucida
Grande', sans-serif; font-size: 16px;" class="">
<div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445006229343_3522" class=""><span class="">All</span></div>
<div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445006229343_3522" class=""><span class=""><br class="">
</span></div>
<div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445006229343_3522" class=""><span id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445006229343_3781" class="">FWIW the
preprint can be found on Arxiv and the paper at DESY</span></div>
<div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445006229343_3522" class=""><span class=""><br class="">
</span></div>
<div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445006229343_3522" dir="ltr" class=""><a moz-do-not-send="true" href="http://arxiv.org/abs/hep-ex/0401009" id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445006229343_3956" class="">[hep-ex/0401009]
Search for contact interactions, large extra
dimensions and finite quark radius in ep collisions at
HERA</a></div>
<div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445006229343_3522" dir="ltr" class=""><br class="">
</div>
<div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445006229343_3522" dir="ltr" class=""><a moz-do-not-send="true" href="http://www.desy.de/%7Ephch/conf/ichep06/hiq2/8/ZEUS-prel-06-018.pdf" id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445006229343_3774" class="">http://www.desy.de/~phch/conf/ichep06/hiq2/8/ZEUS-prel-06-018.pdf</a><span class=""><br class="">
</span></div>
<div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445006229343_4337" class=""><br class="">
</div>
<div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445006229343_4973" class="">Best
regards,</div>
<div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445006229343_4973" class=""><br class="">
</div>
<div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445006229343_4974" class="">David</div>
<blockquote id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445006229343_3773" style="border-left-width: 2px; border-left-style: solid;
border-left-color: rgb(16, 16, 255); margin-left: 5px;
margin-top: 5px; padding-left: 5px;" class="">
<div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445006229343_3772" style="font-family: HelveticaNeue, 'Helvetica Neue',
Helvetica, Arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif;
font-size: 16px;" class="">
<div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445006229343_3771" style="font-family: HelveticaNeue, 'Helvetica Neue',
Helvetica, Arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif;
font-size: 16px;" class="">
<div dir="ltr" id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445006229343_3770" class="">
<hr id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445006229343_3777" class="" size="1"><font id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445006229343_3769" class="" size="2" face="Arial"><b class=""><span style="font-weight: bold;" class="">From:</span></b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Dr.
Albrecht Giese <<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:genmail@a-giese.de" class="">genmail@a-giese.de</a>><br class="">
<b class=""><span style="font-weight: bold;" class="">To:</span></b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:davidmathes8@yahoo.com" class=""></a><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:davidmathes8@yahoo.com">davidmathes8@yahoo.com</a>;
"<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:phys@a-giese.de" class="">phys@a-giese.de</a>"
<<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:phys@a-giese.de" class="">phys@a-giese.de</a>>;
Richard Gauthier <<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:richgauthier@gmail.com" class="">richgauthier@gmail.com</a>>;
'Nature of Light and Particles - General
Discussion' <<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org" class="">general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org</a>>;
Richard Gauthier <<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:richgauthier@gmail.com" class="">richgauthier@gmail.com</a>><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="">
<b class=""><span style="font-weight: bold;" class="">Sent:</span></b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Friday,
October 16, 2015 6:03 AM<br class="">
<b class=""><span style="font-weight: bold;" class="">Subject:</span></b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Re:
[General] research papers<br class="">
</font></div>
<div class="y_msg_container" id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445006229343_3995"><br class="">
<div id="yiv0505623334" class="">
<div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445006229343_3994" class=""><big id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445006229343_3993" class="">David,<br class="" clear="none">
<br class="" clear="none">
here follows the reference to the DESY
experiment:<br class="" clear="none">
<br class="" clear="none">
"Search for contact interactions, large
extra dimensions and finite quark radius in<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><i class="">ep<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></i>collisions
at HERA",<br class="" clear="none">
ZEUS Collaboration, Physics Letters B 591
(2004) 23-41<br class="" clear="none">
<br class="" clear="none">
I should explain something about the
historical context.<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="" clear="none">
<br class="" clear="none">
It was found in experiments that there are
(inelastic) interactions between electrons
and quarks. Such interactions are excluded
in the Standard Model of particle physics.
So the ad-hoc assumption was made that there
is a new particle, which couples to leptons
and to quarks. It was named leptoquark.
Since that time several experiments have
been done to isolate a leptoquark in an
interaction between electrons and quarks.
This was done at DESY and at the Tevatron.
That search was without success up to now.<br class="" clear="none">
<br class="" clear="none">
There is another motivation to have an
interaction between leptons and quarks.
There are the same number of charges between
both in our world, and there are further
similarities between leptons and quarks.
Those could be explained if leptons and
quarks could be exchanged to each other.<br class="" clear="none">
<br class="" clear="none">
At present it does not look like the
Standard Model will be changed at this
point. Instead there is an ongoing search
for leptoquarks. But should those not be
found (as it looks at present), then there
may be no other choice than to change the SM
such that a lepton is subject to the strong
force. In that case (which I expect to be
the final one) leptons, and so also
electrons, have to be described by a model
which comprises the strong force.<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="" clear="none">
<br class="" clear="none">
This DESY experiment of referenced above
also confirms the otherwise known fact that
the cross section of the electron-quark
scattering excludes a radius of more than 10<sup class="">-18</sup><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>m
for the sum of electron and quark.<br class="" clear="none">
<br class="" clear="none">
Is this the information you expect?<br class="" clear="none">
<br class="" clear="none">
Best regards<br class="" clear="none">
Albrecht<br class="" clear="none">
<br class="" clear="none">
</big><br class="" clear="none">
<br class="" clear="none">
<div class="yiv0505623334moz-cite-prefix">Am
14.10.2015 um 16:14 schrieb<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv0505623334moz-txt-link-abbreviated" ymailto="mailto:davidmathes8@yahoo.com" target="_blank" href="mailto:davidmathes8@yahoo.com"></a><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:davidmathes8@yahoo.com">davidmathes8@yahoo.com</a>:<br class="" clear="none">
</div>
<div class="qtdSeparateBR"><br class="">
<br class="">
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334yqt0476417258" id="yiv0505623334yqt35768">
<blockquote type="cite" class="">
<div style="background-color: rgb(255,
255, 255); font-family: HelveticaNeue,
'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial,
'Lucida Grande', sans-serif; font-size:
16px;" class="">
<div class="">Albrecht</div>
<div class=""><br class="" clear="none">
</div>
<div id="yiv0505623334yui_3_16_0_1_1444831758864_3458" class="">A lepton with strong
force...that is rather interesting. </div>
<div id="yiv0505623334yui_3_16_0_1_1444831758864_3458" class=""><br class="" clear="none">
</div>
<div id="yiv0505623334yui_3_16_0_1_1444831758864_3458" class="">I could not find the DESY
2004 reference. Do you have it handy?</div>
<div id="yiv0505623334yui_3_16_0_1_1444831758864_3458" class=""><br class="" clear="none">
</div>
<div id="yiv0505623334yui_3_16_0_1_1444831758864_3458" class="">David</div>
<div id="yiv0505623334yui_3_16_0_1_1444831758864_3291" class=""><br class="" clear="none">
</div>
<div id="yiv0505623334yui_3_16_0_1_1444831758864_3291" class=""><br class="" clear="none">
</div>
<div id="yiv0505623334yui_3_16_0_1_1444831758864_3292" class=""><br class="" clear="none">
</div>
<br class="" clear="none">
<blockquote id="yiv0505623334yui_3_16_0_1_1444831758864_3026" style="border-left-width: 2px;
border-left-style: solid;
border-left-color: rgb(16, 16, 255);
margin-left: 5px; margin-top: 5px;
padding-left: 5px;" class="">
<div id="yiv0505623334yui_3_16_0_1_1444831758864_3025" style="font-family: HelveticaNeue,
'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial,
'Lucida Grande', sans-serif;
font-size: 16px;" class="">
<div id="yiv0505623334yui_3_16_0_1_1444831758864_3024" style="font-family: HelveticaNeue,
'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica,
Arial, 'Lucida Grande',
sans-serif; font-size: 16px;" class="">
<div dir="ltr" id="yiv0505623334yui_3_16_0_1_1444831758864_3023" class="">
<hr class="" size="1"><font id="yiv0505623334yui_3_16_0_1_1444831758864_3022" class="" size="2" face="Arial"><b class=""><span style="font-weight: bold;" class="">From:</span></b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Dr. Albrecht Giese<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv0505623334moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" ymailto="mailto:genmail@a-giese.de" target="_blank" href="mailto:genmail@a-giese.de"></a><a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:genmail@a-giese.de"><genmail@a-giese.de></a><br class="" clear="none">
<b class=""><span style="font-weight: bold;" class="">To:</span></b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Richard Gauthier<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv0505623334moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" ymailto="mailto:richgauthier@gmail.com" target="_blank" href="mailto:richgauthier@gmail.com"></a><a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:richgauthier@gmail.com"><richgauthier@gmail.com></a>;
'Nature of Light and Particles
- General Discussion'<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv0505623334moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" ymailto="mailto:general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org" target="_blank" href="mailto:general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org"></a><a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org"><general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org></a><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="" clear="none">
<b class=""><span style="font-weight: bold;" class="">Sent:</span></b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Wednesday, October 14, 2015 5:40
AM<br class="" clear="none">
<b class=""><span style="font-weight: bold;" class="">Subject:</span></b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Re: [General] research papers<br class="" clear="none">
</font></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334y_msg_container" id="yiv0505623334yui_3_16_0_1_1444831758864_3303"><br class="" clear="none">
<div id="yiv0505623334" class="">
<div id="yiv0505623334yui_3_16_0_1_1444831758864_3302" class=""><font id="yiv0505623334yui_3_16_0_1_1444831758864_3301" class="" size="+1"><big id="yiv0505623334yui_3_16_0_1_1444831758864_3300" class="">Hello Richard,<br class="" clear="none">
<br class="" clear="none">
I refer to your first
reference given below
"The Charged-Photon
Model of the Electron
... ". Which I liked
very much to read, but
without agreeing to
everything of it.<br class="" clear="none">
<br class="" clear="none">
The crucial thing seems
to be the 'de Broglie
wavelength'. I can
follow your deduction.
You take the energy and
so the momentum of the
orbiting charged photon.
You calculate the wave
number of the photon
from the momentum. Then
you take the actual
component of the wave
number in the direction
of the whole electron.
And the result is in
fact the de Broglie
wavelength. - But what
is the physics behind
that?<br class="" clear="none">
<br class="" clear="none">
If the electron moves
slowly, the phase speed
is much more than c. In
the case of the electron
at rest it is even
infinite. So, the whole
wave oscillates with a
fixed phase until
infinity. What kind of
wave can that be? Yes, a
phase can move faster
than a material wave.
But such a different
(and higher) phase speed
can only be caused by a
superposition of waves.
Who contributes to this
superposition? You
mention as an example
that e.g. a pulse can be
understood as a
superposition of a
collection of single
waves. Correct. But just
in this case the length
of the resulting phase
wave will never be
infinite. So, what is
the physics behind? I do
not see an answer in
your paper. And I for
myself have as well no
answer to it.<br class="" clear="none">
<br class="" clear="none">
The same is true for de
Broglie. In his paper of
1924 he deduces an
equation for the phase
speed so that the de
Broglie wavelength,
which has turned out to
be practical to describe
scattering at double
slits etc, is the result
of his mathematical
procedure. But de
Broglie himself states
the lack of physical
understanding (as you
also quote so in your
paper):<br class="" clear="none">
</big></font><br class="" clear="none">
</div>
<div id="yiv0505623334yui_3_16_0_1_1444831758864_3317" class="">
<div class="yiv0505623334MsoNormal" id="yiv0505623334yui_3_16_0_1_1444831758864_3316" style="margin: 0cm 0cm
8pt; line-height:
15.693333625793457px;
font-size: 11pt;"><big id="yiv0505623334yui_3_16_0_1_1444831758864_3315" class=""><big id="yiv0505623334yui_3_16_0_1_1444831758864_3314" class=""><small id="yiv0505623334yui_3_16_0_1_1444831758864_3313" class=""><span id="yiv0505623334yui_3_16_0_1_1444831758864_3312" class="" lang="EN-US"><font id="yiv0505623334yui_3_16_0_1_1444831758864_3311" class="" size="+2">„…
so that the
present theory
may be
considered a
formal scheme
whose physical
content is not
yet fully
determined,
rather than a
full-fledged
definite
doctrine.”</font></span></small></big></big></div>
<big id="yiv0505623334yui_3_16_0_1_1444831758864_3320" class=""><big id="yiv0505623334yui_3_16_0_1_1444831758864_3319" class=""><small id="yiv0505623334yui_3_16_0_1_1444831758864_3321" class="">So, even de
Broglie admits in his
paper that this is a
formal result which
does not represent
really understood
physics. But despite
of this, Erwin
Schrödinger has
integrated this
"vague" approach into
his famous
"Schrödinger
equation". This is -
as far as I understand
it - still the state
of QM today. Nothing
better.<br class="" clear="none">
<br class="" clear="none">
With this I do not
want to criticise you
as I for myself have
at present no
solution. This also
answers your question
regarding the relation
of my model to the de
Broglie wavelength.<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="" clear="none">
<br class="" clear="none">
I see it as a valuable
goal for the further
development to find an
answer (a<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><i class="">physical<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></i>answer!) to the question of
the de Broglie
wavelength.<br class="" clear="none">
<br class="" clear="none">
Apart of this I would
like to ask the
following questions to
your model with a
charged photon.<br class="" clear="none">
<br class="" clear="none">
- If this photon is
orbiting in the
electron, by which
force is it hold on
its orbit?<br class="" clear="none">
- The photon has a
mass or a momentum
(which I find
equivalent) in it. So
it has inertia. What
is the mechanism which
causes this inertia?<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="" clear="none">
- A photon as we know
it does not have a
charge. So this
particle can be
understood to be a
different one. Would
it not be better to
give it a new name,
just for clarity?<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="" clear="none">
<br class="" clear="none">
You ask me why my
particle model does
not only have one
orbiting particle but
two? The answer is
simply that this
explains the circular
motion. One object
cannot move on a
circular path without
any bind to something
else.<br class="" clear="none">
<br class="" clear="none">
And should not any
electron model have an
answer to the fact
that there is also the
strong interaction
found in the electron
(DESY 2004)?<br class="" clear="none">
<br class="" clear="none">
Best regards<br class="" clear="none">
Albrecht</small></big><br class="" clear="none">
<br class="" clear="none">
<br class="" clear="none">
</big><br class="" clear="none">
<div class="yiv0505623334moz-cite-prefix"><big class=""><big class=""><font class="" size="+1"><big class=""><big class="">Am
05.10.2015 um
19:17 schrieb
Richard
Gauthier:<br class="" clear="none">
</big></big></font></big></big></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334qtdSeparateBR"><br class="" clear="none">
<br class="" clear="none">
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334yqt6255097049" id="yiv0505623334yqt37850">
<div class=""><big class=""><big class=""><font class="" size="+1"><big class=""><big class="">Hello
Albrecht,</big></big></font></big></big>
<div class="yiv0505623334"><big class=""><big class=""><font class="" size="+1"><big class=""><big class=""><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
</big></big></font></big></big></div>
<br class="" clear="none">
<blockquote type="cite" class="">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><big class=""><big class=""><font class="" size="+1"><big class=""><big class="">Thank
you for your
further
comments and
questions.<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
</big></big></font></big></big>
<div class="yiv0505623334"><big class=""><big class=""><font class="" size="+1"><big class=""><big class=""><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
</big></big></font></big></big>
<div class="yiv0505623334"><big class=""><big class=""><font class="" size="+1"><big class=""><big class="">De
Broglie's
“harmony of
phases”
argument is a
little hard to
follow or
picture. His
derivation is
given in my
article at<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv0505623334moz-txt-link-freetext" target="_blank" href="https://www.academia.edu/9973842/The_Charged-Photon_Model_of_the_Electron_the_de_Broglie_Wavelength_and_a_New_Interpretation_of_Quantum_Mechanics">https://www.academia.edu/9973842/The_Charged-Photon_Model_of_the_Electron_the_de_Broglie_Wavelength_and_a_New_Interpretation_of_Quantum_Mechanics</a>
on p. 5 in the
section
“Comparison of
the
charged-photon
derivation to
de Broglie’s
derivation”<span class="yiv0505623334" style="word-spacing: -4px;">.</span> "Harmony of
phases" is
generally
accepted. I’m
quite pleased
that I was
able with
simple math to
derive the
electron's
relativistic
de Broglie
wavelength
without it. I
also derived
the electron’s
relativistic
matter-wave
equation A
e^i(kx-wt) for
a free
relativistic
electron from
the
circulating
charged photon
model, based
on the
circulating
charged photon
emitting a
plane wave
along the
charged
photon’s
helical
trajectory,
with the
circulating
charged
photon’s
wavelength
h/(gamma mc)
and frequency
f = (gamma
mc^2)/h, using
the relation
cos(theta) =
v/c where
theta is the
forward angle
of the charged
photon’s
helical
trajectory.
The
intersection
of this
circulating
plane wave
with the
longitudinal
axis of the
circulating
charged
photon’s
helical
trajectory
generates the
electron’s
matter-wave
equation with
the
relativistic
de Broglie
wavelength and
phase velocity
c^2/v . </big></big></font></big></big></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334"><big class=""><big class=""><font class="" size="+1"><big class=""><big class=""><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
</big></big></font></big></big></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334"><big class=""><big class=""><font class="" size="+1"><big class=""><big class="">The
momentum of
the
circulating
charged photon
is p = gamma
mc because the
energy E of
the
circulating
charged photon
is set equal
the total
energy E of
moving
electron
E=gamma mc^2
and the
energy-momentum
relation for a
photon is p=
E/c: p =
E/c = (gamma
mc^2) / c =
gamma mc for
the total
momentum of
the
circulating
charged photon
along its
helical
trajectory.
This total
momentum's
longitudinal
component
along the
helical axis
is p
cos(theta)=
gamma mc x
v/c = gamma
mv which is
the
relativistic
momentum of
the electron
being modeled
by the
circulating
charged
photon. The
transverse
component of
the charged
photon's total
momentum is mc
.</big></big></font></big></big></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334"><big class=""><big class=""><font class="" size="+1"><big class=""><big class=""><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
</big></big></font></big></big></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334"><big class=""><big class=""><font class="" size="+1"><big class=""><big class="">Since
your “basic
particles”
don’t, as you
state, have
relativistic
behavior, why
not just have
one
circulating
light-speed
particle
instead of
two? Insisting
on
conservation
of momentum
between two
circulating
non-physical
particles (for
which there is
no
experimental
evidence)
doesn’t seem
logical.</big></big></font></big></big></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334"><big class=""><big class=""><font class="" size="+1"><big class=""><big class=""><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
</big></big></font></big></big></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334"><big class=""><big class=""><font class="" size="+1"><big class=""><big class="">For
your
reference, my
recent article
is at<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><b class="yiv0505623334"><a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv0505623334moz-txt-link-freetext" target="_blank" href="https://www.academia.edu/15686831/Electrons_are_spin_1_2_charged_photons_generating_the_de_Broglie_wavelength">https://www.academia.edu/15686831/Electrons_are_spin_1_2_charged_photons_generating_the_de_Broglie_wavelength</a> .</b></big></big></font></big></big></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334"><big class=""><big class=""><font class="" size="+1"><big class=""><big class=""><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
</big></big></font></big></big></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334"><big class=""><big class=""><font class="" size="+1"><big class=""><big class="">No
one knows why
the electron’s
rest mass is m
= E(resting
electron)/c^2
= 0.511
MeV/c^2 . The
Higgs
mechanism
doesn’t
predict m. A
photon
carrying the
energy E of
the rest mass
m of an
electron has
energy hf =
E=mc^2 and
momentum p=mc
. So mc is
more
fundamental
than m since
this photon is
not at rest
but has
momentum mc.
