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    Dear Vivian, and all,<br>
    <br>
    a few comments from my side.<br>
    <br>
    I agree with you that an electron (as an example) is a <i>particle
    </i>surrounded by a field / wave. <br>
    <br>
    But: This wave is not the de Broglie wave. Your write: <small><font
        size="4"><small>"an electron's de Broglie wavelength is directly
          related to its energy</small></font>"</small> . This is
    clearly incorrect, it does not reflect the deduction of de Broglie,
    and in a scattering process it has wrong results. For de Broglie
    this wavelength is related to the momentum of the electron. <br>
    <br>
    But also this causes weird situations. If in a scattering process an
    observer resides at rest in the system of the scattering device, the
    result seems correct. However, if seen from an observer in motion,
    the result can be incorrect by an arbitrary amount. A special case:
    The observer moves with the electron, with the same speed. Then from
    de Broglie it follows that the wavelength is infinite (as momentum
    is zero), and no scattering occurs. But in fact the scattering still
    occurs, the process does not care about the observer. And the
    necessary relativistic correction covers this discrepancy in no way.<br>
    <br>
    Another statement given about Einstein's GR:<br>
    <br>
    You say: "<small><font size="4"><small>It is the same with general
          relativity. Einstein's field equations for space outside
          matter (gravity as we know it) fits all observations against
          which it has been tested." <br>
          <br>
          Sorry, but Einstein's GR has started with a wrong precondition
          (equivalent to a wrong result, but worse): The complete
          equivalence of gravity and acceleration. Clearly incorrect. It
          was discussed here: 1.) A charged object radiates at
          acceleration, not at rest in a gravitational field. 2.) There
          is dilation in a gravitational field, not at acceleration. <br>
          And why space-time (4-dimensional)? This was in the
          development of GR a direct consequence of the fact that
          Einstein did not want a fixed system of reference. It had a
          philosophical motivation. No experiment falsifies the
          assumption of a fixed frame, but such an assumption makes
          everything easier to a dramatic extend. <br>
          <br>
          There are other solutions for gravity not using Einstein's
          field equations and Einstein's space-time but giving same
          results.<br>
          <br>
          If you compare <i>particle models</i>: I understand it as a
          deficiency, if a model uses too many physical rules as facts
          which could be otherwise deduced (what my 2-subparticle model
          does).<br>
          As are the following facts and relations:<br>
          -  the inertial mass <br>
          -  the Bohr magneton<br>
          -  the Landé factor<br>
        </small></font></small><small><font size="4"><small><small><font
              size="4"><small>-  E = h * frequency<br>
                -  E = mc<sup>2</sup></small></font></small> <br>
          -  the spin.<br>
          <br>
          If those facts and relations are assumed for the constituents
          of the electron and just taken over, this is in my
          understanding no real deduction.<br>
        </small></font></small><br>
    Greetings<br>
    Albrecht<br>
    <br>
    <br>
    <div class="moz-cite-prefix">Am 09.11.2015 um 06:58 schrieb Vivian
      Robinson:<br>
    </div>
    <blockquote
      cite="mid:3A0B19F1-15A5-4A8E-B6BA-981F93627D4E@universephysics.com"
      type="cite">
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      <base href="x-msg://1646/"><font size="4">Dear All,</font>
      <div><font size="4"><br>
        </font></div>
      <div><font size="4">I have been a little busy lately and it
          doesn't seem like it is going to ease up for a while. I have
          been browsing over the correspondence. A few features are
          apparent.</font></div>
      <div><font size="4"><br>
        </font></div>
      <div><font size="4">1)<span class="Apple-tab-span" style="white-space:pre">       </span>Regarding
          the photon. For my part I am quite happy to accept the model
          forwarded by John Williamson and Martin van der Mark. To me
          their physics seems to make sense. My major point of
          contention with them is that the photon can extend between the
          emitter and absorber, even if that distance is billions of
          light years apart. To me this is a mathematical derivation
          introduced from the Minkowski space-time continuum, due to
          c^2t^2 - r^2 = 0, when a photon is travelling at c. An equally
          valid physical explanation is that time stands still for a
          photon. As far as a photon is concerned, it is emitted,
          travels for zero time in its own frame of reference, although
          with a real time to an external observer not travelling at c.
