<html><head></head><body><div style="color:#000; background-color:#fff; font-family:HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif;font-size:16px"><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445373176154_5398" dir="ltr"><span id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445373176154_5815">My Dear Martin,</span></div><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445373176154_5398" dir="ltr"><span><br></span></div><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445373176154_5398" dir="ltr">What an admirable skill to piece out imperfections with mere thoughts expressed as ad hominem brain farts. Bravo for your bravado.</div><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445373176154_5399"><br></div><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445373176154_5399" dir="ltr">For photonic electron models I fear you have not answered the question of mass nor charge, and in doing so, you have intervened unnecessarily between Albrecht and I in my Socratic approach, no matter how naive. </div><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445373176154_5399" dir="ltr"><br></div><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445373176154_5399" dir="ltr" class="">Perhaps some reasonable progress can be made with the charge issue by modeling quarks or perhaps from the POV of Laughlin's fractional quantum Hall effect.</div><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445373176154_5399" dir="ltr" class=""><br></div><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445373176154_5399" dir="ltr" class="">If you have such a model of quantized 1/3e charge notable in quarks or in the quasiparticle used to explain fractional quantum Hall effect, speak up then. </div><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445373176154_5399" dir="ltr" class=""><br></div><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445373176154_5399" dir="ltr" class="">Best regards,</div><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445373176154_5399" dir="ltr" class=""><br></div><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445373176154_5399" dir="ltr" class="">David</div><div dir="ltr" id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445373176154_10389" class=""><br id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445373176154_10391" class=""></div><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445373176154_5399"><br></div><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445373176154_5399"><br></div> <blockquote style="border-left: 2px solid rgb(16, 16, 255); margin-left: 5px; margin-top: 5px; padding-left: 5px;" id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445373176154_5404"> <div style="font-family: HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif; font-size: 16px;" id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445373176154_5403"> <div style="font-family: HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif; font-size: 16px;" id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445373176154_5402"> <div dir="ltr" id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445373176154_5401"> <hr size="1" id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445373176154_6428"> <font size="2" face="Arial" id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445373176154_5659"> <b><span style="font-weight:bold;">From:</span></b> "Mark, Martin van der" <martin.van.der.mark@philips.com><br> <b><span style="font-weight: bold;">To:</span></b> "<davidmathes8@yahoo.com>" <davidmathes8@yahoo.com> <br><b><span style="font-weight: bold;">Cc:</span></b> Nature of Light and Particles - General Discussion <general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org> <br> <b><span style="font-weight: bold;">Sent:</span></b> Tuesday, October 20, 2015 1:17 PM<br> <b id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445373176154_10806"><span style="font-weight: bold;" id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445373176154_10805">Subject:</span></b> Re: [General] Strong Force Modeling<br> </font> </div> <div class="y_msg_container" id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445373176154_5660"><br><div id="yiv1707540020"><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445373176154_5662">
<div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445373176154_5661">David, you seem to have too much free time to come up with useless ideas. Whence a single photon producing an electron???</div>
<div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445373176154_5663">As they say : One idiot can ask more questions then ten wise man can answer in a lifetime.</div>
<div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445373176154_5664">Please go back to intelligible level, you can do it.</div>
<div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445373176154_5665">Regards, Martin<br clear="none">
<br clear="none">
Verstuurd vanaf mijn iPhone</div>
<div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445373176154_5666"><br clear="none">
Op 20 okt. 2015 om 18:47 heeft "<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:davidmathes8@yahoo.com" target="_blank" href="mailto:davidmathes8@yahoo.com">davidmathes8@yahoo.com</a>" <<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:davidmathes8@yahoo.com" target="_blank" href="mailto:davidmathes8@yahoo.com">davidmathes8@yahoo.com</a>> het volgende geschreven:<br clear="none">
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<div class="qtdSeparateBR"><br><br></div><div class="yiv1707540020yqt2586611437" id="yiv1707540020yqt65875"><blockquote type="cite" id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445373176154_6171">
<div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445373176154_6170">
<div style="color:#000;background-color:#fff;font-family:HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif;font-size:16px;" id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445373176154_6169">
<div><span>Martin</span></div>
<div id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445356411561_17489"><span><br clear="none">
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<div id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445356411561_17489">Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence. </div>
<div id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445356411561_17489"><span><br clear="none">
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<div id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445356411561_17488"><span id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445356411561_17487">So, once more into the breach...</span></div>
<div id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445356411561_17486"><span><br clear="none">
</span></div>