If this photon
is then
converted into
a resting
electron, this
electron now
has internal
invariant
circulating
momentum mc
and a
corresponding
rest mass m
which the
original
photon did not
have. So the
photon's
original
momentum mc,
which precedes
the electron’s
formation, is
more
fundamental
than the
electron’s
rest mass m.</big></big></font></big></big></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334"><big class=""><big class=""><font class="" size="+1"><big class=""><big class=""><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
</big></big></font></big></big></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334"><big class=""><big class=""><font class="" size="+1"><big class=""><big class="">with
best regards,</big></big></font></big></big></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334"><big class=""><big class=""><font class="" size="+1"><big class=""><big class="">
Richard</big></big></font></big></big></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334"><big class=""><big class=""><font class="" size="+1"><big class=""><big class=""><b class="yiv0505623334"><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
</b></big></big></font></big></big></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334"><big class=""><big class=""><font class="" size="+1"><big class=""><big class=""><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
</big></big></font></big></big></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334"><big class=""><big class=""><font class="" size="+1"><big class=""><big class=""><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
</big></big></font></big></big></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334"><big class=""><big class=""><font class="" size="+1"><big class=""><big class=""><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
</big></big></font></big></big></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334"><big class=""><big class=""><font class="" size="+1"><big class=""><big class=""><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
</big></big></font></big></big></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334"><big class=""><big class=""><font class="" size="+1"><big class=""><big class=""><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
</big></big></font></big></big></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334"><big class=""><big class=""><font class="" size="+1"><big class=""><big class=""><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
</big></big></font></big></big></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="">
<blockquote class="yiv0505623334" type="cite">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><big class=""><big class=""><font class="" size="+1"><big class=""><big class="">On
Oct 4, 2015,
at 2:01 PM,
Dr. Albrecht
Giese <<a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv0505623334moz-txt-link-abbreviated" ymailto="mailto:genmail@a-giese.de" target="_blank" href="mailto:genmail@a-giese.de"></a><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:genmail@a-giese.de">genmail@a-giese.de</a>>
wrote:</big></big></font></big></big></div>
<big class=""><big class=""><font class="" size="+1"><big class=""><big class=""><br class="yiv0505623334Apple-interchange-newline" clear="none">
</big></big></font></big></big></blockquote>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
<div class="">
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334moz-cite-prefix"><big class=""><big class=""><font class="" size="+1"><big class=""><big class="">Hello
Richard,<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
</big></big></font><font class="" size="+1"><big class=""><big class=""><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
Am 02.10.2015
um 07:45
schrieb
Richard
Gauthier:<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
</big></big></font></big></big></div>
</div>
</div>
<div class="">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><big class=""><big class=""><font class="" size="+1"><big class=""><big class="">Hello
Albrecht,</big></big></font></big></big></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334"><big class=""><big class=""><font class="" size="+1"><big class=""><big class=""><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
</big></big></font></big></big></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334"><big class=""><big class=""><font class="" size="+1"><big class=""><big class="">
Thank you for
your detailed
explanations.
Yes, I will
wait for your
quantitative
derivation of
the
relativistic
de Broglie
wavelength
from your
electron
model. De
Broglie’s
original
derivation has
the internal
frequency of
his electron
both
increasing
(due to its
energy as
gamma mc^2 =
hf AND also
decreasing due
to
relativistic
time dilation.
He managed to
reconcile both
of these
frequencies by
his ingenious
“harmony of
phases”
relationship.
Your electron
model only
seems to have
a decreasing
frequency with
increasing
speed, where
you say this
decreasing
frequency is
due to time
dilation.
Without an
increasing
internal
frequency
proportional
to the
electron's
energy gamma
mc^2 I think
you will have
difficulty
deriving the
relativistic
de Broglie
wavelength. My
model derives
the de Broglie
wavelength
value h/(gamma
mv) easily
from the
relativistic
wavelength
h/(gamma mc)
of the
circulating
charged photon
whose
frequency is
given by
hf=gamma mc^2,
without
referring to
relativistic
time dilation.</big></big></font></big></big></div>
<big class=""><big class=""><font class="" size="+1"><big class=""><big class="">These
are two
questions or
problems. One is
the increase of
the internal
frequency of a
particle at
motion despite
of dilation.
There is an easy
way to see how
it in principle
works. I said
earlier that the
dilation, so the
reduction of the
internal
frequency, is
over-compensated
by the
Dopplereffect,
which is
effective for an
observer who
receives the
particle.
Mathematically:
If you divide
the Doppler
function (the
source moving
towards the
observer) by the
square of the
gamma function,
then the result
is more than 1.
This shows that
the Doppler
effect
over-compensates
the reduction of
the frequency by
dilation at
least by gamma.
The result
should however
be exactly one.
When I am at
home again
(presently I am
not) I will
investigate my
literature to
get a precise
result.<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
Thank you for
your note about
the "harmony of
phases". The
idea takes care
of the problem
that on the one
hand the
frequency in an
elementary
particle follows
E=mc^2=h*frequency,
on the other
hand the de
Broglie
wavelength does
not follow this
relation. What
is the reason
for that? In my
present
understanding
the "harmony of
phases" was an
ad hoc attempt
of de Broglie to
solve this
problem
mathematically.
I do not have
the impression
that it is based
on a true
understanding of
a physical
process. I shall
come back to
this as soon as
I am back at
home.<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
</big></big></font></big></big>
<blockquote class="yiv0505623334" type="cite">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><big class=""><big class=""><font class="" size="+1"><big class=""><big class=""> </big></big></font></big></big></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334"><big class=""><big class=""><font class="" size="+1"><big class=""><big class="">
You say at one
point: "We can
reorder this
equation:
m*R*c =
h(bar). The
left side is
now the
classical
definition of
the orbital
momentum at
speed = c.”
But mc is not
the momentum
of a particle
with rest mass
traveling at
c, i.e. p = mv
where v is
replaced by c.
Could you have
misunderstood
p=mc for the
relativistic
equation for
momentum p =
gamma mv for a
particle with
rest mass m
traveling at
velocity v but
never able to
reach c.<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
</big></big></font></big></big></div>
</blockquote>
<big class=""><big class=""><font class="" size="+1"><big class=""><big class="">I have
referred to the
classical
definition of
angular momentum
to show that the
spin can be
visualized for
such a type of
model (i.e. my
model). Of
course the units
do not fit with
exact numbers.
If we treat the
model as a
classical
gyroscope (what
it definitely
not is) then
this equation
describes the
angular
momentum. In
that case<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><i class="yiv0505623334">m<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></i>is
of course the<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><i class="yiv0505623334">effective<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></i>mass, in this case however not
applicable in so
far as there are
no single
"masses" in this
model. (Mass is
a dynamical
process within
the whole.) The
speed c is not a
problem in so
far as the
"basic
particles" do
not have a
relativistic
behavior.
Relativistic
effects are
caused by the
elementary
particle as a
whole as
particularly
visible for the
phenomenon of
dilation. But
one point
results very
clearly from
this view: The
resulting
angular momentum
(=spin) is
independent of
other properties
of the particle.
That is a
physical result
here, not a
result of some
algebra. And the
numerical result
is very close to
the correct one
which is not a
matter of
course.<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
</big></big></font></big></big>
<blockquote class="yiv0505623334" type="cite">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><big class=""><big class=""><font class="" size="+1"><big class=""><big class=""><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
</big></big></font></big></big></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334"><big class=""><big class=""><font class="" size="+1"><big class=""><big class="">
However, the
momentum
quantity mc
does appear in
my circulating
charged photon
model as the
invariant
transverse
component of
the helically
circulating
charged
photon’s total
momentum gamma
mc.<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></big></big></font></big></big></div>
</blockquote>
<big class=""><big class=""><font class="" size="+1"><big class=""><big class="">Why is
the momentum<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><i class="yiv0505623334">gamma mc</i>?
If the photon is
subject to
relativistic
effects, on
which level of
your model is
relativity
founded? The
increase of<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><i class="yiv0505623334">m<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></i>by<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><i class="yiv0505623334">gamma<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></i>must have some reason. Which
reason is it? (I
do not see
Einstein's
algebra as a
reason.)<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
</big></big></font></big></big>
<blockquote class="yiv0505623334" type="cite">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><big class=""><big class=""><font class="" size="+1"><big class=""><big class="">The
longitudinal
component of
the charged
photon’s
circulating
momentum is
gamma mv,
which is the
momentum of
the
relativistic
electron being
modeled by the
circulating
charged
photon. The
transverse
momentum
component mc
contributes to
the spin
hbar/2 of a
slow moving or
resting
electron
composed of a
circulating
photon at
radius
hbar/2mc in
this way: Sz
= r x p =
hbar/2mc x mc
= hbar/2 . My
charged photon
model is a
generic
charged photon
model, which
needs a more
detailed
charged photon
model
incorporated
into it that
will give the
charged photon
model a spin
hbar/2 also at
relativistic
velocities,
since the
electron has
spin hbar/2
at all
velocities. I
have such a
possible
charged photon
model that is
internally
superluminal
and has spin
hbar/2 at all
energies,
which might be
incorporated
into the
generic
charged photon
model.</big></big></font></big></big></div>
</blockquote>
<big class=""><big class=""><font class="" size="+1"><big class=""><big class="">This is
a collection of
equations which
are listed here
but not deduced
or
substantiated. I
guess that they
are
(quantitative)
consequences of
the foundations
of your model. I
do not have
details of your
model here at
hand as I am not
at home. Is it
difficult for
you to give me
just a quick
reference? - The
occurrence of
superluminal
speed is a
problem in so
far as it
constitutes a
new property
which is very
different from
present
understanding of
physics. Better
if we do not
need such
assumptions.<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
</big></big></font></big></big>
<blockquote class="yiv0505623334" type="cite">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><big class=""><big class=""><font class="" size="+1"><big class=""><big class=""><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
</big></big></font></big></big></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334"><big class=""><big class=""><font class="" size="+1"><big class=""><big class="">
You asked if
someone
besides you
has an
explanation of
particle
inertia. This
invariant
circulating
transverse
momentum
component p=mc
in my charged
photon model
of the
electron gives
my electron
model an
invariant rest
mass m and so
this
circulating
momentum
component mc
may be the
origin of
inertia or
rest mass of
material
particles like
the electron.</big></big></font></big></big></div>
</blockquote>
<big class=""><big class=""><font class="" size="+1"><big class=""><big class="">In my
understanding
you put the
logic here
upside down. You
refer to the
momentum<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><i class="yiv0505623334">p=mc</i>. But here is<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><i class="yiv0505623334">m<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></i>the
origin of the
momentum. So, if
mass is not
defined, also
this expression
is undefined. -
Only after the
mass generation
has been found,
it makes sense
to talk about
momentum. No the
other way
around.<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
Albrecht</big></big></font><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
</big><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
</big>
<blockquote class="yiv0505623334" type="cite"><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<blockquote class="yiv0505623334" type="cite">
<div class="yiv0505623334">On
Oct 1, 2015, at
11:51 AM, Dr.
Albrecht Giese
<<a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv0505623334moz-txt-link-abbreviated" ymailto="mailto:genmail@a-giese.de" target="_blank" href="mailto:genmail@a-giese.de"></a><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:genmail@a-giese.de">genmail@a-giese.de</a>>
wrote:</div>
<br class="yiv0505623334Apple-interchange-newline" clear="none">
</blockquote>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
<div class="">
<div class="yiv0505623334">Dear
Richard,<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<div class="yiv0505623334moz-forward-container"><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
thank you for your
list of explicit
questions. That makes
it easy to answer in a
structured way. And I
hope that my answers
can also answer some
of the other questions
and doubts which came
up during the last
days and mails.<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
</div>
</div>
</div>
<div class="">
<div class="yiv0505623334">Hello
John and Albrecht and
all,</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334"><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
Thanks John, I stand
corrected on the issue
of your electron model
not falling off in
lateral size as
1/gamma. </div>
<div class="yiv0505623334"><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
Albrecht, I am still
not satisfied with your
electron model for a
number of reasons:</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334"><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">1)
no experimental evidence
for multi-particle
structure of the
electron even at high
energies.</div>
Yes, this model makes it
difficult to show
experimentally this
structure of the electron.
It is difficult by the
reason that both
sub-particles do not have
any mass. So the particle
cannot be decomposed by
bombardment, which is the
normal way of
investigating a particle
structure in high energy
physics (like a proton).
On the other hand it
should not be a problem to
accept that a particle is
big as a whole, but by a
scattering experiment only
a sub-particle is
detected. That has a
historical analogy in the
Rutherford experiment,
where Rutherford wished to
measure the size of an
atom but found the size of
the nucleus. In case of
the electron the
experimenters look for the
size of the electron but
find the size of the basic
particle.<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
However there is now
indeed an experimental
evidence. As Frank Wilczek
wrote in his article in
Nature, in a specific
situation
(superconductivity in a
magnetic field),
half-electrons were
detected. In his
understanding it is a
complete mystery. In the
view of this particle
model not so much a
mystery.<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
An important theoretical
argument for a pair of
sub-particles is the fact
the there is an internal
motion (mag. moment,
spin), but the
conservation of momentum
must not be violated. This
needs at least 2
sub-particles.<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<blockquote class="yiv0505623334" type="cite">
<div class="yiv0505623334moz-forward-container">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">2)
your light-speed
charged, massless
circulating
particles carry no
resting inertia —
why not just call
them circulating
charged photons, and
just have one of
them rather than
two, based on the
lack of experimental
evidence for
multi-particle
structure of the
electron?<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
Arguments against a
photon: A photon at c has
inertia. With this
assumption the model
cannot work (look for the
mechanism of inertia). And
a photon does not have a
single (or half) electric
charge. And scattering of
other charged particles
(like quarks) at a photon
would not display a size
< 10^-18. A photon
cannot be that small.<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
Further the photon has
spin of 1 h(bar), the
electron has 1/2 of it. If
the electron would be
built by 2 photons, the
combined spin should be 0
or 2. Or there must be an
additional orbital
momentum which is
otherwise not known in
particle physics.
<blockquote class="yiv0505623334" type="cite">
<div class="yiv0505623334moz-forward-container">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">3)
there is no clear
model of a photon in
your system (maybe I
missed it) and how
electron-positron
pair production of
your electron model
and positron model
would emerge from a
single photon in the
vicinity of a
nucleus (a common
method of pair
production).</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
I must admit that I do not
have a consistent model
for a photon. I tend to
the idea of de Broglie
that a photon is composed
by 2 elementary particles.
But I do not assume 2
neutrinos as de Broglie
did but maybe of 4 basic
particles in a very
special configuration. At
least a photon has to have
positive and negative
electric charges inside,
otherwise it would not
react with electric
charges as it does.<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
If we assume that the
photon is e.g. built by 2
other particles which are
similar to electrons, pair
production is quite
plausible. On the other
hand, the generation of
elementary particles by
interaction processes,
which should mean in this
context the generation of
basic particles, needs
some additional
understanding. My model
just uses generations like
those but has no
explanation yet for them.<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<blockquote class="yiv0505623334" type="cite">
<div class="yiv0505623334moz-forward-container">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">4)
the
two-dimensionality
of your electron
model. Delta x in
the third dimension
appears to be zero
and delta Px in the
third dimension is
also zero. So delta
x delta Px is also
zero , a strong
violation of the
Heisenberg
uncertainty
principle. Is that
a problem for your
model?</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
The orbital motion of the
2 sub-particles goes on in
a 2-dimensional area, that
is true. Problem with
Heisenberg's principle? (I
prefer to say: the
uncertainty relation,
because nature is not
determined by principles,
as elementary particles
etc. do not have a mind so
that they can understand
and follow principles.)
The uncertainty is a
"technical" consequence of
the de Broglie wave which
surrounds and guides a
particle. Such wave can
only be determined with
uncertainty, that is the
uncertainty found in
measurements. I do not see
any uncertainty in
particles themselves as
everywhere when we can
measure parameters in an
interaction, the
conservation laws are
fulfilled without an
uncertainty.
<blockquote class="yiv0505623334" type="cite">
<div class="yiv0505623334moz-forward-container">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">5)
the fact that your
model’s lateral size
doesn’t decrease as
electron speed
increases. Since the
2 particles still
move at light speed,
this would require
that the frequency
of their circulation
will reduce, rather
than increase as
would be expected
with the electron's
increasing energy as
its speed increases.
That also leaves
your high energy
relativistic
electron model about
100,000 times too
big, compared with
high energy electron
scattering
experiments.<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></div>
</div>
</blockquote>
Irrespective to which
direction an electron
moves, the orbital
frequency reduces by the
factor gamma. This is
simple geometry and the
physical cause of dilation
in SR. On the other hand,
if the electron moves
towards another object to
undergo an interaction
there, then the other
object experiences an
increase of frequency by
the Doppler effect. This
Doppler effect
over-compensates the
relativistic reduction. -
By the way, this
consideration was the
starting point for de
Broglie when he began to
think about elementary
particles, which ended
with the Nobel price.
<blockquote class="yiv0505623334" type="cite">
<div class="yiv0505623334moz-forward-container">
<div class="yiv0505623334">To
say that electron
scattering occurs in
your model with only
one of the two
rotating point-like
particles and the
other is pulled
along without
inertial resistance
doesn’t work for me
and seems very
non-physical.<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
As the "other"
sub-particle has no
inertial mass, it can
follow any acceleration.
This is (also) covered by
Newton's law of inertia.
But as both sub-particles
are bound to each other by
a field which is subject
to the finite speed of
light, the "other" one
causes the inertia of the
whole configuration by the
delay of field
propagation. - It is
essential for the
understanding of this
model to understand the
underlying mechanism of
inertia. See further down.
<blockquote class="yiv0505623334" type="cite">
<div class="yiv0505623334moz-forward-container">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">6)
the fact that the
electron’s
z-component of spin
1/2 hbar is not
clearly present in
your model whose
radius is the
reduced Compton
wavelength hbar/mc
and not the Dirac
amplitude hbar/2mc
which easily yields
the electron’s spin
1/2 , zitterbewegung
frequency,
double-looping in a
resting electron and
the Dirac 720 degree
rotational symmetry
of the electron.
(This is the same
problem I see with
John M’s electron
model, which also
doesn’t have a clear
spin 1/2 hbar since
its radius is also
hbar/mc and not
hbar/2mc .)</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
The sub-particles in this
model are bound to each
other by a multi-pole
field of the strong force.
This field causes the
inertia of the whole
particle and so tries to
inhibit any change of the
motion state. As the
sub-particles orbit at c
and also the binding field
moves at c, the one
sub-particle does not
receive the field of the
other one from the
opposite direction of the
orbital motion, but the
force has a component in
the direction of the
circumference of the
orbit. This inhibits a
change of the orbital
motion and causes so an
orbital momentum, i.e. a
spin.<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
For an approximate
calculation: The mass is
given by m = h(bar) /
(R*c) . We can reorder
this equation: m*R*c =
h(bar). The left side is
now the classical
definition of the orbital
momentum at speed = c. -
This is not numerically
applicable here as the
model does not function as
a classical gyroscope. But
it shows how spin in
principle works.<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
Regarding Dirac: What
Dirac has done is algebra,
not physics. It is often
very practical to do
algebra do solve physical
problems, but we should
always be aware of the
fact that we have to trace
the algebra back to the
physical processes behind
the calculation. And so
also his period of 720
degrees is a kind of
mathematical trick helpful
for some calculations. But
the physical space does in
my understanding not have
a periodicity of 720
degrees.
<blockquote class="yiv0505623334" type="cite">
<div class="yiv0505623334moz-forward-container">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">7)
the wave nature of
your model is not
clear to me. What in
your model produces
the electron's
quantum wave nature,
and how does your
moving electron
model generate the
relativistic de
Broglie wavelength
quantitatively? Does
it? You seem to
accept the pilot
wave concept of de
Broglie-Bohm. Does
your electron model
display quantum
non-locality and
entanglement as
Bohm’s does and
which is also
strongly
experimentally
supported?</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
The field which binds both
sub-particles propagates
into any direction in
space. So it is existent
also outside of this
configuration "electron".
As the electron
circulates, it is an
alternating field which
emits waves into the
surrounding space. When
the particle moves, it
takes the wave-field with
it. This guides the
particle as anticipated by
de Broglie and, among
other effects, causes the
scattering structure at a
double slit.<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
Non-locality and
entanglement: This was my
original motivation to
investigate theoretical
physics (originally I am
an experimentalist). But
up to now I was not
successful to find an
explanation for that. -
But that is another topic
which has no direct
relation to my model. - It
is a new information for
me that Bohm did have an
explanation for
entanglement.<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
You are asking for the
deduction of the de
Broglie wavelength. For
presenting a quantitative
deduction I have to
investigate some more
details, and so I ask you
for some patience. I shall
come back to it.<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
Finally I would like to
emphasize the fact that
this model is the only one
which explains inertia. As
it is meanwhile admitted
by mainstream physics, the
Higgs model is not able to
provide this. The
necessary Higgs field does
definitely not exist.<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
The reason for mass is
that any extended object
has inertia, independent
of "elementary masses"
which may exist inside an
object. The reason is the
finiteness of the speed of
light, by which binding
fields, which must be
present in any extended
object, propagate. This is
not an idea or a wage
possibility, but it is
completely unavoidable.
Applied to a particle
model, a particle can only
have inertial if it is
extended.<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
Question: Does anyone of
you all here has another
working model of inertia?<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
Here I should end today.