<div dir="ltr" id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445356411561_17485"><span id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445356411561_17484">If charge is conserved, how can a neutral photon become a charged electron?</span></div>
<div dir="ltr" id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445356411561_17165"><span><br clear="none">
</span></div>
<div dir="ltr" id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445356411561_16907"><span id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445356411561_16912">Two possibilities come to mind. First, a third particle is involved which provides the charge. One could introduce a neutrino, a Higgs particle, or other suitable
candidate to provide the charge.</span></div>
<div dir="ltr" id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445356411561_16907"><span><br clear="none">
</span></div>
<div dir="ltr" id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445356411561_16907"><span id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445356411561_17166">The second is that charge may be the result of the photon interacting with spacetime, and resonance in path curvature simply amplifies the effect. </span></div>
<div dir="ltr" id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445356411561_16907"><span><br clear="none">
</span></div>
<div dir="ltr" id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445356411561_16907"><span id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445356411561_17483">This second conjecture leads one to wonder if the photon itself provides the charge.</span></div>
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David<br clear="none">
<blockquote id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445356411561_16714" style="border-left:2px solid rgb(16, 16, 255);margin-left:5px;margin-top:5px;padding-left:5px;">
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<div id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445356411561_16712" style="font-family:HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif;font-size:16px;">
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<font id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445356411561_16715" size="2" face="Arial"><b id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445356411561_17542"><span id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445356411561_17541" style="font-weight:bold;">From:</span></b> "Mark, Martin van der" <<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:martin.van.der.mark@philips.com" target="_blank" href="mailto:martin.van.der.mark@philips.com">martin.van.der.mark@philips.com</a>><br clear="none">
<b><span style="font-weight:bold;">To:</span></b> "<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:davidmathes8@yahoo.com" target="_blank" href="mailto:davidmathes8@yahoo.com">davidmathes8@yahoo.com</a>" <<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:davidmathes8@yahoo.com" target="_blank" href="mailto:davidmathes8@yahoo.com">davidmathes8@yahoo.com</a>>; Nature of Light and Particles - General Discussion <<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org" target="_blank" href="mailto:general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org">general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org</a>>
<br clear="none">
<b><span style="font-weight:bold;">Sent:</span></b> Tuesday, October 20, 2015 4:17 AM<br clear="none">
<b><span style="font-weight:bold;">Subject:</span></b> RE: [General] Strong Force Modeling<br clear="none">
</font></div>
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<div class="yiv1707540020MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;">David, simply no, apparently experimentally not in this universe, as explained. You may want to do your homework and look it all up in the literature.</span></div>
<div class="yiv1707540020MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;">Regards, Martin</span></div>
<div class="yiv1707540020MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;"> </span></div>
<div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445373176154_10113">
<div class="yiv1707540020MsoNormal"><span lang="DE" style="font-size:10.0pt;">Dr. Martin B. van der Mark</span><span lang="DE" style="color:navy;"></span></div>
<div class="yiv1707540020MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;">Principal Scientist, Minimally Invasive Healthcare</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt;"></span></div>
<div class="yiv1707540020MsoNormal" id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445373176154_10112"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;"> </span></div>
<div class="yiv1707540020MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;">Philips Research Europe - Eindhoven</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt;"></span></div>
<div class="yiv1707540020MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;">High Tech Campus, Building 34 (WB2.025)</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt;"></span></div>
<div class="yiv1707540020MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;">Prof. Holstlaan 4</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt;"></span></div>
<div class="yiv1707540020MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;">5656 AE Eindhoven, The Netherlands</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt;"></span></div>
<div class="yiv1707540020MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;">Tel: +31 40 2747548</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt;"></span></div>
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<div class="yiv1707540020MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;"> General [<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:general-bounces+martin.van.der.mark=philips.com@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org" target="_blank" href="mailto:general-bounces+martin.van.der.mark=philips.com@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org">mailto:general-bounces+martin.van.der.mark=philips.com@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org</a>]
<b>On Behalf Of </b><a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:davidmathes8@yahoo.com" target="_blank" href="mailto:davidmathes8@yahoo.com">davidmathes8@yahoo.com</a><br clear="none">
<b>Sent:</b> dinsdag 20 oktober 2015 1:30<br clear="none">
<b>To:</b> Nature of Light and Particles - General Discussion<br clear="none">
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [General] Strong Force Modeling</span></div>
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<div id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445356411561_17475">
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<div class="yiv1707540020MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="">Martin</span></div>
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<div class="yiv1707540020MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style=""> </span></div>
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<div class="yiv1707540020MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="">IMHO we don't understand charge. </span></div>
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<div class="yiv1707540020MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style=""> </span></div>
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<div id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445294444662_18128">
<div class="yiv1707540020MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="">So when and where symmetry breaking is permitted, charge would appear to be a great candidate, high on the priority search list.</span></div>
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<div id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445294444662_18128">
<div class="yiv1707540020MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style=""> </span></div>
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<div id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445294444662_18128">
<div class="yiv1707540020MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="">Best</span></div>
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<div class="yiv1707540020MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="">David</span></div>
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<b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;">From:</span></b><span id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445356411561_17480" style="font-size:10.0pt;"> "Mark, Martin van der" <<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:martin.van.der.mark@philips.com" target="_blank" href="mailto:martin.van.der.mark@philips.com">martin.van.der.mark@philips.com</a>><br clear="none">
<b>To:</b> "<<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:davidmathes8@yahoo.com" target="_blank" href="mailto:davidmathes8@yahoo.com">davidmathes8@yahoo.com</a>>" <<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:davidmathes8@yahoo.com" target="_blank" href="mailto:davidmathes8@yahoo.com">davidmathes8@yahoo.com</a>>;
Nature of Light and Particles - General Discussion <<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org" target="_blank" href="mailto:general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org" id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445373176154_10205">general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org</a>>
<br clear="none">
<b>Sent:</b> Monday, October 19, 2015 12:09 PM<br clear="none">
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [General] Strong Force Modeling</span><span style=""></span></div>
</div>
<div id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445294444662_17939">
<div class="yiv1707540020MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style=""> </span></div>
<div id="yiv1707540020">
<div id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445294444662_17938">
<div id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445294444662_17937">
<div class="yiv1707540020MsoNormal" style="background:white;" id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445373176154_10204"><span style="" id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445373176154_10203">Hi David, it is interesting to think in such a direction, but I would say: No.</span></div>
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<div class="yiv1707540020MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="">However, an example would convince me quite easily.</span></div>
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<div class="yiv1707540020MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="">Why? It is all about symmetry to begin with. In an anihilation process everything comes together with its opposite, even the violations!</span></div>
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<div class="yiv1707540020MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="">I appreciate the challenge...</span></div>
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<div class="yiv1707540020MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="">Very best, Martin<br clear="none">
<br clear="none">
Verstuurd vanaf mijn iPhone</span></div>
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<span style="" id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445373176154_6166"><br clear="none">
Op 19 okt. 2015 om 20:57 heeft "<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:davidmathes8@yahoo.com" target="_blank" href="mailto:davidmathes8@yahoo.com" id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445373176154_6165">davidmathes8@yahoo.com</a>" <<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:davidmathes8@yahoo.com" target="_blank" href="mailto:davidmathes8@yahoo.com">davidmathes8@yahoo.com</a>>
het volgende geschreven:</span></div>
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<span style=""> </span></div>
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<div id="yiv1707540020yqt16875">
<blockquote style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt;" id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445373176154_6189">
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<div id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445268100742_40022">
<div class="yiv1707540020MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="">Martin</span></div>
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<div id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445268100742_40022">
<div class="yiv1707540020MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="">CP violations might be an exception.</span></div>
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<div id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445268100742_40022">
<div class="yiv1707540020MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="">Best</span></div>
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<div class="yiv1707540020MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style=""> </span></div>
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<div id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445268100742_40022">
<div class="yiv1707540020MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="">David</span></div>
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<div class="yiv1707540020MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><b id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445268100742_40175"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;"> "Mark, Martin van der" <<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:martin.van.der.mark@philips.com" target="_blank" href="mailto:martin.van.der.mark@philips.com">martin.van.der.mark@philips.com</a>><br clear="none">