But I will be happy to get
further - and critical -
questions.<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
Best regards<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
Albrecht<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<blockquote class="yiv0505623334" type="cite">
<div class="yiv0505623334moz-forward-container"><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<blockquote class="yiv0505623334" type="cite">
<div class="yiv0505623334">On
Sep 29, 2015, at
1:48 AM, John
Williamson <<a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv0505623334moz-txt-link-abbreviated" ymailto="mailto:John.Williamson@glasgow.ac.uk" target="_blank" href="mailto:John.Williamson@glasgow.ac.uk"></a><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:John.Williamson@glasgow.ac.uk">John.Williamson@glasgow.ac.uk</a>>
wrote:</div>
<br class="yiv0505623334Apple-interchange-newline" clear="none">
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334" style="font-style:
normal;
font-variant:
normal;
font-weight:
normal;
letter-spacing:
normal;
line-height:
normal;
text-indent:
0px;
text-transform:
none;
white-space:
normal;
word-spacing:
0px;
background-color:
rgb(255, 255,
255);
direction:
ltr;
font-family:
Tahoma;
font-size:
10pt;">
<div class="yiv0505623334MsoNormal" style="margin:
0cm 0cm 10pt;
line-height:
17.1200008392334px;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
Cambria;"><span class="yiv0505623334">Dear everyone especially Al, Albrecht and Richard,</span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334MsoNormal" style="margin:
0cm 0cm 10pt;
line-height:
17.1200008392334px;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
Cambria;"><span class="yiv0505623334">I have been meaning to weigh-in for some time, but
term has just
started and
I’m
responsible
for hundreds
of new
students, tens
of PhD’s,
there is only
one of me and
my mind is
working on
less than ten
percent
capacity.<span class="yiv0505623334Apple-converted-space"> </span></span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334MsoNormal" style="margin:
0cm 0cm 10pt;
line-height:
17.1200008392334px;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
Cambria;"><span class="yiv0505623334">I think we have to distinguish between what is
know,
experimentally,
and our
precious (to
us) little
theoretical
models. Please
remember
everyone that
theory is just
theory. It is
fun to play
with and that
is what we are
all doing. The
primary thing
is first to
understand
experiment –
and that is
hard as there
is a huge
amount of
mis-information
in our
“information”
technology
culture.</span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334MsoNormal" style="margin:
0cm 0cm 10pt;
line-height:
17.1200008392334px;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
Cambria;"><span class="yiv0505623334">You are right, Al, that Martin has not carried out
experiments,
directly,
himself, on
the electron
size in both
high energy
and at low
energy, but I
have.</span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334MsoNormal" style="margin:
0cm 0cm 10pt;
line-height:
17.1200008392334px;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
Cambria;"><span class="yiv0505623334">I have many papers, published in the most
prestigious
journals, on
precisely
those topics.
They HAVE had
much interest
(in total more
than ten
thousand
citations). I
have sat up,
late at night,
alone,
performing
experiments<span class="yiv0505623334"> <span class="yiv0505623334Apple-converted-space"> </span></span>both
with the
largest lepton
microscope
ever made (The
EMC experiment
at CERN) and
with my superb
(best in the
world at the
time)
millikelvin
Cryostat
looking at
precisely the
inner
structure of
single
electrons
spread out
over sizes
much (orders
of magnitude)
larger than my
experimental
resolution. It
is widely
said, but
simply not
true, that “no
experiment
resolves the
electron
size”.<span class="yiv0505623334Apple-converted-space"> </span><span class="yiv0505623334"> </span>This comes, largely, from simple ignorance
of what the
experiments
show. I have
not only seen
inside single
electrons, but
then used the
observed
properties and
structure,
professionally
and in widely
published and
cited work, to
design new
devices. Have
had them made
and measured
(in
collaboration
with others),
and seen them
thenwork both
as expected,
but also to
reveal deeper
mysteries
again
involving the
electron size,
its quantum
spin, its
inner charge
distribution
and so on.
That work is
still going
on, now
carried by my
old colleagues
and by the
rest of the
world. Nano –
my device was
the first
nanosemiconductor
device.
Spintronics,
designed the
first devices
used for this.
Inner workings
of spin , and
the exclusion
principle
Martin and I
hope to crack
that soon!
Fun! All
welcome!</span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334MsoNormal" style="margin:
0cm 0cm 10pt;
line-height:
17.1200008392334px;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
Cambria;"><span class="yiv0505623334">Now where Martin is coming from, and where he,
personally,
late at night
etc … HAS done
lots of
professional
experiments
and has been
widely cited
is in playing
the same kind
of games with
light that I
have done with
electrons.
This means
that, acting
together, we
really know
what we are
talking about
in a wide
range of
physics.
Especially
particle
scattering,
quantum
electron
transport, and
light. We may
be making up
the theories,
but we are not
making up a
wide and deep
understanding
of experiment.</span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334MsoNormal" style="margin:
0cm 0cm 10pt;
line-height:
17.1200008392334px;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
Cambria;"><span class="yiv0505623334">I take your point – and you are so right -that
there are so
many things
one would like
to read and
understand and
has not yet
got round to.
So much and so
little time.
Ore papers
written per
second than
one can read
per second.
There is,
however, no
substitute for
actually
having been
involved in
those very
experiments to
actually
understand
what they
mean.</span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334MsoNormal" style="margin:
0cm 0cm 10pt;
line-height:
17.1200008392334px;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
Cambria;"><span class="yiv0505623334">So what I am about to say is not going to be
“shooting from
the hip”, but
is perhaps
more like
having spent a
couple of
decades
developing a
very large
rail gun which
has just been
loaded for its
one-shot at
intergalactic
exploration …</span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334MsoNormal" style="margin:
0cm 0cm 10pt;
line-height:
17.1200008392334px;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
Cambria;"><span class="yiv0505623334">Now I hope you will not take this badly …<span class="yiv0505623334"> <span class="yiv0505623334Apple-converted-space"> </span></span>it is fun to
think about
this but here
goes</span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334MsoNormal" style="margin:
0cm 0cm 10pt;
line-height:
17.1200008392334px;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
Cambria;"><span class="yiv0505623334">Here is what you said (<span class="yiv0505623334" style="color:
rgb(31, 73,
125);">making
you blue</span>):</span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334MsoNormal" style="margin:
0cm 0cm 10pt;
line-height:
17.1200008392334px;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
Cambria;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana;
color: rgb(31,
73, 125);
background-color:
white;">You
have not done
an experiment,
but (at best)
a calculation
based on some
hypothtical
input of your
choise. Maybe
it's good,
maybe not.<span class="yiv0505623334Apple-converted-space"> </span></span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334MsoNormal" style="margin:
0cm 0cm 10pt;
line-height:
17.1200008392334px;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
Cambria;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana;
background-color:
white;">Not
so: I have
done the
experiments!
Myself. This
is exactly why
I started
looking into
the extant
models decades
ago, found
them sadly
lacking, and
hence set out
to devise new
ones that did
agree with
experiment at
both low and
high energy.
This is the
whole point! </span><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 5pt; font-family: Helvetica;
background-color:
white;"></span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334" style="margin:
0cm 0cm 10pt;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
Cambria;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana;
background-color:
white;"> </span><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 5pt; font-family: Helvetica;
background-color:
white;"></span><br class="yiv0505623334webkit-block-placeholder" clear="none">
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334MsoNormal" style="margin:
0cm 0cm 10pt;
line-height:
17.1200008392334px;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
Cambria;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana;
background-color:
white;">The
Sun scatters
as a point
only those
projectiles
that don't get
close.</span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334MsoNormal" style="margin:
0cm 0cm 10pt;
line-height:
17.1200008392334px;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
Cambria;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana;
background-color:
white;">True,</span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334MsoNormal" style="margin:
0cm 0cm 10pt;
line-height:
17.1200008392334px;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
Cambria;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana;
background-color:
white;"><span class="yiv0505623334"> </span> So far, no scattering off elecrtons has
gotten close
enough to
engage any
internal
structure,
"they" say
(I#ll defer to
experts
up-to-date).<span class="yiv0505623334Apple-converted-space"> </span></span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334MsoNormal" style="margin:
0cm 0cm 10pt;
line-height:
17.1200008392334px;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
Cambria;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana;
background-color:
white;">Not
so. Lots of
papers on
this. Some by
me. See e.g.
Williamson,
Timmering,
Harmans,
Harris and
Foxon Phys Rev
42 p 7675.
Also – I am an
expert (up to
date) on HEP
as well. A
more correct
statement is
that no
high-energy
scattering
experiment has
RESOLVED any
internal
structure in
free
electrons. If
this was all
you knew (and
for many HEP
guys it seems
to be) then
one might
interpret this
as meaning the
electron was a
point down to
10-18m. It is
not. It cannot
be. It does
not have
enough mass to
account for
its spin (even
if at
lightspeed) if
it is that
small. Work it
out!</span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334" style="margin:
0cm 0cm 10pt;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
Cambria;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana;
background-color:
white;"> </span><br class="yiv0505623334webkit-block-placeholder" clear="none">
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334MsoNormal" style="margin:
0cm 0cm 10pt;
line-height:
17.1200008392334px;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
Cambria;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana;
background-color:
white;"> <span class="yiv0505623334" style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Nevertheless,
electrons are
in constant
motion at or
near the speed
of light
(Zitterbewegung)
and therefore
at the time
scales of the
projectiles
buzz around
(zittern) in a
certain amout
of space,
which seems to
me must
manifest
itself as if
there were
spacially
exteneded
structure
within the
scattering
cross-section.
Why not?</span></span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334MsoNormal" style="margin:
0cm 0cm 10pt;
line-height:
17.1200008392334px;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
Cambria;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana;
background-color:
white;">Because
this is no
good if one
does not have
the forces or
the mechanism
for making it
“zitter”.</span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334MsoNormal" style="margin:
0cm 0cm 10pt;
line-height:
17.1200008392334px;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
Cambria;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana;
background-color:
white;">More
importantly
-experimentally-
because that
is not what
you see. If it
was just
zittering in
space one
could see that
zitter. What
you see (in
deep inelastic
lepton
scattering,
for example),
is that there
is no size
scale for
lepton
scattering.
That is, that
no structure
is resolved
right down to
10^-18 metres.
This is NOT
the same thing
as an electron
being a point.
That is why
one says (if
one knows a
bit about what
one is talking
about) that it
is
“point-like”
and not
“point”
scattering.
These
qualifiers
ALWAYS matter.
Point-like –
not a point.
Charged
photon- not a
photon.
Localised
photon – not a
photon.
Vice-Admiral-
not an
admiral.
Vice-president-
more a reason
for not
shooting the
president!</span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334MsoNormal" style="margin:
0cm 0cm 10pt;
line-height:
17.1200008392334px;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
Cambria;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana;
background-color:
white;">That
structure is
not resolved
does NOT mean
that the
electron is
point.<span class="yiv0505623334"> <span class="yiv0505623334Apple-converted-space"> </span></span>This is widely
accepted as
fact, but just
represents a
(far too
widespread)
superficial
level of
understanding.
Any
inverse-square,
spherically
symettric
force-field
has this
property (eg
spherical
planets if you
do not
actually hit
them). The
real problem
is to
understand how
it can appear
spherically
symettric and
inverse square
in scattering
while ACTUALLY
being much
much larger
than this.
This is
exactly what I
started out
working on in
1980 and have
been plugging
away at ever
since. Exactly
that! You need
to explain all
of experiment:
that is what
this is all
about. </span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334MsoNormal" style="margin:
0cm 0cm 10pt;
line-height:
17.1200008392334px;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
Cambria;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana;
color: rgb(31,
73, 125);
background-color:
white;">Not to
defend
Albrecht's
model as he
describes it,
but many folks
(say Peter
Rowlands at
Liverpool, for
example) model
elemtary
particles in
terms of the
partiicle
itself
interacting
with its
induced
virtual image
(denoted by
Peter as the
"rest of the
universe").
This
"inducement"
is a kind of
polarization
effect. Every
charge repells
all other like
charges and
attracts all
other unlike
charges
resulting in
what can be
modeled as a
virtual charge
of the
opposite
gender
superimposed
on itself in
the static
approximation.
But, because
the real
situation is
fluid, the
virtual
charge's
motion is
delayed as
caused by
finite light
speed, so that
the two chase
each other.
Etc. Looks
something like
Albrecht's
pairs.</span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334MsoNormal" style="margin:
0cm 0cm 10pt;
line-height:
17.1200008392334px;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
Cambria;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana;
background-color:
white;">Yes I
know. This is
the same kind
of maths as
“image
charges” used
all the time
in modelling
the solid
state. These
are all
models. All
models have
features. We
need to
confront them
with
experiment.
Problem with
the pairs is
you don’t see
any pairs. If
one of the
pair has zero
mass-energy it
is not there
at all. If
there was a
pair, bound to
each other
with some
forces, then
one would see
something
similar to
what one sees
in proton
scattering
(see below),
and you do
not. One then
has to explain
why and how
this process
occurs, every
time. You
always (and
only) see one
thing for
electrons,
muons. You see
a single
object for the
electron, and
an internal
structure for
the proton.
This is what
your theory
has to deal
with. Really.
Properly. In
detail. At all
energies.</span><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 5pt; font-family: Helvetica;
background-color:
white;"></span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334" style="margin:
0cm 0cm 10pt;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
Cambria;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana;
background-color:
white;"> </span><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 5pt; font-family: Helvetica;
background-color:
white;"></span><br class="yiv0505623334webkit-block-placeholder" clear="none">
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334MsoNormal" style="margin:
0cm 0cm 10pt;
line-height:
17.1200008392334px;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
Cambria;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana;
color: rgb(31,
73, 125);
background-color:
white;">I too
havn't read
your 97 paper
yet, but I bet
it's unlikely
that you all
took such
consideration
into account.</span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334MsoNormal" style="margin:
0cm 0cm 10pt;
line-height:
17.1200008392334px;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
Cambria;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana;
background-color:
white;">You
could not know
this, but his
could not be
more wrong. We
did. You did
not specify
the bet. Lets
make it a
beer. You owe
me (and
Martin) a
beer! If you
have not yet
read the paper
by the time we
next meet I
think you
should buy all
the beers!
Deal?</span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334MsoNormal" style="margin:
0cm 0cm 10pt;
line-height:
17.1200008392334px;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
Cambria;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana;
background-color:
white;">The
whole point of
the paper my
reason for
leaving high
energy physics
at all, the
seven years of
work Martin
and I put into
it to that
point, was
exactly to
resolve this
mystery – on
the basis of
an “electron
as a localised
photon”. My
subsequent
work has been
to try to
develop a
proper field
theory to deal
with the
problems
inherent I the
old model
(unknown
forces) and in
the Dirac
theory (ad hoc
lump of mass)
(amongst
others). This
is the point
of the new
theory of
light and
matter:an
attempt to
sort all that
out. You
should read it
too! Do that
and I will buy
you a beer!</span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334MsoNormal" style="margin:
0cm 0cm 10pt;
line-height:
17.1200008392334px;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
Cambria;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana;
background-color:
white;">Now
Richard, while
I am
disagreeing
with everyone
I am going to
disagree with
you too! You
keep saying
that the
electron
apparent size
scales with
gamma – and
you keep
attributing me
with agreeing
with you (and
Martin and Viv
and Chip). Let
me say this
once and for
all: I DO NOT
agree with
this.<span class="yiv0505623334"> <span class="yiv0505623334Apple-converted-space"> </span></span>Now Viv and
Chip must
speak for
themselves,
but I’m pretty
sure Martin
would (largely
– though not
completely)
agree me here.<span class="yiv0505623334Apple-converted-space"> </span><span class="yiv0505623334"> </span>I
have said this
many times to
you – though
perhaps not
specifically
enough.<span class="yiv0505623334"> <span class="yiv0505623334Apple-converted-space"> </span></span>It is not
quite wrong –
but far too
simple. It
scales ON
AVERAGE so. I
agree that it
changes
apparent size-
yes, but not
with gamma-
no. How it
actually
scales was
discussed in
the 1997
paper, and the
mathematics of
this is
explained (for
example) in my
“Light” paper
at SPIE (see
Eq. 19). Gamma
= ½( x+ 1/x).
Also, this is
amongst other
things, in
Martin’s
“Light is
Heavy” paper.
Really the
apparent size
scales BOTH
linearly AND
inverse
linearly (as x
and 1/x then).
It is the
average of
these that
gives gamma.
This is how
relativity
actually
works. You do
not put things
in, you get
things out.
You need to
look at this
and understand
how gamma is
related. Best
thing is to go
through the
maths
yourself, then
you will see.</span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334MsoNormal" style="margin:
0cm 0cm 10pt;
line-height:
17.1200008392334px;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
Cambria;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana;
background-color:
white;">The
bottom line is
that the
reason one
does not
resolve the
electron size
is that, in a
collision,
this size
scales like
light. It gets
smaller with
increasing
energy.
Linearly.
Likewise the
scattering
exchange
photon scales
like light.
Linearly. The
ratio for head
on collisions
remains
constant – but
the exchange
photon is
always about
an order of
magnitude
bigger that
the electron
(localised
photon). This
is WHY it can
be big (10^-13
m)<span class="yiv0505623334"> <span class="yiv0505623334Apple-converted-space"> </span></span>and yet appear
small. I said
this in my
talk, but I
know how hard
it is to take
everything in.</span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334MsoNormal" style="margin:
0cm 0cm 10pt;
line-height:
17.1200008392334px;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
Cambria;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana;
background-color:
white;">One
does not see
internal
structure
because of
this effect –
and the fact
that the
electron is a
SINGLE object.
Not composite
– like a
proton (and
Albrecht’s
model).</span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334MsoNormal" style="margin:
0cm 0cm 10pt;
line-height:
17.1200008392334px;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
Cambria;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana;
background-color:
white;">Now
what would one
see with
lepton
scatting on
protons? I
have dozens of
papers on this
(and thousands
of citations
to those
papers) – so
this is not
shooting from
the hip. Let
me explain as
briefly and
simply as I
can. Lock and
load …</span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334MsoNormal" style="margin:
0cm 0cm 10pt;
line-height:
17.1200008392334px;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
Cambria;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana;
background-color:
white;">At low
energies
(expresses as
a length much
less than
10^-15 m or
so), one sees
point-like
scattering
from, what
looks like, a
spherically
symettric
charge
distribution.
Ok there are
differences
between
positive
projectiles
(which never
overlap) and
negative, but
broad brush
this is so.
There is then
a transitional
stage where
one sees
proton
structure –
some
interesting
resonances and
an effective
“size” of the
proton (though
recently this
has been shown
to be
(spectactularly
interestingly)
different for
electron and
muon
scattering!
(This means
(obviously)
that the
electron and
muon have a
different
effective size
on that
scale). At
much higher
energies one
begins to see
(almost) that
characteristic
point-like
scattering
again, from
some hard bits
in the proton.
Rutherford
atom all over
again. These
inner parts
have been
called
“partons”.
Initially,
this was the
basis
–incorrect in
my view – of
making the
association of
quarks with
partons.
Problem
nowadays is
that the three
valence quarks
carry almost
none of the
energy-momentum
of the proton
- - keeps
getting less
and less as
the energies
go up. I think
this whole
quark-parton
thing is
largely
bullshit.
Experimentally!</span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334MsoNormal" style="margin:
0cm 0cm 10pt;
line-height:
17.1200008392334px;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
Cambria;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana;
background-image:
none;
background-attachment:
scroll;
background-color:
white;
background-position:
0% 0%;
background-repeat:
repeat
repeat;">Now
Albrecht you
make some good
points. You
are absolutely
right to quote
the
experiments on
the relativity
of time with
clocks and
with muons.
You are also
right that one
is not much
better off
with double
loops (or any
other kinds of
loops) than
with two
little hard
balls. This is
a problem for
any model of
the electron
as a loop in
space (Viv,
John M, Chip,
John D – this
is why the
electron
cannot be a
little spatial
loop – it is
not consistent
with
scattering
experiments!).
Now this is a
problem in
space-space
but not in
more complex
spaces as
Martin and I
have argued
(see SPIE
electron paper
for up to date
description of
this – from my
perspective).
It is more
proper to say
the loops are
in “momentum
space” though
this is not
quite correct
either. They
are in the
space(s) they
are in – all
nine degrees
of freedom
(dimensions if
you like) of
them. None of
the nine are
“space”. For
me, they are
not little
loops in
space. In
space they are
spherical. You
are not
correct – as
the DESY
director said
and as I said
in the “panel”
discussion-
that one would
not “see”
this. One
would. Only if
one of the
balls were not
there ( I like
your get out
of saying
that!), would
one observe
what one
observes. In
my view,
however, if it
is not there
it is not
there. I’m
open to
persuasion if
you can give
me a mechanism
though!</span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334MsoNormal" style="margin:
0cm 0cm 10pt;
line-height:
17.1200008392334px;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
Cambria;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana;
background-color:
white;">Gotta
go ... need to
sort out
tutorials ...<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
</span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334MsoNormal" style="margin:
0cm 0cm 10pt;
line-height:
17.1200008392334px;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
Cambria;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana;
background-color:
white;">Regards,
John W.</span><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 5pt; font-family: Helvetica;
background-color:
white;"></span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334" style="margin:
0cm 0cm 10pt;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
Cambria;"><span class="yiv0505623334"> </span><br class="yiv0505623334webkit-block-placeholder" clear="none">
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334" style="font-family:
'Times New
Roman';
font-size:
16px;">
<hr class="yiv0505623334" tabindex="-1">
<div class="yiv0505623334" id="yiv0505623334divRpF633381" style="direction: ltr;"><font class="yiv0505623334" size="2" face="Tahoma"><b class="yiv0505623334">From:</b><span class="yiv0505623334Apple-converted-space"> </span>General
[<a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv0505623334moz-txt-link-abbreviated" ymailto="mailto:general-bounces+john.williamson=glasgow.ac.uk@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org" target="_blank" href="mailto:general-bounces+john.williamson=glasgow.ac.uk@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org"></a><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:general-bounces+john.williamson=glasgow.ac.uk@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org">general-bounces+john.williamson=glasgow.ac.uk@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org</a>]
on behalf of
Dr. Albrecht
Giese [<a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv0505623334moz-txt-link-abbreviated" ymailto="mailto:genmail@a-giese.de" target="_blank" href="mailto:genmail@a-giese.de"></a><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:genmail@a-giese.de">genmail@a-giese.de</a>]<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<b class="yiv0505623334">Sent:</b><span class="yiv0505623334Apple-converted-space"> </span>Monday, September 28,
2015 4:39 PM<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<b class="yiv0505623334">To:</b><span class="yiv0505623334Apple-converted-space"> </span>Richard Gauthier;
Nature of
Light and
Particles -
General
Discussion<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<b class="yiv0505623334">Subject:</b><span class="yiv0505623334Apple-converted-space"> </span>Re: [General]
research
papers<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
</font><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">Richard,<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
you have asked
some questions
about my
electron model
and I am glad
to answer
them.<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
Does my model
explain the
relativistic
mass increase
of the
electron at
motion? Yes it
does.