<b>To:</b> "<<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:davidmathes8@yahoo.com" target="_blank" href="mailto:davidmathes8@yahoo.com">davidmathes8@yahoo.com</a>>" <<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:davidmathes8@yahoo.com" target="_blank" href="mailto:davidmathes8@yahoo.com">davidmathes8@yahoo.com</a>>;
Nature of Light and Particles - General Discussion <<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org" target="_blank" href="mailto:general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org">general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org</a>>
<br clear="none">
<b id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445268100742_40177">Sent:</b> Monday, October 19, 2015 11:34 AM<br clear="none">
<b id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445268100742_40179">Subject:</b> Re: [General] Strong Force Modeling</span><span style=""></span></div>
</div>
<div id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445268100742_40181">
<div class="yiv1707540020MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style=""> </span></div>
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<div class="yiv1707540020MsoNormal" style="background:white;" id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445373176154_10172"><span style="">Dear David,</span></div>
</div>
<div id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445268100742_40193">
<div class="yiv1707540020MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="">First: Mass cannot be concerted to energy, never under any circumstances! </span></div>
</div>
<div id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445268100742_40192">
<div class="yiv1707540020MsoNormal" style="background:white;" id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445373176154_10198"><span style="" id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445373176154_10197">Rather mass IS energy, see "light is heavy" for explanation.</span></div>
</div>
<div id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445268100742_40191">
<div class="yiv1707540020MsoNormal" style="background:white;" id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445373176154_10180"><span style="" id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445373176154_10179">Second: Whenever matter is converted to radiation (this what you meat, right), charge is (and must be) conserved, always. An electron and positron covert to photons, for example, and
there is no net charge at any time.</span></div>
</div>
<div id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445268100742_40190">
<div class="yiv1707540020MsoNormal" style="background:white;" id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445373176154_10181"><span style="">Cheers, Martin</span></div>
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<div id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445268100742_40189">
<div class="yiv1707540020MsoNormal" style="background:white;" id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445373176154_6186"><span style="" id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445373176154_10182"><br clear="none">
Verstuurd vanaf mijn iPhone</span></div>
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<span style=""><br clear="none">
Op 19 okt. 2015 om 20:20 heeft "<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:davidmathes8@yahoo.com" target="_blank" href="mailto:davidmathes8@yahoo.com">davidmathes8@yahoo.com</a>" <<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:davidmathes8@yahoo.com" target="_blank" href="mailto:davidmathes8@yahoo.com">davidmathes8@yahoo.com</a>>
het volgende geschreven:</span></div>
</div>
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<div class="yiv1707540020MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt;background:white;" id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445373176154_10116">
<span style=""> </span></div>
</div>
<div id="yiv1707540020yqt84011">
<blockquote style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt;" id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445373176154_6192">
<div id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445268100742_40184">
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<div id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445268100742_40187">
<div class="yiv1707540020MsoNormal" style="background:white;" id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445373176154_10184"><span style="">Albrecht,</span></div>
</div>
<div id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445268100742_28565">
<div class="yiv1707540020MsoNormal" style="background:white;" id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445373176154_6191"><span style=""> </span></div>
</div>
<div id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445268100742_28563">
<div class="yiv1707540020MsoNormal" style="background:white;" id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445373176154_10186"><span style="" id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445373176154_10185">While the current research focus is on getting photonic-based electron theory correct, an obvious goal would be to extend a building-block theory to all elementary particles, both
simple (electron) and complex (proton, neutron, meson, etc)</span></div>
</div>
<div id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445268100742_28562">
<div class="yiv1707540020MsoNormal" style="background:white;" id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445373176154_10187"><span style=""> </span></div>
</div>
<div id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445268100742_28562">
<div class="yiv1707540020MsoNormal" style="background:white;" id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445373176154_10189"><span style="" id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445373176154_10188">To that end, one needs to address and parse some seemingly "what is it?" moments. Is it a particle or a wave? Is it mass or energy? Is it moving or not? Is there a reference frame dependency?</span></div>
</div>
<div id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445268100742_28562">
<div class="yiv1707540020MsoNormal" style="background:white;" id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445373176154_6194"><span style=""> </span></div>
</div>
<div id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445268100742_28562">
<div class="yiv1707540020MsoNormal" style="background:white;" id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445373176154_10191"><span style="" id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445373176154_10190">As to relativistic contraction, the general physics assumption is that charge is invariant especially in flat space. So, the charge to mass ratio for various particles is rather fixed.
This leads me to a question everyone has been walking around...</span></div>
</div>
<div id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445268100742_28562">
<div class="yiv1707540020MsoNormal" style="background:white;" id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445373176154_10192"><span style=""> </span></div>
</div>
<div id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445268100742_28562">
<div class="yiv1707540020MsoNormal" style="background:white;" id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445373176154_10194"><span style="" id="yui_3_16_0_1_1445373176154_10193">If mass = E/c^2, and we convert mass completely to energy - say a photon, then where did all the charge go?</span></div>
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<div class="yiv1707540020MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="">D</span></div>
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<div class="yiv1707540020MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;"> Dr. Albrecht Giese <<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:genmail@a-giese.de" target="_blank" href="mailto:genmail@a-giese.de">genmail@a-giese.de</a>><br clear="none">
<b>To:</b> <a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:davidmathes8@yahoo.com" target="_blank" href="mailto:davidmathes8@yahoo.com">
davidmathes8@yahoo.com</a>; Nature of Light and Particles - General Discussion <<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org" target="_blank" href="mailto:general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org">general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org</a>>
<br clear="none">
<b>Sent:</b> Monday, October 19, 2015 8:29 AM<br clear="none">
<b>Subject:</b> Re: Strong Force Modeling</span><span style=""></span></div>
</div>
<div id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445268100742_28559">
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<span style="">David,<br clear="none">
<br clear="none">
you have given here some criteria or properties which have to be fulfilled by a particle model. I shall try to answer this by listing some points which make up my model following your topics.<br clear="none">
<br clear="none">
The particle model which I propose is not restricted to the electron but is assumed to be valid for all leptons and as well for all quarks.<br clear="none">
<br clear="none">
To your challenges:<br clear="none">
<br clear="none">
In this model a charge is an elementary entity, a kind of an "atom" in the real sense which causes a force onto a similar object. There a two kinds of charges in the model: the electric one and the strong one. The weak one is in fact the strong one but with
a reduced coupling constant, caused by a different shape of the configurations having these charges. - Maybe that in the future development of particle physics we will find a more fundamental cause of charges. At present I do not see any, and in the present
situation it seems not to be an urgent question.<br clear="none">
<br clear="none">
The case of 8 gluons: We know that elementary particles react with certain others, but not with all. Particle physicists have made an ad-hoc assumption to "explain", or better to order this situation by assigning further quantum numbers to elementary particles,
like isospin, strangeness, lepton number, quark number. The colour of gluons seems to be a similar category. These are in my case further properties of the "basic" particles, which are not described by the model as they do not influence the properties of the
particles which I presently care about, like the inertial mass and momentum, which is explained by this model, as well as the conservation of energy, which is also explained (not only used!) by this model.<br clear="none">
<br clear="none">
Leptoquarks have been an ad-hoc assumption to explain interactions between leptons and quarks. This assumption was not successful and is in fact not needed if the assumption of my model, that leptons are also subject to the strong force, is accepted.
<br clear="none">
<br clear="none">
>From this model follows gravitation as I have explained earlier. The exchange particles interact with light-like particles (photons and "basic" particles) and cause them to reduce their speed below c. From this all aspects of gravitation can be quantitatively
deduced, Newton' gravity as well the results of Einstein's GRT.<br clear="none">
<br clear="none">
Inertia is the direct consequence of this model. An elementary particle is, according to this model, extended, and any extended object has inevitably an inertial behaviour. I have shown (and show it in my web site) that with reference to this mechanism the
mass of the electron can be determined with an accuracy of almost 1 : 1 million.
<br clear="none">
<br clear="none">
I am using exchange particles as mediators for the forces in a particle, which are the electric force and the strong force. The main advantage for the use in my model is that they provide a good physical explanation for the relativistic contraction.<br clear="none">
<br clear="none">
Best regards<br clear="none">
Albrecht<br clear="none">
<br clear="none">
<br clear="none">
</span></div>
<div>
<div class="yiv1707540020MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="">Am 16.10.2015 um 17:41 schrieb
<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:davidmathes8@yahoo.com" target="_blank" href="mailto:davidmathes8@yahoo.com">
davidmathes8@yahoo.com</a>:</span></div>
</div>
<div>
<div class="yiv1707540020MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt;background:white;">
<span style=""> </span></div>
</div>
<div id="yiv1707540020yqt96238">
<blockquote style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt;">
<div>
<div id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445008406969_3000">
<div class="yiv1707540020MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="">Albrecht</span></div>
</div>
<div id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445008406969_3000">
<div class="yiv1707540020MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style=""> </span></div>
</div>
<div id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445008406969_3000">
<div class="yiv1707540020MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="">If the electron modeling is to succeed and gain wide acceptance, then the modeling needs to become a foundation that can be built on to develop other Elementary Particles. While photonic
electron theories may be that foundation, there are three challenges. First, explaining charge and the source of charge. Second, modeling the eight gluons - one would usually be enough, but eight...? Third, modeling the transitory nature of quarks and leptoquarks.</span></div>
</div>
<div id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445008406969_5153">
<div class="yiv1707540020MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style=""> </span></div>
</div>
<div id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445008406969_3000">