According to
my model the
mass of an
electron is
m=h(bar) / (R<sub class="yiv0505623334">el</sub>*c), where R<sub class="yiv0505623334">el</sub>
is the radius
for the
electron
(which is
equally valid
for all
elementary
particles).
Now, as the
binding field
in the
electron
contracts at
motion by
gamma (as
initially
found by
Heaviside in
1888), also
the size of
the electron
contracts at
motion by
gamma. So the
mass of the
electron
increases by
gamma and also
of course its
dynamical
energy. - That
is very simple
and
elementary.
The same
considerations
apply for the
relativistic
momentum of
the electron.<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
(This is all
described in
my web site<span class="yiv0505623334Apple-converted-space"> </span><a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv0505623334moz-txt-link-abbreviated" target="_blank" href="http://www.ag-physics.org/rmass"></a><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.ag-physics.org/rmass">www.ag-physics.org/rmass</a><span class="yiv0505623334Apple-converted-space"> </span>; you can also find
it via Google
by the search
string "origin
of mass".
There it is
within the
first two
positions of
the list,
where the
other one is
of Frank
Wilczek; since
10 years we
both are
struggling to
be the number
one.)<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
However, the
contraction
only occurs in
the direction
of motion. So
the cross
section of the
electron is
not changed by
the motion.
And in so far
this
contraction is
not able to
explain the
small size of
the electron
found in
scattering
experiments. -
Another point
is that this
small size was
also found in
scattering
experiments at
energies
smaller than
29 GeV. And,
another
determination,
in the Penning
trap the size
of the
electron turns
out to be <
10^-22 m.<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
So there must
be something
in the
electron which
is much
smaller than
the Compton
wavelength.
The model of
two orbiting
sub-particles
is an
extremely
simple model
which also
explains a lot
else.<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
Regarding the
uncertainty
relation of
Heisenberg, I
have a very
"technical"
understanding
of it as I
have explained
it in our
meeting. There
is nothing
imprecise
within the
electron
itself, only
the
measurement
has limited
precision. The
reason is
simple.
Normally an
interaction of
the electron
is an
interaction of
its de Broglie
wave with
another
object. This
wave is a wave
packet, the
size of which
is round about
given by the
size of the
electron-configuration
(Compton
wavelength);
the size of a
wave packet is
not very
precisely
defined. And
on the other
hand, the
frequency of a
limited packet
is not
precisely
measurable.
The relation
of both
limitations is
well known by
electric
engineers, the
rule is
sometimes
called
"Nyquist
theorem". Now,
as the
frequency is
related to the
energy of the
particle, the
Nyquist
theorem is
identical with
Heisenberg's
uncertainty
relation; only
the
interpretation
of quantum
theorists is
less
technical.
They assume
that the
physical
situation
itself is
imprecise, not
only the
measurement.
Here I do not
follow the QM
interpretation.<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
Albrecht<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<div class="yiv0505623334moz-cite-prefix">Am
26.09.2015 um
19:57 schrieb
Richard
Gauthier:<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
</div>
<blockquote class="yiv0505623334" type="cite">
<div class="yiv0505623334">Albrecht,
Al, Martin et
al</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334"><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
One solution
that I think
John W,
Martin, Chip
(I think),
Vivian (as I
remember) and
I all agree on
(I’m not sure
about John M’s
electron
model) with
our electron
models is that
the electron
(as a
circulating
light-speed
entity)
decreases in
size with
increasing
speed of the
electron. Just
as a photon’s
wavelength
(and
presumably
also its
transverse
size or
extent)
decreases
proportionally
as 1/E with a
photon’s
energy E=hf, a
high energy
relativistic
electron
(whose de
Broglie
wavelength is
nearly equal
to the
wavelength of
a high energy
photon having
the same total
energy as the
high energy
electron)
should also
decrease its
lateral size
similarly with
its energy.
The lateral
size of an
electron
decreases as
1/gamma
according to
John and
Martin due to
energy
considerations.
In my model
the radius of
the charged
photon’s
helical
trajectory
decreases as
1/gamma^2 but
with a more
detailed
extended
(internally
superluminal)
model of the
charged photon
also decreases
as 1/gamma . A
1/gamma
decrease is
enough to
match the high
energy (around
29GeV)
scattering
size of an
electron found
to be <
10^-18 meters
even though
the size of
the resting
electron (on
the order of
the Compton
wavelength) is
around 10^-12
- 10^-13 m. So
this I think
is a solved
problem with
respect to our
models.</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334"><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
I don’t know
if Albrecht’s
electron model
decreases as
1/gamma with
increasing
electron
speed. I think
not. But
Albrecht’s
model doesn’t
I think take
into account
that the
electron’s
total energy
increases
proportionally
with gamma and
so the
frequency of
the 2
circulating
mass-less
particles
should also
increase
proportionally
with gamma if
the energy of
his model is
to correspond
to the
experimentally
measured
moving
electron’s
energy E=
gamma mc^2 .
That should
require the
radius of the
2-particle
orbit to
decrease with
his electron
model’s speed
if the 2
orbiting
particles are
to continue to
circulate at
light-speed.
So Albrecht's
model’s size
should also
decrease at
least as
1/gamma with
its speed,and
the need for
the 2 massless
particles in
his model is
unnecessary to
explain the
small size of
the electron
at high
speeds. As
far as
conservation
of momentum
requiring 2
circulating
particles,
John W.’s
model proposes
to solve this
with his p-vot
which causes
the photon to
curve into a
double loop
and produce
the electron’s
rest mass (as
I understand
it) and
charge. But
also the delta
x delta p >
hbar/2
requirement of
Heisenberg’s
uncertainty
principle for
detectable
variability in
position and
velocity means
that probably
for any
Compton
wavelength
electron model
the amount of
violation of
conservation
of momentum of
a single
light-speed
photon-like
object looping
around would
not be
experimentally
detectable
(and so
allowed since
it is not
experimentally
detected) as
being (like a
virtual
particle in
QED) under the
wire of the
Heisenberg
uncertainty
principle.</div>
</blockquote>
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<blockquote class="yiv0505623334" type="cite">
<div class="yiv0505623334">
Richard</div>
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<blockquote class="yiv0505623334" type="cite">
<div class="yiv0505623334">On
Sep 26, 2015,
at 8:57 AM,
John Duffield
<<a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv0505623334moz-txt-link-abbreviated" ymailto="mailto:johnduffield@btconnect.com" target="_blank" href="mailto:johnduffield@btconnect.com"></a><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:johnduffield@btconnect.com">johnduffield@btconnect.com</a>>
wrote:</div>
<br class="yiv0505623334Apple-interchange-newline" clear="none">
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334WordSection1" style="font-family:
Helvetica;
font-size:
12px;
font-style:
normal;
font-variant:
normal;
font-weight:
normal;
letter-spacing:
normal;
line-height:
normal;
text-indent:
0px;
text-transform:
none;
white-space:
normal;
word-spacing:
0px;
background-color:
rgb(255, 255,
255);">
<div class="yiv0505623334" style="margin:
0cm 0cm
0.0001pt;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
'Times New
Roman',
serif;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;
color: rgb(31,
73, 125);">Albrecht:</span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334" style="margin:
0cm 0cm
0.0001pt;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
'Times New
Roman',
serif;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;
color: rgb(31,
73, 125);"> </span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334" style="margin:
0cm 0cm
0.0001pt;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
'Times New
Roman',
serif;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;
color: rgb(31,
73, 125);">In
case Martin is
tied up,
here’s his
1997 paper:<span class="yiv0505623334Apple-converted-space"> </span><a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv0505623334moz-txt-link-freetext" target="_blank" href="http://www.cybsoc.org/electron.pdf"></a><a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://www.cybsoc.org/electron.pdf">http://www.cybsoc.org/electron.pdf</a><span class="yiv0505623334Apple-converted-space"> </span>co-authored with John
Williamson.<span class="yiv0505623334Apple-converted-space"> </span></span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334" style="margin:
0cm 0cm
0.0001pt;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
'Times New
Roman',
serif;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;
color: rgb(31,
73, 125);"> </span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334" style="margin:
0cm 0cm
0.0001pt;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
'Times New
Roman',
serif;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;
color: rgb(31,
73, 125);">As
regards
electron size,
it’s field is
what it is. In<span class="yiv0505623334Apple-converted-space"> </span><a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv0505623334" target="_blank" href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atomic_orbital#Electron_properties" style="color:
purple;
text-decoration:
underline;">atomic
orbitals</a><span class="yiv0505623334Apple-converted-space"> </span>electrons “exist as
standing
waves”.
Standing wave,
standing
field. We can
diffract
electrons. I
think the
electron has
size like a
seismic wave
has size. A
seismic wave
might have an
amplitude of 1
metre, and a
wavelength of
a kilometre.
But when it
travels from A
to B it isn’t
just the
houses on top
of the AB line
that shake.
Houses shake a
hundred miles
away. And that
seismic wave
is still
detectable on
the other side
f the Earth.
It’s not
totally
different for
an ocean wave,
see<span class="yiv0505623334Apple-converted-space"> </span><a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv0505623334" target="_blank" href="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/4/4a/Deep_water_wave.gif" style="color:
purple;
text-decoration:
underline;">this
gif</a>. The
amplitude
might be 1m,
but that isn’t
the size of
the wave, nor
is the
wavelength.
The red test
particles are
still
circulating
deep below the
water.<span class="yiv0505623334Apple-converted-space"> </span></span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334" style="margin:
0cm 0cm
0.0001pt;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
'Times New
Roman',
serif;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;
color: rgb(31,
73, 125);"> </span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334" style="margin:
0cm 0cm
0.0001pt;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
'Times New
Roman',
serif;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;
color: rgb(31,
73, 125);">Try
to imagine a
wave going
round and
round, in a
double loop,
then make it a
tighter loop.
Then have a
look at<span class="yiv0505623334Apple-converted-space"> </span><a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv0505623334" target="_blank" href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_knot_theory" style="color:
purple;
text-decoration:
underline;">some
knots</a>.
Photon
momentum is a
measure of
resistance to
change-in-motion
for a wave
propagating
linearly at c.
When it’s a
511keV wave
going round
and round at
c, we don’t
call it a
photon any
more. But it
still exhibits
resistance to
change-in-motion.
Only we don’t
call it a
momentum any
more. We call
it mass. Make
sure you read<span class="yiv0505623334Apple-converted-space"> </span><a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv0505623334" target="_blank" href="http://www.tardyon.de/mirror/hooft/hooft.htm" style="color:
purple;
text-decoration:
underline;">this</a>.
It’s not the
Nobel ‘t
Hooft.<span class="yiv0505623334Apple-converted-space"> </span></span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334" style="margin:
0cm 0cm
0.0001pt;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
'Times New
Roman',
serif;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;
color: rgb(31,
73, 125);"> </span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334" style="margin:
0cm 0cm
0.0001pt;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
'Times New
Roman',
serif;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;
color: rgb(31,
73, 125);">Regards</span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334" style="margin:
0cm 0cm
0.0001pt;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
'Times New
Roman',
serif;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;
color: rgb(31,
73, 125);">John
Duffield</span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334" style="margin:
0cm 0cm
0.0001pt;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
'Times New
Roman',
serif;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;
color: rgb(31,
73, 125);"> </span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334" style="border-style:
solid none
none;
border-top-color:
rgb(225, 225,
225);
border-top-width:
1pt; padding:
3pt 0cm 0cm;">
<div class="yiv0505623334" style="margin:
0cm 0cm
0.0001pt;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
'Times New
Roman',
serif;"><b class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;
color:
windowtext;" lang="EN-US">From:</span></b><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;
color:
windowtext;" lang="EN-US"><span class="yiv0505623334Apple-converted-space"> </span>General [<a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv0505623334moz-txt-link-freetext" ymailto="mailto:general-bounces+johnduffield=btconnect.com@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org" target="_blank" href="mailto:general-bounces+johnduffield=btconnect.com@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org"></a><a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="mailto:general-bounces+johnduffield=btconnect.com@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org">mailto:general-bounces+johnduffield=btconnect.com@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org</a>]<span class="yiv0505623334Apple-converted-space"> </span><b class="yiv0505623334">On
Behalf Of<span class="yiv0505623334Apple-converted-space"> </span></b>Dr. Albrecht
Giese<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<b class="yiv0505623334">Sent:</b><span class="yiv0505623334Apple-converted-space"> </span>26 September 2015
15:46<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<b class="yiv0505623334">To:</b><span class="yiv0505623334Apple-converted-space"> </span><a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv0505623334moz-txt-link-abbreviated" ymailto="mailto:general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org" target="_blank" href="mailto:general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org"></a><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org">general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org</a><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<b class="yiv0505623334">Subject:</b><span class="yiv0505623334Apple-converted-space"> </span>Re: [General]
research
papers</span></div>
</div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334" style="margin:
0cm 0cm
0.0001pt;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
'Times New
Roman',
serif;"> </div>
<div class="yiv0505623334MsoNormal" style="margin:
0cm 0cm 12pt;
line-height:
17.1200008392334px;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
'Times New
Roman',
serif;">Hi
Martin, Al,
and all,<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
thank you all
for your
contributions.<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<u class="yiv0505623334">Regarding
the size of
the electron:</u><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
As Al argued
in his example
of the sun: If
the scattered
object is
passing by
without
touching, the
angular
distribution
is independent
of the size of
the object
(for the 1/r^2
case). But
that changes
if the
scattered
particle hits
the body of
the "ball". In
a last
experiment in
2004 at DESY
there was an
experiment
performed in
which
electrons were
scattered
against quarks
(of a proton).
The "common"
size of both
particles
resulted in a
bit less than
10^-18 m. This
limit is given
by the ratio
of scattered
events which
react
different from
the 1/r^2
rule. - In
this
experiment it
was also found
that the
electron is
not only
subject to the
electric
interaction
but also to
the strong
interaction. I
think that
this is also
important for
assessing
electron
models.<span class="yiv0505623334Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
This result of
the size seems
in clear
conflict with
the evaluation
of Schrödinger
and Wilczek
using the
uncertainty
relation.
Schroedinger
made the
following
statement to
it: "Here I
have got the
following
result for the
size of the
electron (i.e.
the Compton
radius). But
we know that
the electron
is point-like.
So, I must
have an error
in my
evaluation.
However, I do
not find this
error." So
also for
Schrödinger
this was an
unsolvable
conflict.<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
I think that
if the
electron would
be point like
on the one
hand but
oscillate far
enough so as
to fill the
size of the
Compton
wavelength,
this would be
a violation of
the
conservation
of momentum.
Very clearly,
a single
object cannot
oscillate.
That was also
obvious for
Schrödinger
and clearly
his reason to
call the
internal
motion
"Zitterbewegung".
This is a word
which does not
exist in the
German
vocabulary of
physical
terms. But
Schrödinger
hesitated (by
good reason)
to use the
German word
for
"oscillation".<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
On the other
hand, if the
electron is
built by two
sub-particles,
this solves
the problem.
The
sub-particle
is point-like
(at least with
respect to its
charge), but
both
sub-particles
orbit each
other, which
reserves the
momentum law,
and the
orbital radius
is the reduced
Compton
wavelength. -
The argument
of Martin that
a model of two
sub-particles
is "refuted by
the
experiment" is
often heart
but not
applicable to
my model. The
usual argument
is that a
sufficient
effort has
been done to
decompose an
electron by a
strong
bombardment.
This was also
done here at
DESY. But in
my model the
sub-particles
have no mass
on their own
(the mass of
the electron
is caused by
the dynamics
of the binding
field). And in
such a case
one of the
sub-particles
may be
accelerated by
an arbitrary
amount, the
other one can
always follow
without any
force coming
up. A
decomposition
by bombardment
is therefore
never
possible. - I
have discussed
this point
with the
research
director of
DESY who was
responsible
for such
experiments,
and after at
first
objecting it,
he admitted,
that my model
is not in
conflict with
these
experiments.<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
Martin: Where
do I find your
paper of 1997?<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<u class="yiv0505623334">Regarding
dilation:</u><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
There is a lot
of clear
indications
for dilation.
Two examples:<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
- The atomic
clocks in the
GPS satellites
are slowed
down which has
to be
compensated
for<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
- In the Muon
storage ring
at CERN the
lifetime of
these Muons
was extended
by the great
amount ca.
250, which was
in precise
agreement with
special
relativity.<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
Contraction,
on the other
hand, is in so
far more a
point of
interpretation
as it cannot
be directly
measured - in
contrast to
dilation.<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
Best wishes<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
Albrecht<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334" style="margin:
0cm 0cm
0.0001pt;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
'Times New
Roman',
serif;">Am
26.09.2015 um
01:48 schrieb<span class="yiv0505623334Apple-converted-space"> </span><a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv0505623334moz-txt-link-abbreviated" ymailto="mailto:af.kracklauer@web.de" target="_blank" href="mailto:af.kracklauer@web.de"></a><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:af.kracklauer@web.de">af.kracklauer@web.de</a>:</div>
</div>
<blockquote class="yiv0505623334" type="cite" style="margin-top:
5pt;
margin-bottom:
5pt;">
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334" style="margin:
0cm 0cm
0.0001pt;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
'Times New
Roman',
serif;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana,
sans-serif;">Well!
The water I
was trying to
offer was:
might it not
be a good idea
to distinguish
clearly and
specifically
between the
size of a
point and the
size of the
volumn in
which this
point is
insessently
moving about.
If your 97
paper does
that, my
appologies.
Does it?
Forgive me, I
have over a
couple hundred
papers I'd
like to have
read and
digested
laying about,
I do my best
but still
can't get to
them all. The
chances are
better,
however, if a
paper attracts
lots of
attention
because it
predicted
something new
to be observed
empirically.
Did it? </span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334" style="margin:
0cm 0cm
0.0001pt;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
'Times New
Roman',
serif;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana,
sans-serif;"> </span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334" style="margin:
0cm 0cm
0.0001pt;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
'Times New
Roman',
serif;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana,
sans-serif;">BTW,
I did not
imply that the
work I refered
to is better.
But, it (in
Rowland's
avantar) is
certainly as
extensive as
yours. In any
case, it
potentially
undermines
your
"shot-from-the-hip"
criticism of
Albrecht's
program by
introducing a
feature to
which neither
you nor John
refered to, in
my best
memory, at San
Diego. My
comment was
not intended
ad hominum,
but made on
the presumtion
that you too
have hundreds
of unread
papers
available. </span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334" style="margin:
0cm 0cm
0.0001pt;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
'Times New
Roman',
serif;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana,
sans-serif;"> </span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334" style="margin:
0cm 0cm
0.0001pt;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
'Times New
Roman',
serif;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana,
sans-serif;">Best,
Al</span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334" style="margin:
0cm 0cm
0.0001pt;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
'Times New
Roman',
serif;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana,
sans-serif;"> </span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334" style="margin:
0cm 0cm
0.0001pt;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
'Times New
Roman',
serif;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana,
sans-serif;"> </span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334" style="margin:
0cm 0cm
0.0001pt;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
'Times New
Roman',
serif;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana,
sans-serif;"> <span class="yiv0505623334Apple-converted-space"> </span></span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334" style="border-style:
none none none
solid;
border-left-color:
rgb(195, 217,
229);
border-left-width:
1.5pt;
padding: 0cm
0cm 0cm 8pt;
margin: 7.5pt
3.75pt 3.75pt
7.5pt;
word-wrap:
break-word;">
<div class="yiv0505623334" style="margin-bottom:
7.5pt;">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><b class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt;
font-family:
Verdana,
sans-serif;">Gesendet:</span></b><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana,
sans-serif;"> Freitag,
25. September
2015 um 19:56
Uhr<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<b class="yiv0505623334">Von:</b> "Mark,
Martin van
der"<span class="yiv0505623334Apple-converted-space"> </span><a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv0505623334moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" ymailto="mailto:martin.van.der.mark@philips.com" target="_blank" href="mailto:martin.van.der.mark@philips.com"></a><a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:martin.van.der.mark@philips.com"><martin.van.der.mark@philips.com></a><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<b class="yiv0505623334">An:</b> "Nature
of Light and
Particles -
General
Discussion"<span class="yiv0505623334Apple-converted-space"> </span><a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv0505623334moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" ymailto="mailto:general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org" target="_blank" href="mailto:general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org"></a><a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org"><general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org></a><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<b class="yiv0505623334">Betreff:</b> Re:
[General]
research
papers</span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana,
sans-serif;">Al,
just read what
i wrote. It is
not shooting
from the hip.
I am refering
to actual
experiments,
all cited in
the paper i
refered to.
Further, you
are just
repeating what
i said
already. I can
only bring you
to the water,
i cannot make
you drink. And
then you refer
to other
doubtfull
work, as id it
were better.
Good luck.</span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana,
sans-serif;">Regards,
Martin<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
Verstuurd
vanaf mijn
iPhone</span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana,
sans-serif;"><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
Op 25 sep.
2015 om 19:16
heeft "<a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv0505623334moz-txt-link-abbreviated" ymailto="mailto:af.kracklauer@web.de" target="_blank" href="mailto:af.kracklauer@web.de"></a><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:af.kracklauer@web.de">af.kracklauer@web.de</a>"
<<a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv0505623334moz-txt-link-abbreviated" ymailto="mailto:af.kracklauer@web.de" target="_blank" href="mailto:af.kracklauer@web.de"></a><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:af.kracklauer@web.de">af.kracklauer@web.de</a>>
het volgende
geschreven:<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
</span></div>
</div>
<blockquote class="yiv0505623334" type="cite" style="margin-top:
5pt;
margin-bottom:
5pt;">
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334" style="margin:
0cm 0cm
0.0001pt;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
'Times New
Roman',
serif;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana,
sans-serif;">Dear
Martin,</span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334" style="margin:
0cm 0cm
0.0001pt;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
'Times New
Roman',
serif;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana,
sans-serif;"> </span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334" style="margin:
0cm 0cm
0.0001pt;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
'Times New
Roman',
serif;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana,
sans-serif;">Perhaps
it's my Texas
background,
but I think I
sense some
"shoot'n from
the hip."</span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334" style="margin:
0cm 0cm
0.0001pt;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
'Times New
Roman',
serif;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana,
sans-serif;"> </span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334" style="margin:
0cm 0cm
0.0001pt;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
'Times New
Roman',
serif;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana,
sans-serif;">You
have not done
an experiment,
but (at best)
a calculation
based on some
hypothtical
input of your
choise. Maybe
it's good,
maybe not. </span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334" style="margin:
0cm 0cm
0.0001pt;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
'Times New
Roman',
serif;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana,
sans-serif;"> </span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334" style="margin:
0cm 0cm
0.0001pt;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
'Times New
Roman',
serif;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana,
sans-serif;">The
Sun scatters
as a point
only those
projectiles
that don't get
close. So
far, no
scattering off
electons has
gotten close
enough to
engage any
internal
structure,
"they" say
(I#ll defer to
experts
up-to-date).
Nevertheless,
electrons are
in constant
motion at or
near the speed
of light
(Zitterbewegung)
and therefore
at the time
scales of the
projectiles
buzz around
(zittern) in a
certain amout
of space,
which seems to
me must
manifest
itself as if
there were
spacially
exteneded
structure
within the
scattering
cross-section.
Why not?</span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334" style="margin:
0cm 0cm
0.0001pt;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
'Times New
Roman',
serif;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana,
sans-serif;"> </span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334" style="margin:
0cm 0cm
0.0001pt;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
'Times New
Roman',
serif;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana,
sans-serif;">Not
to defend
Albrecht's
model as he
describes it,
but many folks
(say Peter
Rowlands at
Liverpool, for
example) model
elemtary
particles in
terms of the
partiicle
itself
interacting
with its
induced
virtual image
(denoted by
Peter as the
"rest of the
universe").
This
"inducement"
is a kind of
polarization
effect. Every
charge repells
all other like
charges and
attracts all
other unlike
charges
resulting in
what can be
modeled as a
virtual charge
of the
opposite
gender
superimposed
on itself in
the static
approximation.
But, because
the real
situation is
fluid, the
virtual
charge's
motion is
delayed as
caused by
finite light
speed, so that
the two chase
each other.
Etc. Looks
something like
Albrecht's
pairs.</span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334" style="margin:
0cm 0cm
0.0001pt;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
'Times New
Roman',
serif;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana,
sans-serif;"> </span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334" style="margin:
0cm 0cm
0.0001pt;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
'Times New
Roman',
serif;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana,
sans-serif;">I
too havn't
read your 97
paper yet, but
I bet it's
unlikely that
you all took
such
consideration
into account.</span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334" style="margin:
0cm 0cm
0.0001pt;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
'Times New
Roman',
serif;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana,
sans-serif;"> </span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334" style="margin:
0cm 0cm
0.0001pt;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
'Times New
Roman',
serif;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana,
sans-serif;">Best,
Al </span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334" style="margin:
0cm 0cm
0.0001pt;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
'Times New
Roman',
serif;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana,
sans-serif;"> <span class="yiv0505623334Apple-converted-space"> </span></span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334" style="border-style:
none none none
solid;
border-left-color:
rgb(195, 217,
229);
border-left-width:
1.5pt;
padding: 0cm
0cm 0cm 8pt;
margin: 7.5pt
3.75pt 3.75pt
7.5pt;">
<div class="yiv0505623334" style="margin-bottom:
7.5pt;">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><b class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt;
font-family:
Verdana,
sans-serif;">Gesendet:</span></b><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana,
sans-serif;"> Freitag,
25. September
2015 um 18:44
Uhr<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<b class="yiv0505623334">Von:</b> "Mark,
Martin van
der" <<a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv0505623334moz-txt-link-abbreviated" ymailto="mailto:martin.van.der.mark@philips.com" target="_blank" href="mailto:martin.van.der.mark@philips.com"></a><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:martin.van.der.mark@philips.com">martin.van.der.mark@philips.com</a>><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<b class="yiv0505623334">An:</b> "Nature
of Light and
Particles -
General
Discussion"
<<a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv0505623334moz-txt-link-abbreviated" ymailto="mailto:general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org" target="_blank" href="mailto:general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org"></a><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org">general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org</a>>,
"<a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv0505623334moz-txt-link-abbreviated" ymailto="mailto:phys@a-giese.de" target="_blank" href="mailto:phys@a-giese.de"></a><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:phys@a-giese.de">phys@a-giese.de</a>"
<<a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv0505623334moz-txt-link-abbreviated" ymailto="mailto:phys@a-giese.de" target="_blank" href="mailto:phys@a-giese.de"></a><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:phys@a-giese.de">phys@a-giese.de</a>><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<b class="yiv0505623334">Betreff:</b> Re:
[General]
research
papers</span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334" style="margin:
0cm 0cm
0.0001pt;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
'Times New
Roman',
serif;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;
color: rgb(31,
73, 125);">Dear
Al, dear
Albrecht, dear
all,</span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334" style="margin:
0cm 0cm
0.0001pt;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
'Times New
Roman',
serif;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;
color: rgb(31,
73, 125);">In
the paper John
W and I
published in
1997, the
situation is
explained
briefly but
adequately.</span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334" style="margin:
0cm 0cm
0.0001pt;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
'Times New
Roman',
serif;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;
color: rgb(31,
73, 125);">Clearly
Albrecht has
not read it
or, perhaps he
did but does
not want to
understand it
because it
really
destroys his
work. This is
a double pity,
of course, but
we are talking
science, not
sentiment, and
I do not want
to take away
anything from
the person you
are Albrecht.</span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334" style="margin:
0cm 0cm
0.0001pt;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
'Times New
Roman',
serif;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;
color: rgb(31,
73, 125);">The
electron has a
finite size,
of the oder of
the Compton
wavelength,
but the
Coulomb
interaction is
perfectly
matched in ANY
experiment,
which means
there are no
internal bits
to the
electron and
that it
behaves as a
point-LIKE
scatterer, not
a to be
mistaken by a
POINT as is
done most of
the time. Note
that even the
sun has
point-like
scattering for
all comets
that go round
it, its
gravitational
field seems to
come from the
centre of the
sun. Until you
hit other
bits. There
are no other
bits for the
electron, but
at very high
energy the
4-momentum
exchange
combined with
the resolving
power at that
high energy
make that a
Compton-size
object CANNOT
be resolved in
principle, if
and only if it
is of
electromagnetic
origin.</span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334" style="margin:
0cm 0cm
0.0001pt;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
'Times New
Roman',
serif;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;
color: rgb(31,
73, 125);">The
electron is a
single thing,
of
electromagnetic
origin only,
there is NO
OTHER WAY to
fit the
experimental
results.</span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334" style="margin:
0cm 0cm
0.0001pt;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
'Times New
Roman',
serif;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;
color: rgb(31,
73, 125);">Well,
maybe there is
another way,
but I cannot
see it.
Certainly it
is not two
parts rotating
about each
other, because
that is
refuted by
experiment,
all those
models can go
in the bin and
are a waste of
time and
energy.</span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334" style="margin:
0cm 0cm
0.0001pt;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
'Times New
Roman',
serif;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;
color: rgb(31,
73, 125);">Regards,
Martin</span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334" style="margin:
0cm 0cm
0.0001pt;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
'Times New
Roman',
serif;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;
color: rgb(31,
73, 125);"> </span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial,
sans-serif;
color: navy;">Dr.
Martin B. van
der Mark</span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial,
sans-serif;
color: navy;">Principal
Scientist,
Minimally
Invasive
Healthcare</span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;
color: navy;"> </span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial,
sans-serif;
color: navy;">Philips
Research
Europe -
Eindhoven</span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial,
sans-serif;
color: navy;">High
Tech Campus,
Building 34
(WB2.025)</span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial,
sans-serif;
color: navy;">Prof.
Holstlaan 4</span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial,
sans-serif;
color: navy;">5656
AE Eindhoven,
The
Netherlands</span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial,
sans-serif;
color: navy;">Tel:
+31 40 2747548</span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334" style="margin:
0cm 0cm
0.0001pt;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
'Times New
Roman',
serif;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;
color: rgb(31,
73, 125);"> </span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334" style="border-style:
solid none
none;
border-top-color:
rgb(181, 196,
223);
border-top-width:
1pt; padding:
3pt 0cm 0cm;">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><b class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size:
10pt;
font-family:
Tahoma,
sans-serif;">From:</span></b><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma,
sans-serif;"><span class="yiv0505623334Apple-converted-space"> </span>General [<a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv0505623334moz-txt-link-freetext" ymailto="mailto:general-bounces+martin.van.der.mark=philips.com@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org" target="_blank" href="mailto:general-bounces+martin.van.der.mark=philips.com@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org"></a><a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="mailto:general-bounces+martin.van.der.mark=philips.com@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org">mailto:general-bounces+martin.van.der.mark=philips.com@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org</a>]<span class="yiv0505623334Apple-converted-space"> </span><b class="yiv0505623334">On
Behalf Of<span class="yiv0505623334Apple-converted-space"> </span></b><a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv0505623334moz-txt-link-abbreviated" ymailto="mailto:af.kracklauer@web.de" target="_blank" href="mailto:af.kracklauer@web.de"></a><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:af.kracklauer@web.de">af.kracklauer@web.de</a><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<b class="yiv0505623334">Sent:</b><span class="yiv0505623334Apple-converted-space"> </span>vrijdag 25 september
2015 18:05<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<b class="yiv0505623334">To:</b><span class="yiv0505623334Apple-converted-space"> </span><a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv0505623334moz-txt-link-abbreviated" ymailto="mailto:phys@a-giese.de" target="_blank" href="mailto:phys@a-giese.de"></a><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:phys@a-giese.de">phys@a-giese.de</a>;<span class="yiv0505623334Apple-converted-space"> </span><a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv0505623334moz-txt-link-abbreviated" ymailto="mailto:general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org" target="_blank" href="mailto:general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org"></a><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org">general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org</a><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<b class="yiv0505623334">Cc:</b><span class="yiv0505623334Apple-converted-space"> </span>Nature of Light and
Particles -
General
Discussion<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<b class="yiv0505623334">Subject:</b><span class="yiv0505623334Apple-converted-space"> </span>Re: [General]
research
papers</span></div>
</div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334" style="margin:
0cm 0cm
0.0001pt;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
'Times New
Roman',
serif;"> </div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334" style="margin:
0cm 0cm
0.0001pt;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
'Times New
Roman',
serif;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana,
sans-serif;">Gentelmen:</span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334" style="margin:
0cm 0cm
0.0001pt;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
'Times New
Roman',
serif;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana,
sans-serif;"> </span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334" style="margin:
0cm 0cm
0.0001pt;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
'Times New
Roman',
serif;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana,
sans-serif;">Shouldn't
a clear and
explicit
distinction
between the
"size" of the
electron and
the "extent"
of its
Zitterbewegung
be made. My
best info,
perhaps not
up-to-date, is
that although
scattering
experiments
put an upper
limit on the
size
(10^-19m),
there exists
in fact no
evidence that
the electron
has any finite
size
whatsoever.
This is in
contrast to
the space it
consumes with
its
Zitter-motion,
which is what
would be
calculated
using QM
(Heisenberg
uncertanty
mostly).
Seems to me
that most of
what folks
theorize about
is the latter,
without saying
so, and
perhaps often
without even
recognizing
it. However,
since the
Zitter volumn
will cause
electrons to
be moving
targets, it
must also have
some effect on
its scatering
cross-section
too. I don't
know how this
is sorted out
in scattering
calculations---if
at all.
(Albrectht?)</span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334" style="margin:
0cm 0cm
0.0001pt;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
'Times New
Roman',
serif;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana,
sans-serif;"> </span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334" style="margin:
0cm 0cm
0.0001pt;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
'Times New
Roman',
serif;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana,
sans-serif;">Correct
me if I'm
wrong. Best,
Al</span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334" style="margin:
0cm 0cm
0.0001pt;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
'Times New
Roman',
serif;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana,
sans-serif;"> <span class="yiv0505623334Apple-converted-space"> </span></span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334" style="border-style:
none none none
solid;
border-left-color:
rgb(195, 217,
229);
border-left-width:
1.5pt;
padding: 0cm
0cm 0cm 8pt;
margin: 7.5pt
3.75pt 3.75pt
7.5pt;">
<div class="yiv0505623334" style="margin-bottom:
7.5pt;">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><b class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt;
font-family:
Verdana,
sans-serif;">Gesendet:</span></b><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana,
sans-serif;"> Freitag,
25. September
2015 um 15:06
Uhr<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<b class="yiv0505623334">Von:</b> "Dr.
Albrecht
Giese" <<a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv0505623334moz-txt-link-abbreviated" ymailto="mailto:genmail@a-giese.de" target="_blank" href="mailto:genmail@a-giese.de"></a><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:genmail@a-giese.de">genmail@a-giese.de</a>><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<b class="yiv0505623334">An:</b> "Richard
Gauthier" <<a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv0505623334moz-txt-link-abbreviated" ymailto="mailto:richgauthier@gmail.com" target="_blank" href="mailto:richgauthier@gmail.com"></a><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:richgauthier@gmail.com">richgauthier@gmail.com</a>>,<span class="yiv0505623334Apple-converted-space"> </span><a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv0505623334moz-txt-link-abbreviated" ymailto="mailto:phys@a-giese.de" target="_blank" href="mailto:phys@a-giese.de"></a><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:phys@a-giese.de">phys@a-giese.de</a><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<b class="yiv0505623334">Cc:</b> "Nature
of Light and
Particles -
General
Discussion"
<<a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv0505623334moz-txt-link-abbreviated" ymailto="mailto:general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org" target="_blank" href="mailto:general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org"></a><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org">general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org</a>><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<b class="yiv0505623334">Betreff:</b> Re:
[General]
research
papers</span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana,
sans-serif;">Hello
Richard,<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
according to
present
mainstream
physics the
size of the
electron is
not more than
10^-19 m. This
is concluded
from
scattering
experiments
where the size
of the
electric
charge is the
quantity of
influence.<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
As present
mainstream
physics
(including the
QED of
Feynman)
assume that
the electron
has no
internal
structure and
that the
electric force
is the only
one effective,
this size is
identified
with the size
of the whole
electron. This
is in severe
conflict with
the
calculations
of Schrödinger
and of Wilczek
based on QM.<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
I have the
impression
that several
of us
(including me)
have models of
the electron
which assume
some extension
roughly
compatible
with the QM
calculations.<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
Some details
of my model
related to
this question:
Here the
electron is
built by 2
sub-particles
("basic
particles")
which orbit
each other at
c. The
electric force
is not the
only force
inside. The
radius
following from
the magnetic
moment is the
reduced
Compton
wavelength,
and the mass
of the
electron
follows with
high precision
from this
radius. At
motion the
size decreases
by the
relativistic
factor gamma,
and so the
mass increases
by this
factor. -
However there
was always a
point of a
certain
weakness in my
model: I could
not prove that
the electron
is built by
just 2
sub-particles
carrying 1/2
elementary
charge each.
Now Wilczek
writes in his
article that
in certain
circumstances
-
superconductivity
in the
presence of a
magnetic field
- the electron
is decomposed
into two
halves. This
is the result
of
measurements.
How can this
happen with a
point-like
particle? This
is a mystery
for Wilczek.
But in the
view of my
model it is no
mystery but
quite
plausible. It
only needs now
a quantitative
calculation of
this process
which I
presently do
not have.<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
All the best
to you<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
Albrecht<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<span class="yiv0505623334Apple-converted-space"> </span></span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana,
sans-serif;">Am
23.09.2015 um
19:02 schrieb
Richard
Gauthier:</span></div>
</div>
<blockquote class="yiv0505623334" type="cite" style="margin-top:
5pt;
margin-bottom:
5pt;">
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana,
sans-serif;">Hello
Albrecht,</span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana,
sans-serif;">
Yes, all of
our electron
models here
have a radius
related to the
Compton
wavelength.
Dirac’s
zitterbewegung
amplitude is
1/2 of the
reduced
Compton
wavelength, or
hbar/2mc ,
which is the
radius of the
generic
circulating
charged
photon’s
trajectory in
my circulating
spin 1/2
charged photon
model for a
resting
electron. That
radius
decreases by a
factor of
gamma^2 in a
moving
electron. Does
yours?
Incorporating
a more
detailed spin
1/2 charged
photon model
with the
generic model
could bring
the model's
radius up to
the reduced
Compton
wavelength
hbar/mc.</span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana,
sans-serif;">
all the
best,</span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana,
sans-serif;">
Richard</span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana,
sans-serif;"> <span class="yiv0505623334Apple-converted-space"> </span></span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<blockquote class="yiv0505623334" type="cite" style="margin-top:
5pt;
margin-bottom:
5pt;">
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana,
sans-serif;">On
Sep 22, 2015,
at 11:13 AM,
Dr. Albrecht
Giese <<a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv0505623334moz-txt-link-abbreviated" ymailto="mailto:genmail@a-giese.de" target="_blank" href="mailto:genmail@a-giese.de"></a><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:genmail@a-giese.de">genmail@a-giese.de</a>>
wrote:</span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana,
sans-serif;"> <span class="yiv0505623334Apple-converted-space"> </span></span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana,
sans-serif;">Dear
Richard,<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
thank you for
this reference
to the article
of Frank
Wilczek.<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
He has a
quantum
mechanical
argument to
determine a
size for the
electron. It
is the
application of
the
uncertainty
relation to
the magnetic
moment of the
electron. The
result is as
you write: 2.4
x 10^-12 m,
which is the
Compton
wavelength of
the electron.<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
This is a bit
similar to the
way as Erwin
Schrödinger
has determined
the size of
the electron
using the
Dirac function
in 1930. There
Schrödinger
determined the
"amplitude of
the
zitterbewegung"
also applying
the
uncertainty
relation to
the rest
energy of the
electron. It
was "roughly"
10^-13 m,
which also
meant in his
words the
Compton
wavelength of
the electron.<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
In my electron
model its
radius is 3.86
x 10^-13 m,
which is
exactly the
"reduced"
Compton
wavelength.