<div class="yiv1707540020MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="">Modeling the electron to satisfy the leptoquark theory may involve force-bound states. If so, then in order for a lepton-quark interaction, given the E&M nature of the electron or
even electroweak, no matter how transiently a leptoquark may require an electron with the addition of the strong nuclear force. Modeling a fully loaded electron with E&M, weak and strong forces may prove challenging. However, this path may lead towards explaining
gravitation and inertia.</span></div>
</div>
<div id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445008406969_3000">
<div class="yiv1707540020MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style=""> </span></div>
</div>
<div id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445008406969_3000">
<div class="yiv1707540020MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="">For the experts in electron modeling, perhaps the key to unlocking what's inside elementary is gluons. Glueballs (gluonium) may be worth the effort of modeling. </span></div>
</div>
<div id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445008406969_3000">
<div class="yiv1707540020MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style=""> </span></div>
</div>
<div id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445008406969_3000">
<div class="yiv1707540020MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="">David</span></div>
</div>
<div id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445008406969_3000">
<div class="yiv1707540020MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style=""> </span></div>
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<div class="yiv1707540020MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style=""> </span></div>
</div>
<div id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445008406969_3000">
<div class="yiv1707540020MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="">Article</span></div>
</div>
<div id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445008406969_3000">
<div class="yiv1707540020MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style=""><a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" target="_blank" href="http://www.gizmag.com/meson-f01710-glueball-particle/39866/?-particle-made-purely-of-nuclear-force/">Meson f0(1710) could be so-called
“glueball” particle made purely of nuclear force</a></span></div>
</div>
<div id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445008406969_3499">
<div class="yiv1707540020MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style=""> </span></div>
</div>
<div id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445008406969_3000">
<div class="yiv1707540020MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="">"</span><span class="yiv1707540020"><span style="font-size:13.5pt;">Elementary particles come in two kinds: those that carry force (</span></span><span style=""><a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445008406969_3485" target="_blank" href="http://www.gizmag.com/tag/boson/"><span style="font-size:13.5pt;">bosons</span></a></span><span class="yiv1707540020"><span style="font-size:13.5pt;">),
such as photons, and those that make up matter (</span></span><span style=""><a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445008406969_3489" target="_blank" href="http://www.gizmag.com/tag/fermions/"><span style="font-size:13.5pt;">fermions</span></a></span><span class="yiv1707540020"><span style="font-size:13.5pt;">),
such as electrons. In this context, gluons may be viewed as more complex forms of the photon. However, as photons are the force carriers for electromagnetism, gluons exhibit a similar role for the strong nuclear force. The major difference between the two,
however, is that <i id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445008406969_4208">gluons are able to be influenced by their own forces, whereas photons are not.</i>
<b id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445008406969_4207"><i id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445008406969_4206">As a result, photons cannot exist in force-bound states, though gluons, which are attracted by force to each other, make a particle of pure (strong) nuclear
force possible."</i></b></span></span><span style=""></span></div>
</div>
<div id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445008406969_3000">
<div class="yiv1707540020MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style=""> </span></div>
</div>
<div id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445008406969_3000">
<div class="yiv1707540020MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style=""> </span></div>
</div>
<div id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445008406969_3000">
<div class="yiv1707540020MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="">Arxiv </span></div>
</div>
<div id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445008406969_3000">
<div class="yiv1707540020MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style=""><a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" target="_blank" href="http://arxiv.org/abs/1504.05815">[1504.05815] Nonchiral enhancement of scalar glueball decay in the Witten-Sakai-Sugimoto model</a></span></div>
</div>
<div id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445008406969_3000">
<div class="yiv1707540020MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style=""> </span></div>
</div>
<div id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445008406969_3000">
<div class="yiv1707540020MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style="">Arxiv</span></div>
</div>
<div id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445008406969_3000">
<div class="yiv1707540020MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style=""><a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" target="_blank" href="http://arxiv.org/abs/1501.07906">[1501.07906] Glueball Decay Rates in the Witten-Sakai-Sugimoto Model</a></span></div>
</div>
<div id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445008406969_3000">
<div class="yiv1707540020MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style=""> </span></div>
</div>
<div id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445008406969_3000">
<div class="yiv1707540020MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style=""><a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" target="_blank" href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glueball">Glueball - Wiki</a></span></div>
</div>
<div id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445008406969_3000">
<div class="yiv1707540020MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style=""> </span></div>
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<div id="yiv1707540020yui_3_16_0_1_1445008406969_3000">
<div class="yiv1707540020MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span style=""><a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" target="_blank" href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leptoquark">Leptoquark - Wiki</a></span></div>
</div>
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</blockquote>
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