But here it is
not an
expectation
value as in
the cases of
Wilczek and
Schrödinger
but the exact
radius of the
orbits of the
basic
particles.<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
Thank you
again and best
wishes<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
Albrecht<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<span class="yiv0505623334Apple-converted-space"> </span></span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana,
sans-serif;">Am
21.09.2015 um
05:01 schrieb
Richard
Gauthier:</span></div>
</div>
<blockquote class="yiv0505623334" type="cite" style="margin-top:
5pt;
margin-bottom:
5pt;">
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana,
sans-serif;">This
2013 Nature
comment “The
enigmatic
electron” by
Frank Wilczek
at <a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv0505623334moz-txt-link-freetext" target="_blank" href="http://www.nature.com/articles/498031a.epdf?referrer_access_token=ben9To-3oo1NBniBt2zIw9RgN0jAjWel9jnR3ZoTv0Mr0WZkh3ZGwaOU__QIZA8EEsfyjmdvPM68ya-MFh194zghek6jh7WqtGYeYWmES35o2U71x2DQVk0PFLoHQk5V5M-cak670GmcqKy2iZm7PPrWZKcv_J3SBA-hRXn4VJI1r9NxMvgmKog-topZaM03&tracking_referrer=www.nature.com"></a><a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://www.nature.com/articles/498031a.epdf?referrer_access_token=ben9To-3oo1NBniBt2zIw9RgN0jAjWel9jnR3ZoTv0Mr0WZkh3ZGwaOU__QIZA8EEsfyjmdvPM68ya-MFh194zghek6jh7WqtGYeYWmES35o2U71x2DQVk0PFLoHQk5V5M-cak670GmcqKy2iZm7PPrWZKcv_J3SBA-hRXn4VJI1r9NxMvgmKog-topZaM03&tracking_referrer=www.nature.com">http://www.nature.com/articles/498031a.epdf?referrer_access_token=ben9To-3oo1NBniBt2zIw9RgN0jAjWel9jnR3ZoTv0Mr0WZkh3ZGwaOU__QIZA8EEsfyjmdvPM68ya-MFh194zghek6jh7WqtGYeYWmES35o2U71x2DQVk0PFLoHQk5V5M-cak670GmcqKy2iZm7PPrWZKcv_J3SBA-hRXn4VJI1r9NxMvgmKog-topZaM03&tracking_referrer=www.nature.com</a> is
worth a look.
He states that
due to QM
effects, the
size of the
electron is
about 2.4 x
10^-12 m,
which is
roughly in the
range of some
of our
electron
models.</span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana,
sans-serif;">
Richard</span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana,
sans-serif;"> <span class="yiv0505623334Apple-converted-space"> </span></span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<blockquote class="yiv0505623334" type="cite" style="margin-top:
5pt;
margin-bottom:
5pt;">
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana,
sans-serif;">On
Sep 16, 2015,
at 12:59 PM,
Wolfgang Baer
<<a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv0505623334moz-txt-link-abbreviated" ymailto="mailto:wolf@nascentinc.com" target="_blank" href="mailto:wolf@nascentinc.com"></a><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:wolf@nascentinc.com">wolf@nascentinc.com</a>>
wrote:</span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana,
sans-serif;"> <span class="yiv0505623334Apple-converted-space"> </span></span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Helvetica,
sans-serif;
background-color:
white;">I
should add you
sent me
Main-2014.pdf
and that may
be the one not
available on
the web sight.</span><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size:
9pt;
font-family:
Helvetica,
sans-serif;
background-color:
white;">I was
looking for a
similar one
that included
the other
topics as
well.</span><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Helvetica,
sans-serif;"><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<span class="yiv0505623334" style="background-color:
white;">If you
do not have
it, its OK, I
just like
reading from
paper.</span><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<span class="yiv0505623334" style="background-color:
white;">best
wishes,</span><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<span class="yiv0505623334" style="background-color:
white;">Wolf</span></span><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size:
9pt;
font-family:
Verdana,
sans-serif;"> <span class="yiv0505623334Apple-converted-space"> </span></span></div>
<pre class="yiv0505623334" style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Courier New'; background-color: white;">Dr. Wolfgang Baer</pre>
<pre class="yiv0505623334" style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Courier New'; background-color: white;">Research Director</pre>
<pre class="yiv0505623334" style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Courier New'; background-color: white;">Nascent Systems Inc.</pre>
<pre class="yiv0505623334" style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Courier New'; background-color: white;">tel/fax 831-659-3120/0432</pre>
<pre class="yiv0505623334" style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Courier New'; background-color: white;">E-mail <span class="yiv0505623334" style="color: purple;"><a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv0505623334" ymailto="mailto:wolf@NascentInc.com" target="_blank" href="mailto:wolf@NascentInc.com" style="color: purple; text-decoration: underline;">wolf@NascentInc.com</a></span></pre>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Helvetica,
sans-serif;">On
9/14/2015
12:45 PM, Dr.
Albrecht Giese
wrote:</span></div>
</div>
<blockquote class="yiv0505623334" type="cite" style="margin-top:
5pt;
margin-bottom:
5pt;
word-spacing:
0px;">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Helvetica,
sans-serif;">John,<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
You wrote a
long text, so
I will enter
my answers
within your
text.</span><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size:
9pt;
font-family:
Helvetica,
sans-serif;"> <span class="yiv0505623334Apple-converted-space"> </span></span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Helvetica,
sans-serif;">Am
14.09.2015 um
02:54 schrieb
John Macken:</span></div>
</div>
<blockquote class="yiv0505623334" type="cite" style="margin-top:
5pt;
margin-bottom:
5pt;">
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">Hello
David and
Albrecht,</span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"> </span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">It was
through the
contact with
this group
that I was
finally able
to understand
the disconnect
that existed
between my
idea of vacuum
energy and the
picture that
others were
obtaining from
my use of the
term
“energy”.
Many of the
mysteries of
quantum
mechanics and
general
relativity can
be traced to
the fact that
fields exist
and yet we do
not have a
clear idea of
what they
are. My
answer is that
we live within
a sea of
vacuum
activity which
is the
physical basis
of the
mysterious
fields. I
combine all
fields into a
single
“spacetime
field” which
is the basis
of all
particles,
fields and
forces.<span class="yiv0505623334apple-converted-space"> </span></span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"> </span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><b class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-family:
Calibri,
sans-serif;">David</span></b><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">, you
asked about
the words<span class="yiv0505623334apple-converted-space"> </span>quantum, quantifying
and
quantizing. I
did a word
search and I
did not use
the word
“quantizing”
in either the
email or the
attachment to
my last post.
However, the
paper<span class="yiv0505623334apple-converted-space"> </span><i class="yiv0505623334">Energetic Spacetime: The New Aether</i><span class="yiv0505623334apple-converted-space"> </span>submitted
to SPIE as
part of the
conference
presentation,
used and
defines the
word
“quantization”.
This paper was
attached to
previous
posts, and is
available at
my website: <span class="yiv0505623334apple-converted-space"> </span><a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv0505623334moz-txt-link-freetext" target="_blank" href="http://onlyspacetime.com/"></a><a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://onlyspacetime.com/">http://onlyspacetime.com/</a></span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"> </span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><b class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-family:
Calibri,
sans-serif;">Albrecht</span></b><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">: I can
combine my
answer to you
with the
clarification
for David of
the word
“quantify” and
its
derivatives.
I claim that
my model of
the universe
“quantifies”
particles and
fields. I
will start my
explanation of
this concept
by giving
examples of
models which
do not
“quantify”
particles and
fields. There
have been
numerous
particle
models from
this group and
others which
show an
electron model
as two balls
orbiting
around a
center of
mass. Most of
the group
identifies
these balls as
photons but
Albrecht names
the two balls
“charges of
the strong
force”. Both
photons and
charges of
strong force
are just
words. To be
quantifiable,
it is
necessary to
describe the
model of the
universe which
gives the
strong force
or the
electromagnetic
force. What
exactly are
these? How
much energy
and energy
density does
one charge of
strong force
have? Can a
photon occupy
a volume
smaller than a
reduced
Compton
wavelength in
radius? Does a
muon have the
same basic
strong force
charge but
just rotate
faster? Are
the charges of
strong force
or photons
made of any
other more
basic
component?</span></div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<div class="yiv0505623334"><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-family:
Helvetica,
sans-serif;">Regarding
charge: This
is a basic
entity in my
model. At some
point a
physical
theory has to
start. My
model starts
with the
assumption
that a charge
is an "atomic"
entity, so
possibly
point-like,
which emits
exchange
particles (in
this point I
follow the
general
understanding
of QM). There
are two types
of charges:
the electric
ones which we
are very
familiar with,
having two
signs, and the
strong ones,
which are not
so obvious in
everyday
physics; they
also have two
signs. In the
physical
nature we find
the charges of
the strong
force only in
configurations
made of those
different
signs, never
isolated. This
is in contrast
to the
electric
charges.<span class="yiv0505623334apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
The basic
particles are
composed of a
collection of
charges of the
strong force
so that both
basic
particles are
bound to each
other in a way
that they keep
a certain
distance. This
distance
characterizes
an elementary
particle. In
several (or
most) cases
there is
additionally
an electric
charge in the
basic
particle.<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
The two
parameters I
have to set -
or to find -
are the shape
of the strong
field in the
elementary
particle. Here
I have defined
an equation
describing a
minimum
multi-pole
field to make
the elementary
particle
stable. The
other setting
is the
strength of
this field.
This strength
can be found
e.g. using the
electron
because the
electron is
well known and
precisely
measured. This
field is then
applicable for
all leptons as
well as for
all quarks. It
is also
applicable for
the photon
with the
restriction
that there may
be a
correction
factor caused
by the fact
that the
photon is not
fundamental in
the sense of
this model but
composed of
(maybe) two
other
particles.<span class="yiv0505623334apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
The size of
the photon is
(at least
roughly)
described by
its
wavelength.
This follows
from the mass
formula
resulting from
my model, as
with this
assumption the
(dynamic) mass
of the photon
is the correct
result.<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
As I wrote,
the results of
this model are
very precise,
the prove is
in practice
only limited
by limitations
of the
measurement
processes.</span><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Helvetica,
sans-serif;"></span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"> </span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">I could
go on with
more questions
until it is
possible to
calculate the
properties of
an electron
from the
answers. So
far both
models lack
any
quantifiable
details except
perhaps a
connection to
the particle’s
Compton
frequency. I
am not
demanding
anything more
than I have
already done.
For example, I
cannot
calculate the
electron’s
Compton
frequency or
the fine
structure
constant.
However, once
I install
these into the
model that I
create, and
combine this
with the
properties of
the spacetime
field, then I
get an
electron.
Installing a
muon’s Compton
frequency
generates a
muon with the
correct
electric
field,
electrostatic
force,
curvature of
spacetime,
gravitational
force and de
Broglie
waves. I am
able to
quantify the
distortion of
spacetime
produced by a
charged
particle, an
electric field
and a photon.
I am able to
test these
models and
show that they
generate both
the correct
energy density
and generate a
black hole
when we reach
the distortion
limits of the
spacetime
field.<span class="yiv0505623334apple-converted-space"> </span></span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Helvetica,
sans-serif;">In
my model the
Compton
frequency of
the electron
(and of the
other leptons)
follows
directly from
the size of
the particle
and the fact
that the basic
particle move
with c. The
fine structure
constant tells
us the
relation of
the electric
force to the
strong force.
This
explanation
follows very
directly from
this model,
however was
also found by
other
theorists
using algebra
of particle
physics.<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
Another result
of the model
is that
Planck's
constant -
multiplied by
c - is the
field constant
of the strong
force. Also
this is the
result of
other models
(however not
of mainstream
physics).<span class="yiv0505623334Apple-converted-space"> </span></span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;"> </span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"> </span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">My model
starts with a
quantifiable
description of
the properties
of spacetime.
The spacetime
model has a
specific
impedance
which
describes the
properties of
waves that can
exist in
spacetime.
Then the
amplitude and
frequency of
the waves in
spacetime is
quantified.
This
combination
allows the
energy density
of spacetime
to be
calculated and
this agrees
with the
energy density
of zero point
energy. The
particle
models are
then defined
as ½<span class="yiv0505623334apple-converted-space"> </span>ħ<span class="yiv0505623334apple-converted-space"> </span>units of quantized
angular
momentum
existing in
the spacetime
field. This
model is
quantifiable
as to size,
structure,
energy, etc.
Also the fact
that the rate
of time and
proper volume
is being
modulated, it
is possible to
calculate the
effect that
such a
structure
would have on
the
surrounding
volume of
spacetime. It
is possible to
calculate the
effect if the
spacetime-based
particle model
would have if
the coupling
constant was
equal to 1
(Planck
charge), To
get charge<span class="yiv0505623334apple-converted-space"> </span><i class="yiv0505623334">e</i>,
it is
necessary to
manually
install the
fine structure
constant. <span class="yiv0505623334apple-converted-space"> </span></span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Helvetica,
sans-serif;">How
do you get the
value<span class="yiv0505623334apple-converted-space"> </span></span><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-family: Helvetica, sans-serif;">½<span class="yiv0505623334apple-converted-space"> </span>ħ</span><span class="yiv0505623334apple-converted-space"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Helvetica,
sans-serif;"> </span></span><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Helvetica,
sans-serif;">for
the angular
momentum? What
is the
calculation
behind it? - I
understand
that in your
model the
electric
charge is a
parameter
deduced from
other facts.
Which ones?
From alpha?
How do you
then get
alpha?<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
I personally
have in so far
a problem with
all
considerations
using
spacetime as I
have quite
thoroughly
investigated
how Einstein
came to the
idea of this
4-dimentional
construct. His
main
motivation was
that he wanted
in any case to
avoid an
ether. And in
his
discussions
with Ernst
Mach he had to
realize that
he was running
into a lot of
problems with
this
assumption. He
could solve
these problems
in general by
his "curved
spacetime".
But this
concept still
causes logical
conflicts
which are
eagerly
neglected by
the followers
of Einstein's
relativity
(and which do
not exist in
the Lorentzian
way of
relativity).<span class="yiv0505623334Apple-converted-space"> </span></span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"> </span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">The
quantifiable
properties of
spacetime
imply that
there should
be boundary
conditions
which imply
that the waves
in spacetime
should be
nonlinear.
When the
nonlinear
component is
calculated and
treated as
separate
waves, the
characteristics
of the
particle’s
gravitational
field are
obtained
(correct:
curvature,
effect on the
rate of time,
force and
energy
density).</span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;"> </span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">In my
last post I
have given an
answer about
the factor of
10<sup class="yiv0505623334">120</sup><span class="yiv0505623334apple-converted-space"> </span>difference between
the observable
energy density
of the
universe and
the
non-observable
energy of the
universe.
This
non-observable
energy density
is absolutely
necessary for
QED
calculations,
zero point
energy, the
uncertainty
principle,
Lamb shift,
spontaneous
emission and
quantum
mechanics in
general. This
non-observable
energy density
is responsible
for the
tremendously
large
impedance of
spacetime c<sup class="yiv0505623334">3</sup>/G. Since I can also show how this
non-observable
energy density
is obtainable
from
gravitational
wave
equations, it
is necessary
for<span class="yiv0505623334apple-converted-space"> </span><b class="yiv0505623334">you</b><span class="yiv0505623334apple-converted-space"> </span>to
show how all
these effects
can be
achieved
without
spacetime
being a single
field with
this
non-observable
energy
density. In
fact, the name
non-observable
only applied
to direct
observation.
The indirect
evidence is
everywhere.
It forms the
basis of the
universe and
therefore is
the
“background
noise” of the
universe. For
this reason it
is not
directly
observable
because we can
only detect
differences in
energy. The
constants<span class="yiv0505623334apple-converted-space"> </span><i class="yiv0505623334">c,</i><span class="yiv0505623334apple-converted-space"> </span><i class="yiv0505623334">G</i>,<span class="yiv0505623334apple-converted-space"> </span><i class="yiv0505623334">ħ</i><span class="yiv0505623334apple-converted-space"> </span>and<span class="yiv0505623334apple-converted-space"> </span><i class="yiv0505623334">ε<sub class="yiv0505623334">o</sub></i><span class="yiv0505623334apple-converted-space"> </span>testify
that spacetime
is not an
empty void. <span class="yiv0505623334apple-converted-space"> </span></span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Helvetica,
sans-serif;">Up
to now I did
not find any
necessity for
zero-point
energy. And I
find it a
dangerous way
to assume
physical facts
which cannot
be observed.
The greatest
argument in
favour of this
energy is its
use in Feynman
diagrams. But
is there
really no
other way? I
have a lecture
of Feynman
here where he
states that
his formalism
has good
results. But
that he has no
physical
understanding
why it is
successful. In
my
understanding
of the
development of
physics this
is a weak
point.<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
The
discrepancy of
10^120 between
assumed and
observed
energy is
taken as a
great and
unresolved
problem by
present main
stream
physics. Those
representatives
would have all
reason to find
a solution to
keep present
QM clean. But
they are not
able to. This
causes me some
concern.<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
The constants
you have
listed: c is
the speed of
light what
ever the
reason for it
is. (I have a
model, but it
is a bit
speculative.)
But it has
nothing to do
with energy. G
is the
gravitational
constant which
is as little
understood as
gravity
itself.
Planck's
constant I
have
explained, it
is (with c)
the field
constant of
the strong
force (any
force has to
be described
by a field
constant); and<span class="yiv0505623334apple-converted-space"> </span></span><i class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-family: Helvetica, sans-serif;">ε<sub class="yiv0505623334">o</sub></span></i><span class="yiv0505623334apple-converted-space"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Helvetica,
sans-serif;"> </span></span><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Helvetica,
sans-serif;">is
the field
constant of
the electric
force with a
similar
background.<span class="yiv0505623334Apple-converted-space"> </span></span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;"> </span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"> </span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">If
spacetime was
an empty void,
why should
particles have
a speed limit
of<span class="yiv0505623334apple-converted-space"> </span><i class="yiv0505623334">c</i>? For a thought experiment, suppose that two
spaceships
leave earth
going opposite
directions and
accelerate
until they
reach a speed
of 0.75<span class="yiv0505623334apple-converted-space"> </span><i class="yiv0505623334">c</i><span class="yiv0505623334apple-converted-space"> </span>relative
to the earth.
The earth
bound observer
sees them
separating at
1.5<span class="yiv0505623334apple-converted-space"> </span><i class="yiv0505623334">c</i><span class="yiv0505623334apple-converted-space"> </span>but
the rules of
relativistic
addition of
velocity has a
spaceship
observer
seeing the
other
spaceship
moving away at
only 0.96<span class="yiv0505623334apple-converted-space"> </span><i class="yiv0505623334">c</i>.
How is this
possible if
spacetime is
an empty
void. My
model of the
universe
answers this
because all
particles,
fields and
forces are
also made of
the spacetime
field and they
combine to
achieve
Lorentz
transformations
which affects
ruler length
and clocks.
None of this
can happen
unless
spacetime is
filled with
dipole waves
in spacetime
and everything
is made of the
single
component.
The universe
is only
spacetime.<span class="yiv0505623334apple-converted-space"> </span></span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Helvetica,
sans-serif;">If
two spaceships
move at 0.75 c
in opposite
direction, the
observer at
rest may add
these speeds
and may get
1.5 c as a
result. Why
not? If an
observer in
one of the
spaceships
measures the
relative speed
of the other
spaceship, the
result will be
less then c
(as you write
it). The
reason is the
well known
fact that the
measurement
tools
accessible for
the observer
in the ship
are changed
and run
differently at
this high
speed. The
reason for
these changes
is for time
dilation the
internal speed
c in
elementary
particles. For
contraction it
is the
contraction of
fields at
motion which
is a fact
independent of
relativity
(and which was
already known
before
Einstein). In
addition when
the speed of
another object
is to be
measured
several clocks
are to be used
positioned
along the
measurement
section. These
clocks are
de-synchronized
in relation to
the clocks of
the observer
at rest. These
phenomena
together cause
the
measurement
result < c.
You find these
considerations
in papers and
books about
the Lorentzian
interpretation
of relativity.
So, following
Lorentz, there
is no reason
to assume
Einstein's
spacetime.</span><span class="yiv0505623334apple-converted-space"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-family:
Helvetica,
sans-serif;"> </span></span><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Helvetica,
sans-serif;"></span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">John M.</span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Helvetica,
sans-serif;">Perhaps
I should read
your book. But
that chould
take a lot of
time, I am
afraid.<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
Albrecht<span class="yiv0505623334Apple-converted-space"> </span></span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;"> </span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"> </span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334" style="border-style:
solid none
none;
border-top-color:
rgb(225, 225,
225);
border-top-width:
1pt; padding:
3pt 0cm 0cm;">
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><b class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size:
11pt;
font-family:
Calibri,
sans-serif;">From:</span></b><span class="yiv0505623334apple-converted-space"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size:
11pt;
font-family:
Calibri,
sans-serif;"> </span></span><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;">Dr.
Albrecht Giese
[<a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv0505623334moz-txt-link-freetext" ymailto="mailto:genmail@a-giese.de" target="_blank" href="mailto:genmail@a-giese.de"></a><a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="mailto:genmail@a-giese.de">mailto:genmail@a-giese.de</a>]<span class="yiv0505623334apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<b class="yiv0505623334">Sent:</b><span class="yiv0505623334apple-converted-space"> </span>Sunday, September 13,
2015 1:43 PM<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<b class="yiv0505623334">To:</b><span class="yiv0505623334apple-converted-space"> </span>John Macken<span class="yiv0505623334apple-converted-space"> </span><a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv0505623334moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" ymailto="mailto:john@macken.com" target="_blank" href="mailto:john@macken.com"></a><a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:john@macken.com"><john@macken.com></a>;
'Nature of
Light and
Particles -
General
Discussion'<span class="yiv0505623334apple-converted-space"> </span><<a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv0505623334moz-txt-link-abbreviated" ymailto="mailto:general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org" target="_blank" href="mailto:general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org"></a><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org">general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org</a>><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<b class="yiv0505623334">Subject:</b><span class="yiv0505623334apple-converted-space"> </span>Re: [General]
research
papers</span></div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;"> </span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334MsoNormal" style="margin:
0cm 0cm 10pt;
line-height:
17.1200008392334px;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
Cambria;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;">Hello
John,<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
great that you
have looked so
deeply into
the model
which I have
presented.
Thank you.<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
There are some
questions
which I can
answer quite
easily. I
think that
this model in
fact explains
several points
just in
contrast to
main stream
physics. In
standard
physics the
electron (just
as an example)
is a
point-like
object without
any internal
structure. So,
how can a
magnetic
moment be
explained? How
can the spin
be explained?
How can the
mass be
explained? The
position of
main stream
physics is:
That cannot be
explained but
is subject to
quantum
mechanics. And
the fact that
it cannot be
explained
shows how
necessary QM
is.<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
In contrast,
if the
electron is
assumed to
have a
structure like
in the model
presented,
these
parameters can
be explained
in a classical
way, and this
explanation is
not merely a
qualitative
one but has
precise
quantitative
results.<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
To your
questions in
detail:<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
The fact of
two basic
particles is
necessary to
explain the
fact of an
oscillation
and to fulfil
the
conservation
of momentum. A
single object
(as
point-like)
cannot
oscillate. The
basic
particles are
composed of
charges of the
strong force.
In this model
the strong
force is
assumed to be
the universal
force in our
world
effective on
all particles.
A charge is a
fundamental
object in the
scope of this
model. There
are two kinds
of charges
according to
the two kinds
of forces in
our world, the
strong one and
the electric
one. The weak
force is in
fact the
strong force
but has a
smaller
coupling
constant
caused by
geometric
circumstances.
And gravity is
not a force at
all but a
refraction
process, which
is so a side
effect of the
other forces.
And, by the
way, gravity
is not curved
spacetime.
This is not
necessary, and
besides of
this,
Einstein's
spacetime
leads to
logical
conflicts.<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
The forces
(i.e. strong
force) inside
an elementary
particle are
configured in
a way that at
a certain
distance there
is a potential
minimum and in
this way the
distance
between the
basic
particles is
enforced. So,
this field has
attracting and
repulsive
components.
Outside the
elementary
particle the
attracting
forces
dominate to
make the
particle a
stable one.
And those
field parts
outside have
an opposite
sign. Now, as
the basic
particles are
orbiting each
other, the
outside field
is an
alternating
field (of the
strong forth).
If this field
propagates, it
is builds a
wave. This
wave is
described by
the
Schrödinger
equation and
fulfils the
assumptions of
de Broglie.<span class="yiv0505623334apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
With the
assumption of
two basic
particles
orbiting at c
and subject to
strong force,
the parameters
mass, magnetic
moment, spin
result from it
numerically
correctly
without
further
assumptions.<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
This model
does not need
any vacuum
energy or
virtual
particles.
Those are
simply not
necessary and
they are
anyway very
speculative
because not
directly
observable.
And in the
case of the
vacuum energy
of the
universe we
are confronted
with the
discrepancy of
10^120 which
you also
mention in
your paper
attached to
your mail.<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
The Coulomb
law can be
easily
explained by
the assumption
(standard at
quantum
mechanics)
that a force
is realized by
exchange
particles. The
density of
exchange
particles and
so the
strength of
the field
diminishes by
1/r^2, which
is simple
geometry.<span class="yiv0505623334apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
So John, this
is my
position. Now
I am curious
about your
objections of
further
questions.<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
Best regards<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
Albrecht<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
</span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;">Am
11.09.2015 um
23:51 schrieb
John Macken:</span></div>
</div>
</div>
<blockquote class="yiv0505623334" type="cite" style="margin-top:
5pt;
margin-bottom:
5pt;">
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">Hello
Albrecht and
All,</span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"> </span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">I have
attached a one
page addition
that I will
make to my
book. It is a
preliminary
explanation of
my model of
the spacetime
field. It has
been very
helpful to me
to interact
with this
group because
I now
understand
better the key
stumbling
block for some
scientists to
accept my
thesis.
Therefore I
have written
the attached
introduction
to ease the
reader of my
book into my
model. <span class="yiv0505623334apple-converted-space"> </span></span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"> </span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><b class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-family:
Calibri,
sans-serif;">Albrecht:</span></b><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"> <span class="yiv0505623334apple-converted-space"> </span>I
appreciate
your email.
We agree on
several points
which include
the size of
the electron
and there is a
similarity in
the
explanation of
gravity. The
key points of
disagreement
are the same
as I have with
the rest of
the group.
Your
explanation of
a fundamental
particle is
not really an
explanation.
You substitute
a fundamental
particle such
as an electron
with two
“basic
particles”.
Have we made
any progress
or did we just
double the
problem? What
is your basic
particles made
of? What is
the physics
behind the
force of
attraction
between the
particles?
What is the
physics behind
an electric
field? How
does your
model create
de Broglie
waves? How
does your
model create a
gravitational
field (curved
spacetime)?
Can you derive
the Coulomb
law and
Newtonian
gravitational
equation from
your model? <span class="yiv0505623334apple-converted-space"> </span></span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"> </span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">These
might seem
like unfair
questions, but
my model does
all of these
things. All it
requires is
the reader
accept the
fact that the
vacuum
possesses
activity which
can be
characterized
as a type of
energy density
that is not
observable (no
rest mass or
momentum).
This is no
different that
accepting that
QED
calculations
should be
believed when
they assume
vacuum energy
or that zero
point energy
really
exists. <span class="yiv0505623334apple-converted-space"> </span></span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"> </span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><b class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-family:
Calibri,
sans-serif;">Albrecht</span></b><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">,
perhaps I have
come on too
strong, but I
have decided
to take a
firmer stand.
You just
happen to be
the first
person that I
contrast to my
model. I am
actually happy
to discuss the
scientific
details in a
less
confrontational
way. I just
wanted to make
an initial
point.</span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"> </span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">John M.</span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"> </span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334" style="border-style:
solid none
none;
border-top-color:
rgb(225, 225,
225);
border-top-width:
1pt; padding:
3pt 0cm 0cm;">
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><b class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size:
11pt;
font-family:
Calibri,
sans-serif;">From:</span></b><span class="yiv0505623334apple-converted-space"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size:
11pt;
font-family:
Calibri,
sans-serif;"> </span></span><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;">General
[</span><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;
color:
purple;"><a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv0505623334moz-txt-link-freetext" ymailto="mailto:general-bounces+john=macken.com@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org" target="_blank" href="mailto:general-bounces+john=macken.com@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org"></a><a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="mailto:general-bounces+john=macken.com@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org">mailto:general-bounces+john=macken.com@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org</a></span><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;">]<span class="yiv0505623334apple-converted-space"> </span><b class="yiv0505623334">On
Behalf Of<span class="yiv0505623334apple-converted-space"> </span></b>Dr. Albrecht
Giese<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<b class="yiv0505623334">Sent:</b><span class="yiv0505623334apple-converted-space"> </span>Friday, September 11,
2015 9:52 AM<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<b class="yiv0505623334">To:</b><span class="yiv0505623334apple-converted-space"> </span><a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv0505623334moz-txt-link-abbreviated" ymailto="mailto:general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org" target="_blank" href="mailto:general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org"></a><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org">general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org</a><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<b class="yiv0505623334">Subject:</b><span class="yiv0505623334apple-converted-space"> </span>Re: [General]
research
papers</span></div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;"> </span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;">Dear
John Macken,<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
I would like
to answer a
specific topic
in your mail
below. You
write "...
would have
particular
relevance to
the concept
that the Higgs
field is
needed to give
inertia to
fermions".<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
We should not
overlook that
even
mainstream
physicists
working on
elementary
particles
admit that the
Higgs theory
is not able to
explain
inertia. I
give you as a
reference:<span class="yiv0505623334apple-converted-space"> </span></span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334MsoNormal" style="margin:
0cm 0cm 10pt;
line-height:
17.1200008392334px;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
Cambria;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;">>Steven
D. Brass, The
cosmological
constant
puzzle,
Journal of
Physics G,
Nuclear and
Particle
Physics 38,
4(2011)
43201< ,</span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334MsoNormal" style="margin:
0cm 0cm 10pt;
line-height:
17.1200008392334px;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
Cambria;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">which
has the result
that the Higgs
field, which
causes inertia
according to
the theory, is
by at least 56
orders of
magnitude too
small to
explain the
mass of the
elementary
particles.
(Another
weakness is
the fact that
the Higgs
theory does
not tell us
the mass of
any elementary
particle even
if all other
parameters are
known.)<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
As you may
remember, in
our meeting I
have presented
a model
explaining
inertia which
does not only
work as a
general idea
but provides
very precise
results for
the mass of
leptons. The
mass is
classically
deduced from
the size of a
particle. It
also explains
the mass of
quarks, but
here the
verification
is more
difficult, due
to the lack of
measurements.
In addition I
have shown
that the model
also explains
the (dynamic)
mass of
photons, if
the size of a
photon is
related to its
wavelength.<span class="yiv0505623334apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
You may find
details in the
proceedings of
our San Diego
meeting, but
also on the
following web
sites:<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
</span><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-family:
Calibri,
sans-serif;
color:
purple;"><a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv0505623334moz-txt-link-abbreviated" target="_blank" href="http://www.ag-physics.org/rmass"></a><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.ag-physics.org/rmass">www.ag-physics.org/rmass</a></span><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
</span><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-family:
Calibri,
sans-serif;
color:
purple;"><a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv0505623334moz-txt-link-abbreviated" target="_blank" href="http://www.ag-physics.org/electron"></a><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.ag-physics.org/electron">www.ag-physics.org/electron</a></span><span class="yiv0505623334apple-converted-space"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-family:
Calibri,
sans-serif;"> </span></span><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">.<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
You may also
find the sites
by Google
search
entering the
string "origin
of mass". You
will find it
on position 1
or 2 of the
list, where it
has constantly
been during
the past 12
years.<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
If you have
any questions
about it,
please ask me.
I will be
happy about
any
discussion.<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
With best
regards<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
Albrecht Giese</span><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size:
11pt;
font-family:
Calibri,
sans-serif;"> </span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">Am
04.09.2015 um
18:40 schrieb
John Macken:</span></div>
</div>
</div>
<blockquote class="yiv0505623334" type="cite" style="margin-top:
5pt;
margin-bottom:
5pt;">
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">Martin,</span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"> </span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">I wanted
to remind you
that I think
that you
should update
your article
“Light Is
Heavy” to
include the
mathematical
proof that
confined light
has exactly
the same
inertia as
particles with
equal energy.
Accelerating a
reflecting box
causes
different
photon
pressure which
results in a
net inertial
force. I
already
reference your
Light Is Heavy
article in my
book, but
expanding the
article would
be even
better. An
expanded
article would
have
particular
relevance to
the concept
that the Higgs
field is
needed to give
inertia to
fermions. The
Higgs field is
not needed to
give inertia
to confined
light.
Furthermore,
confined light
exerts exactly
the correct
inertia and
kinetic
energy, even
at
relativistic
conditions. I
have not seen
a proof that
the Higgs
field gives
exactly the
correct amount
of inertia or
kinetic energy
to fermions.
Any particle
model that
includes
either a
confined
photon or
confined waves
in spacetime
propagating at
the speed of
light gets
inertia and
kinetic energy
from the same
principles as
confined light
in a
reflecting
box.</span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"> </span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">John M.<span class="yiv0505623334apple-converted-space"> </span></span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334" style="border-style:
solid none
none;
border-top-color:
rgb(225, 225,
225);
border-top-width:
1pt; padding:
3pt 0cm 0cm;">
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><b class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size:
11pt;
font-family:
Calibri,
sans-serif;">From:</span></b><span class="yiv0505623334apple-converted-space"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size:
11pt;
font-family:
Calibri,
sans-serif;"> </span></span><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;">General
[</span><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;
color:
purple;"><a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv0505623334moz-txt-link-freetext" ymailto="mailto:general-bounces+john=macken.com@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org" target="_blank" href="mailto:general-bounces+john=macken.com@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org"></a><a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="mailto:general-bounces+john=macken.com@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org">mailto:general-bounces+john=macken.com@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org</a></span><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;">]<span class="yiv0505623334apple-converted-space"> </span><b class="yiv0505623334">On
Behalf Of<span class="yiv0505623334apple-converted-space"> </span></b>Mark, Martin van
der<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<b class="yiv0505623334">Sent:</b><span class="yiv0505623334apple-converted-space"> </span>Friday, September 04,
2015 6:34 AM<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<b class="yiv0505623334">To:</b><span class="yiv0505623334apple-converted-space"> </span>Nature of Light and
Particles -
General
Discussion<span class="yiv0505623334apple-converted-space"> </span><<a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv0505623334moz-txt-link-abbreviated" ymailto="mailto:general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org" target="_blank" href="mailto:general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org"></a><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org">general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org</a>><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<b class="yiv0505623334">Subject:</b><span class="yiv0505623334apple-converted-space"> </span>[General] research
papers</span></div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;"> </span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334MsoNormal" style="margin:
0cm 0cm 10pt;
line-height:
17.1200008392334px;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
Cambria;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;
color: rgb(31,
73, 125);">Dear
all,</span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334MsoNormal" style="margin:
0cm 0cm 10pt;
line-height:
17.1200008392334px;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
Cambria;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;
color: rgb(31,
73, 125);">My
recent (and
old) work can
be found on
Researchgate:</span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334MsoNormal" style="margin:
0cm 0cm 10pt;
line-height:
17.1200008392334px;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
Cambria;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;
color: rgb(31,
73, 125);"><a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv0505623334" target="_blank" href="https://www.researchgate.net/profile/Martin_Van_der_Mark/publications" style="color:
purple;
text-decoration:
underline;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="color: purple;"></span></a><a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv0505623334moz-txt-link-freetext" target="_blank" href="https://www.researchgate.net/profile/Martin_Van_der_Mark/publications"></a><a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://www.researchgate.net/profile/Martin_Van_der_Mark/publications">https://www.researchgate.net/profile/Martin_Van_der_Mark/publications</a></span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334MsoNormal" style="margin:
0cm 0cm 10pt;
line-height:
17.1200008392334px;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
Cambria;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;
color: rgb(31,
73, 125);">In
particular you
will find the
most recent
work:</span></div>
<ul class="yiv0505623334" style="margin-bottom:
0cm;" type="disc">
<li class="yiv0505623334MsoNormal" style="margin:
0cm 0cm 10pt;
line-height:
17.1200008392334px;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
Cambria;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;">On
the nature of
“stuff” and
the hierarchy
of forces</span><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana,
sans-serif;"></span></li>
<li class="yiv0505623334MsoNormal" style="margin:
0cm 0cm 10pt;
line-height:
17.1200008392334px;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
Cambria;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;">Quantum
mechanical
probability
current as
electromagnetic
4-current from
topological EM
fields</span><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana,
sans-serif;"></span></li>
</ul>
<div class="yiv0505623334MsoNormal" style="margin:
0cm 0cm 10pt;
line-height:
17.1200008392334px;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
Cambria;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;
color: rgb(31,
73, 125);">Very
best regards,</span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334MsoNormal" style="margin:
0cm 0cm 10pt;
line-height:
17.1200008392334px;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
Cambria;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;
color: rgb(31,
73, 125);">Martin</span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;"> </span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial,
sans-serif;
color: navy;">Dr.
Martin B. van
der Mark</span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial,
sans-serif;
color: navy;">Principal
Scientist,
Minimally
Invasive
Healthcare</span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;
color: navy;"> </span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial,
sans-serif;
color: navy;">Philips
Research
Europe -
Eindhoven</span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial,
sans-serif;
color: navy;">High
Tech Campus,
Building 34
(WB2.025)</span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial,
sans-serif;
color: navy;">Prof.
Holstlaan 4</span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial,
sans-serif;
color: navy;">5656
AE Eindhoven,
The
Netherlands</span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial,
sans-serif;
color: navy;">Tel:
+31 40 2747548</span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif;"> </span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"> </span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334MsoNormal" style="margin:
0cm 0cm 10pt;
line-height:
17.1200008392334px;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
Cambria;" align="center"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana,
sans-serif;"></span>
<hr class="yiv0505623334" size="3" width="100%" align="center"></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 7.5pt; font-family: Arial,
sans-serif;
color: gray;">The
information
contained in
this message
may be
confidential
and legally
protected
under
applicable
law. The
message is
intended
solely for the
addressee(s).
If you are not
the intended
recipient, you
are hereby
notified that
any use,
forwarding,
dissemination,
or
reproduction
of this
message is
strictly
prohibited and
may be
unlawful. If
you are not
the intended
recipient,
please contact
the sender by
return e-mail
and destroy
all copies of
the original
message.</span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size:
11pt;
font-family:
Calibri,
sans-serif;"> </span></div>
</div>
<pre class="yiv0505623334" style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Courier New'; background-color: white;">_______________________________________________</pre>
<pre class="yiv0505623334" style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Courier New'; background-color: white;">If you no longer wish to receive communication from the Nature of Light and Particles General Discussion List at <span class="yiv0505623334" style="color: purple;"><a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv0505623334" ymailto="mailto:phys@a-giese.de" target="_blank" href="mailto:phys@a-giese.de" style="color: purple; text-decoration: underline;">phys@a-giese.de</a></span></pre>
<pre class="yiv0505623334" style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Courier New'; background-color: white;"><a href=<a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv0505623334" target="_blank" href="http://lists.natureoflightandparticles.org/options.cgi/general-natureoflightandparticles.org/phys%40a-giese.de?unsub=1&unsubconfirm=1" style="color: purple; text-decoration: underline;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="color: purple;">"http://lists.natureoflightandparticles.org/options.cgi/general-natureoflightandparticles.org/phys%40a-giese.de?unsub=1&unsubconfirm=1"</span></a>></pre>
<pre class="yiv0505623334" style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Courier New'; background-color: white;">Click here to unsubscribe</pre>
<pre class="yiv0505623334" style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Courier New'; background-color: white;"></a></pre>
</blockquote>
<div class="yiv0505623334MsoNormal" style="margin:
0cm 0cm 10pt;
line-height:
17.1200008392334px;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
Cambria;"><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size:
11pt;
font-family:
Calibri,
sans-serif;"> </span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334MsoNormal" style="margin:
0cm 0cm 10pt;
line-height:
17.1200008392334px;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
Cambria;" align="center"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana,
sans-serif;"></span>
<hr 144,="" 144);"="" class="" noshade="style="color:rgb(144," size="1" width="99%" align="center"></div>
<table class="yiv0505623334MsoNormalTable" style="border-collapse:
collapse;" border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0">
<tbody class="yiv0505623334">
<tr class="yiv0505623334">
<td colspan="1" rowspan="1" class="yiv0505623334" style="padding:
0cm 11.25pt
0cm 6pt;">
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv0505623334" target="_blank" href="https://www.avast.com/antivirus" style="color:
purple;
text-decoration:
underline;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="color: purple; border: 1pt solid
windowtext;
padding: 0cm;
text-decoration:
none;"><Mail
Attachment.jpeg></span></a></span></div>
</div>
</td>
<td colspan="1" rowspan="1" class="yiv0505623334" style="padding:
0.75pt;">
<div class="yiv0505623334" style="margin-top:
0px;
margin-bottom:
0px;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-family:
Calibri,
sans-serif;
color: rgb(61,
77, 90);">Diese
E-Mail wurde
von Avast
Antivirus-Software
auf Viren
geprüft.<span class="yiv0505623334apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
</span><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-family:
Calibri,
sans-serif;
color:
purple;"><a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv0505623334moz-txt-link-abbreviated" target="_blank" href="http://www.avast.com/"></a><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.avast.com/">www.avast.com</a></span></div>
</td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"> </span></div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<div class="yiv0505623334MsoNormal" style="margin:
0cm 0cm 10pt;
line-height:
17.1200008392334px;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
Cambria;"><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size:
11pt;
font-family:
Calibri,
sans-serif;"> </span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334MsoNormal" style="margin:
0cm 0cm 10pt;
line-height:
17.1200008392334px;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
Cambria;" align="center"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana,
sans-serif;"></span>
<hr 144,="" 144);"="" class="" noshade="style="color:rgb(144," size="1" width="99%" align="center"></div>
<table class="yiv0505623334MsoNormalTable" style="border-collapse:
collapse;" border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0">
<tbody class="yiv0505623334">
<tr class="yiv0505623334">
<td colspan="1" rowspan="1" class="yiv0505623334" style="padding:
0cm 11.25pt
0cm 6pt;">
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv0505623334" target="_blank" href="https://www.avast.com/antivirus" style="color:
purple;
text-decoration:
underline;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="color: purple; border: 1pt solid
windowtext;
padding: 0cm;
text-decoration:
none;"><Mail
Attachment.jpeg></span></a></span></div>
</div>
</td>
<td colspan="1" rowspan="1" class="yiv0505623334" style="padding:
0.75pt;">
<div class="yiv0505623334" style="margin-top:
0px;
margin-bottom:
0px;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-family:
Calibri,
sans-serif;
color: rgb(61,
77, 90);">Diese
E-Mail wurde
von Avast
Antivirus-Software
auf Viren
geprüft.<span class="yiv0505623334apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
</span><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-family:
Calibri,
sans-serif;
color:
purple;"><a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv0505623334moz-txt-link-abbreviated" target="_blank" href="http://www.avast.com/"></a><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.avast.com/">www.avast.com</a></span></div>
</td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"> </span></div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334"><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size:
9pt;
font-family:
Helvetica,
sans-serif;"> <span class="yiv0505623334Apple-converted-space"> </span></span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334MsoNormal" style="margin:
0cm 0cm 10pt;
line-height:
17.1200008392334px;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
Cambria;" align="center"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana,
sans-serif;"></span>
<hr class="" noshade="style="width:960.05pt;"" size="1" width="1280" align="center"></div>
<table class="yiv0505623334MsoNormalTable" style="border-collapse:
collapse;" border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0">
<tbody class="yiv0505623334">
<tr class="yiv0505623334">
<td colspan="1" rowspan="1" class="yiv0505623334" style="padding:
0cm 11.25pt
0cm 6pt;">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv0505623334" target="_blank" href="https://www.avast.com/antivirus" style="color:
purple;
text-decoration:
underline;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="color: purple; text-decoration: none;"><img moz-do-not-send="true" class="yiv0505623334" id="yiv0505623334_x0000_i1029" src="http://static.avast.com/emails/avast-mail-stamp.png" alt="Avast
logo" data-id="80d19eda-2acf-c58b-d8da-5c04853914b0" border="0"></span></a></div>
</td>
<td colspan="1" rowspan="1" class="yiv0505623334" style="padding:
0.75pt;">
<div class="yiv0505623334" style="margin-top:
0px;
margin-bottom:
0px;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-family:
Calibri,
sans-serif;
color: rgb(61,
77, 90);">Diese
E-Mail wurde
von Avast
Antivirus-Software
auf Viren
geprüft.<span class="yiv0505623334apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
</span><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-family:
Calibri,
sans-serif;
color:
purple;"><a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv0505623334moz-txt-link-abbreviated" target="_blank" href="http://www.avast.com/"></a><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.avast.com/">www.avast.com</a></span></div>
</td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Helvetica,
sans-serif;">
<span class="yiv0505623334Apple-converted-space"> </span></span></div>
<pre class="yiv0505623334" style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Courier New'; background-color: white;">_______________________________________________</pre>
<pre class="yiv0505623334" style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Courier New'; background-color: white;">If you no longer wish to receive communication from the Nature of Light and Particles General Discussion List at <span class="yiv0505623334" style="color: purple;"><a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv0505623334" ymailto="mailto:Wolf@nascentinc.com" target="_blank" href="mailto:Wolf@nascentinc.com" style="color: purple; text-decoration: underline;">Wolf@nascentinc.com</a></span></pre>
<pre class="yiv0505623334" style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Courier New'; background-color: white;"><a href=<a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv0505623334" target="_blank" href="http://lists.natureoflightandparticles.org/options.cgi/general-natureoflightandparticles.org/wolf%40nascentinc.com?unsub=1&unsubconfirm=1" style="color: purple; text-decoration: underline;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="color: purple;">"http://lists.natureoflightandparticles.org/options.cgi/general-natureoflightandparticles.org/wolf%40nascentinc.com?unsub=1&unsubconfirm=1"</span></a>></pre>
<pre class="yiv0505623334" style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Courier New'; background-color: white;">Click here to unsubscribe</pre>
<pre class="yiv0505623334" style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Courier New'; background-color: white;"></a></pre>
</blockquote>
<div class="yiv0505623334"><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size:
9pt;
font-family:
Helvetica,
sans-serif;
background-color:
white;">_______________________________________________</span><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Helvetica,
sans-serif;"><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<span class="yiv0505623334" style="background-color:
white;">If you
no longer wish
to receive
communication
from the
Nature of
Light and
Particles
General
Discussion
List at<span class="yiv0505623334apple-converted-space"> </span></span></span><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana,
sans-serif;"><a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv0505623334moz-txt-link-abbreviated" ymailto="mailto:richgauthier@gmail.com" target="_blank" href="mailto:richgauthier@gmail.com"></a><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:richgauthier@gmail.com">richgauthier@gmail.com</a></span><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size:
9pt;
font-family:
Helvetica,
sans-serif;
background-color:
white;"><a
href="</span><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana,
sans-serif;"><a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv0505623334moz-txt-link-freetext" target="_blank" href="http://lists.natureoflightandparticles.org/options.cgi/general-natureoflightandparticles.org/richgauthier%40gmail.com?unsub=1&unsubconfirm=1"></a><a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://lists.natureoflightandparticles.org/options.cgi/general-natureoflightandparticles.org/richgauthier%40gmail.com?unsub=1&unsubconfirm=1">http://lists.natureoflightandparticles.org/options.cgi/general-natureoflightandparticles.org/richgauthier%40gmail.com?unsub=1&unsubconfirm=1</a></span><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Helvetica,
sans-serif;
background-color:
white;">"></span><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size:
9pt;
font-family:
Helvetica,
sans-serif;
background-color:
white;">Click
here to
unsubscribe</span><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Helvetica,
sans-serif;"><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<span class="yiv0505623334" style="background-color:
white;"></a></span></span></div>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
</blockquote>
<div class="yiv0505623334"><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size:
9pt;
font-family:
Verdana,
sans-serif;"> <span class="yiv0505623334Apple-converted-space"> </span></span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334MsoNormal" style="margin:
0cm 0cm 10pt;
line-height:
17.1200008392334px;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
Cambria;" align="center"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana,
sans-serif;"></span>
<hr 144,="" 144);"="" class="" noshade="style="color:rgb(144," size="1" width="99%" align="center"></div>
<table class="yiv0505623334MsoNormalTable" style="border-collapse:
collapse;" border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0">
<tbody class="yiv0505623334">
<tr class="yiv0505623334">
<td colspan="1" rowspan="1" class="yiv0505623334" style="padding:
0cm 11.25pt
0cm 6pt;">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv0505623334" target="_blank" href="https://www.avast.com/antivirus" style="color:
purple;
text-decoration:
underline;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="text-decoration: none;"><img moz-do-not-send="true" class="yiv0505623334" id="yiv0505623334_x0000_i1031" src="http://static.avast.com/emails/avast-mail-stamp.png" alt="Avast
logo" data-id="e3e5a317-3c83-55b0-3eed-24b36728065e" border="0"></span></a></div>
</td>
<td colspan="1" rowspan="1" class="yiv0505623334" style="padding:
0.75pt;">
<div class="yiv0505623334" style="margin-top:
0px;
margin-bottom:
0px;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-family:
Calibri,
sans-serif;
color: rgb(61,
77, 90);">Diese
E-Mail wurde
von Avast
Antivirus-Software
auf Viren
geprüft.<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv0505623334moz-txt-link-abbreviated" target="_blank" href="http://www.avast.com/"></a><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.avast.com/">www.avast.com</a></span></div>
</td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
</blockquote>
<div class="yiv0505623334"><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size:
9pt;
font-family:
Verdana,
sans-serif;"> <span class="yiv0505623334Apple-converted-space"> </span></span></div>
<div class="yiv0505623334MsoNormal" style="margin:
0cm 0cm 10pt;
line-height:
17.1200008392334px;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
Cambria;" align="center"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana,
sans-serif;"></span>
<hr 144,="" 144);"="" class="" noshade="style="color:rgb(144," size="1" width="99%" align="center"></div>
<table class="yiv0505623334MsoNormalTable" style="border-collapse:
collapse;" border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0">
<tbody class="yiv0505623334">
<tr class="yiv0505623334">
<td colspan="1" rowspan="1" class="yiv0505623334" style="padding:
0cm 11.25pt
0cm 6pt;">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv0505623334" target="_blank" href="https://www.avast.com/antivirus" style="color:
purple;
text-decoration:
underline;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="text-decoration: none;"><img moz-do-not-send="true" class="yiv0505623334" id="yiv0505623334_x0000_i1033" src="http://static.avast.com/emails/avast-mail-stamp.png" alt="Avast
logo" data-id="d985a95e-7353-2487-bee9-50cb30b2771d" border="0"></span></a></div>
</td>
<td colspan="1" rowspan="1" class="yiv0505623334" style="padding:
0.75pt;">
<div class="yiv0505623334" style="margin-top:
0px;
margin-bottom:
0px;"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-family:
Calibri,
sans-serif;
color: rgb(61,
77, 90);">Diese
E-Mail wurde
von Avast
Antivirus-Software
auf Viren
geprüft.<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv0505623334moz-txt-link-abbreviated" target="_blank" href="http://www.avast.com/"></a><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.avast.com/">www.avast.com</a></span></div>
</td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
<div class="yiv0505623334"><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size:
9pt;
font-family:
Verdana,
sans-serif;">_______________________________________________
If you no
longer wish to
receive
communication
from the
Nature of
Light and
Particles
General
Discussion
List at<span class="yiv0505623334Apple-converted-space"> </span><a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv0505623334moz-txt-link-abbreviated" ymailto="mailto:af.kracklauer@web.de" target="_blank" href="mailto:af.kracklauer@web.de"></a><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:af.kracklauer@web.de">af.kracklauer@web.de</a><span class="yiv0505623334Apple-converted-space"> </span><a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv0505623334" target="_blank" href="http://lists.natureoflightandparticles.org/options.cgi/general-natureoflightandparticles.org/af.kracklauer%40web.de?unsub=1&unsubconfirm=1" style="color:
purple;
text-decoration:
underline;">Click
here to
unsubscribe<span class="yiv0505623334Apple-converted-space"> </span></a></span></div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana,
sans-serif;">_______________________________________________
If you no
longer wish to
receive
communication
from the
Nature of
Light and
Particles
General
Discussion
List at<span class="yiv0505623334Apple-converted-space"> </span><a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv0505623334moz-txt-link-abbreviated" ymailto="mailto:af.kracklauer@web.de" target="_blank" href="mailto:af.kracklauer@web.de"></a><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:af.kracklauer@web.de">af.kracklauer@web.de</a><span class="yiv0505623334Apple-converted-space"> </span><a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv0505623334" target="_blank" href="http://lists.natureoflightandparticles.org/options.cgi/general-natureoflightandparticles.org/af.kracklauer%40web.de?unsub=1&unsubconfirm=1" style="color:
purple;
text-decoration:
underline;">Click
here to
unsubscribe<span class="yiv0505623334Apple-converted-space"> </span></a></span></div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<blockquote class="yiv0505623334" type="cite" style="margin-top:
5pt;
margin-bottom:
5pt;">
<div class="yiv0505623334">
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana,
sans-serif;">_______________________________________________<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
If you no
longer wish to
receive
communication
from the
Nature of
Light and
Particles
General
Discussion
List at<span class="yiv0505623334Apple-converted-space"> </span><a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv0505623334moz-txt-link-abbreviated" ymailto="mailto:martin.van.der.mark@philips.com" target="_blank" href="mailto:martin.van.der.mark@philips.com"></a><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:martin.van.der.mark@philips.com">martin.van.der.mark@philips.com</a><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<a href="<a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv0505623334moz-txt-link-freetext" target="_blank" href="http://lists.natureoflightandparticles.org/options.cgi/general-natureoflightandparticles.org/martin.van.der.mark%40philips.com?unsub=1&unsubconfirm=1"></a><a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://lists.natureoflightandparticles.org/options.cgi/general-natureoflightandparticles.org/martin.van.der.mark%40philips.com?unsub=1&unsubconfirm=1">http://lists.natureoflightandparticles.org/options.cgi/general-natureoflightandparticles.org/martin.van.der.mark%40philips.com?unsub=1&unsubconfirm=1</a>"><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
Click here to
unsubscribe<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
</a></span></div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<div class="yiv0505623334"><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana,
sans-serif;">_______________________________________________
If you no
longer wish to
receive
communication
from the
Nature of
Light and
Particles
General
Discussion
List at<span class="yiv0505623334Apple-converted-space"> </span><a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv0505623334moz-txt-link-abbreviated" ymailto="mailto:af.kracklauer@web.de" target="_blank" href="mailto:af.kracklauer@web.de"></a><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:af.kracklauer@web.de">af.kracklauer@web.de</a><span class="yiv0505623334Apple-converted-space"> </span><a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv0505623334" target="_blank" href="http://lists.natureoflightandparticles.org/options.cgi/general-natureoflightandparticles.org/af.kracklauer%40web.de?unsub=1&unsubconfirm=1" style="color:
purple;
text-decoration:
underline;">Click
here to
unsubscribe<span class="yiv0505623334Apple-converted-space"> </span></a></span></div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<div class="yiv0505623334" style="margin:
0cm 0cm
0.0001pt;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
'Times New
Roman',
serif;"><br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
</div>
<pre class="yiv0505623334" style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Courier New';">_______________________________________________</pre>
<pre class="yiv0505623334" style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Courier New';">If you no longer wish to receive communication from the Nature of Light and Particles General Discussion List at <a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv0505623334" ymailto="mailto:phys@a-giese.de" target="_blank" href="mailto:phys@a-giese.de" style="color: purple; text-decoration: underline;">phys@a-giese.de</a></pre>
<pre class="yiv0505623334" style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Courier New';"><a href=<a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv0505623334" target="_blank" href="http://lists.natureoflightandparticles.org/options.cgi/general-natureoflightandparticles.org/phys%40a-giese.de?unsub=1&unsubconfirm=1" style="color: purple; text-decoration: underline;">"http://lists.natureoflightandparticles.org/options.cgi/general-natureoflightandparticles.org/phys%40a-giese.de?unsub=1&unsubconfirm=1"</a>></pre>
<pre class="yiv0505623334" style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Courier New';">Click here to unsubscribe</pre>
<pre class="yiv0505623334" style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Courier New';"></a></pre>
</blockquote>
<div class="yiv0505623334" style="margin:
0cm 0cm
0.0001pt;
font-size:
12pt;
font-family:
'Times New
Roman',
serif;"> </div>
</div>
<span class="yiv0505623334"><electron.pdf></span><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px;
font-style:
normal;
font-variant:
normal;
font-weight:
normal;
letter-spacing:
normal;
line-height:
normal;
text-indent:
0px;
text-transform:
none;
white-space:
normal;
word-spacing:
0px;
background-color:
rgb(255, 255,
255); float:
none; display:
inline;">_______________________________________________</span><br class="yiv0505623334" style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px;
font-style:
normal;
font-variant:
normal;
font-weight:
normal;
letter-spacing:
normal;
line-height:
normal;
text-indent:
0px;
text-transform:
none;
white-space:
normal;
word-spacing:
0px;
background-color:
rgb(255, 255,
255);" clear="none">
<span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-family:
Helvetica;
font-size:
12px;
font-style:
normal;
font-variant:
normal;
font-weight:
normal;
letter-spacing:
normal;
line-height:
normal;
text-indent:
0px;
text-transform:
none;
white-space:
normal;
word-spacing:
0px;
background-color:
rgb(255, 255,
255); float:
none; display:
inline;">If
you no longer
wish to
receive
communication
from the
Nature of
Light and
Particles
General
Discussion
List at<span class="yiv0505623334Apple-converted-space"> </span></span><a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv0505623334moz-txt-link-abbreviated" ymailto="mailto:richgauthier@gmail.com" target="_blank" href="mailto:richgauthier@gmail.com"></a><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:richgauthier@gmail.com">richgauthier@gmail.com</a><br class="yiv0505623334" style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px;
font-style:
normal;
font-variant:
normal;
font-weight:
normal;
letter-spacing:
normal;
line-height:
normal;
text-indent:
0px;
text-transform:
none;
white-space:
normal;
word-spacing:
0px;
background-color:
rgb(255, 255,
255);" clear="none">
<span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-family:
Helvetica;
font-size:
12px;
font-style:
normal;
font-variant:
normal;
font-weight:
normal;
letter-spacing:
normal;
line-height:
normal;
text-indent:
0px;
text-transform:
none;
white-space:
normal;
word-spacing:
0px;
background-color:
rgb(255, 255,
255); float:
none; display:
inline;"><a
href="</span><a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv0505623334moz-txt-link-freetext" target="_blank" href="http://lists.natureoflightandparticles.org/options.cgi/general-natureoflightandparticles.org/richgauthier%40gmail.com?unsub=1&unsubconfirm=1"></a><a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://lists.natureoflightandparticles.org/options.cgi/general-natureoflightandparticles.org/richgauthier%40gmail.com?unsub=1&unsubconfirm=1">http://lists.natureoflightandparticles.org/options.cgi/general-natureoflightandparticles.org/richgauthier%40gmail.com?unsub=1&unsubconfirm=1</a><span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px;
font-style:
normal;
font-variant:
normal;
font-weight:
normal;
letter-spacing:
normal;
line-height:
normal;
text-indent:
0px;
text-transform:
none;
white-space:
normal;
word-spacing:
0px;
background-color:
rgb(255, 255,
255); float:
none; display:
inline;">"></span><br class="yiv0505623334" style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px;
font-style:
normal;
font-variant:
normal;
font-weight:
normal;
letter-spacing:
normal;
line-height:
normal;
text-indent:
0px;
text-transform:
none;
white-space:
normal;
word-spacing:
0px;
background-color:
rgb(255, 255,
255);" clear="none">
<span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-family:
Helvetica;
font-size:
12px;
font-style:
normal;
font-variant:
normal;
font-weight:
normal;
letter-spacing:
normal;
line-height:
normal;
text-indent:
0px;
text-transform:
none;
white-space:
normal;
word-spacing:
0px;
background-color:
rgb(255, 255,
255); float:
none; display:
inline;">Click
here to
unsubscribe</span><br class="yiv0505623334" style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px;
font-style:
normal;
font-variant:
normal;
font-weight:
normal;
letter-spacing:
normal;
line-height:
normal;
text-indent:
0px;
text-transform:
none;
white-space:
normal;
word-spacing:
0px;
background-color:
rgb(255, 255,
255);" clear="none">
<span class="yiv0505623334" style="font-family:
Helvetica;
font-size:
12px;
font-style:
normal;
font-variant:
normal;
font-weight:
normal;
letter-spacing:
normal;
line-height:
normal;
text-indent:
0px;
text-transform:
none;
white-space:
normal;
word-spacing:
0px;
background-color:
rgb(255, 255,
255); float:
none; display:
inline;"></a></span><br class="yiv0505623334" style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px;
font-style:
normal;
font-variant:
normal;
font-weight:
normal;
letter-spacing:
normal;
line-height:
normal;
text-indent:
0px;
text-transform:
none;
white-space:
normal;
word-spacing:
0px;
background-color:
rgb(255, 255,
255);" clear="none">
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
</blockquote>
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
</div>
</div>
</div>
<br class="yiv0505623334Apple-interchange-newline" clear="none">
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
</div>
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
</blockquote>
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="yiv0505623334" clear="none">
<br class="" clear="none">
</div>
</div>
</div>
<br class="" clear="none">
<div class="yiv0505623334yqt6255097049" id="yiv0505623334yqt44624">_______________________________________________<br class="" clear="none">
If you no longer wish to
receive communication from the
Nature of Light and Particles
General Discussion List at<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:davidmathes8@yahoo.com" target="_blank" href="mailto:davidmathes8@yahoo.com" class="">davidmathes8@yahoo.com</a><br class="" clear="none">
<a href="<a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" target="_blank" href="http://lists.natureoflightandparticles.org/options.cgi/general-natureoflightandparticles.org/davidmathes8%40yahoo.com?unsub=1&unsubconfirm=1" class=""></a><a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://lists.natureoflightandparticles.org/options.cgi/general-natureoflightandparticles.org/davidmathes8%40yahoo.com?unsub=1&unsubconfirm=1">http://lists.natureoflightandparticles.org/options.cgi/general-natureoflightandparticles.org/davidmathes8%40yahoo.com?unsub=1&unsubconfirm=1</a>"><br class="" clear="none">
Click here to unsubscribe<br class="" clear="none">
</a><br class="" clear="none">
</div>
<br class="" clear="none">
<br class="" clear="none">
</div>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
<br class="" clear="none">
</div>
</div>
<br class="">
<div class="yqt0476417258" id="yqt34139">_______________________________________________<br class="" clear="none">
If you no longer wish to receive communication
from the Nature of Light and Particles General
Discussion List at<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a moz-do-not-send="true" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:davidmathes8@yahoo.com" href="mailto:davidmathes8@yahoo.com" class=""></a><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:davidmathes8@yahoo.com">davidmathes8@yahoo.com</a><br class="" clear="none">
<a href="<a moz-do-not-send="true" shape="rect" href="http://lists.natureoflightandparticles.org/options.cgi/general-natureoflightandparticles.org/davidmathes8%40yahoo.com?unsub=1&unsubconfirm=1" target="_blank" class="">http://lists.natureoflightandparticles.org/options.cgi/general-natureoflightandparticles.org/davidmathes8%40yahoo.com?unsub=1&unsubconfirm=1</a>"><br class="" clear="none">
Click here to unsubscribe<br class="" clear="none">
</a></div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
<br class="">
</blockquote>
<br class="">
</div>
</div></blockquote></div><br class=""></body></html>