          It is subsequently absorbed when it contacts an absorbing
          medium such an electron. Photons can be scattered, losing part
          of their energy, as for example in Compton scattering. IMHO
          their descriptions appear to fit observation better than any
          alternative I have seen. There is still some more detail
          required.</font></div>
      <div><font size="4"><br>
        </font></div>
      <div><font size="4">2)<span class="Apple-tab-span" style="white-space:pre">       </span>I
          note that much attention is given to trying to get properties
          of the photon in particular and matter generally to fit
          quantum mechanics (QM) and general relativity (GR). I can
          understand this trend because they are both touted as the most
          accurate experimentally tested theories yet forwarded. However
          they do have some problems. A unity between the two has eluded
          all theoreticians to date. General relativity has been used as
          the basis of the Big Bang theory of formation of the universe.
          In explaining the observed universe, that theory is in error
          by 24 times the mass/energy of the observed universe plus ≈
          10^60 different universes in a multiverse. Quantum mechanics
          requires a very high energy density to explain some of its
          calculations. I have seen a figure of ≈ 10^110 Joule/ cubic
          metre (J/m^3), while astronomers measure something like 10^-10
          J/m^3. Irrespective of what they predict, both of those are
          significant errors that would not be tolerated in any other
          field of human endeavour. </font></div>
      <div><font size="4"><br>
        </font></div>
      <div><font size="4">3)<span class="Apple-tab-span" style="white-space:pre">       </span>Quantum
          mechanics is based upon Schrödinger's and Dirac's wave
          equations. It was developed because the electron's properties
          were too difficult to explain in terms of a particle, whereas
          a wave gives an electron a probability of being somewhere
          within its waveform, which can extend over large distances (+
          infinity to - infinity have been quoted). The justification
          for using it has been its de Broglie wavelength. As far as I
          am concerned an electron is a particle. Its rotating photon
          structure gives rise to its de Broglie wavelength. Whether you
          believe Richard G's derivation or my derivation (Ref 1) is
          irrelevant for this discussion. There is nothing in the de
          Broglie wavelength of a particle that can cause it to do
          anything except undergo diffraction. The double slit
          experiment doesn't prove the electron is a wave. It shows that
          the electron has an electromagnetic wave associated with it.
          When the electron approaches a double slit, it will pass
          through one of them, while its de Broglie wave will pass
          through both slits. Upon passing through both slits, the de
          Broglie wave unites with the electron and its direction is
          changed (depending upon a number of factors). When enough
          electrons have passed through the double slit, the wave
          diffraction pattern will be observed. Ref 1 also gives a
          reason for the special relativity corrections of mass, length
          and time, as well as predicting a diminution of radius with
          velocity. It shows the nature of an electron's spin and
          suggests a physical origin electric charge.</font></div>
      <div><font size="4"><br>
        </font></div>
      <div><font size="4">To measure which slit the electron passes
          through requires the application of a "voltage" sensor to at
          least one slit. That sensor, no matter how sensitive it is,
          will interfere with the electromagnetic field. Because the de
          Broglie wave is a component of the electron's electromagnetic
          field, it will interfere with that field. Once that field has
          been interfered with, it is no longer intact and cannot cause
          the electron to respond to its de Broglie wave diffraction. In
          the same manner, an electron's de Broglie wavelength is
          directly related to its energy. At the same time there are
          only a limited number of protons than can attract electrons to
          a nucleus, 1 for H up to 92 for U. The binding energy of an
          electron to a proton, Rydberg energy (RE) determines its
          wavelength. It is fixed. Under the rotating photon model of
          matter, an electron is an enormous gyroscope. Its whole mass
          is rotating at c at a radius hundreds of time larger than the
          diameter of a proton. Like any other gyroscope, it can't
          change its direction unless it can exchange angular momentum
          with another particle. In order to change direction, an
          electron must find another electron to form a pair. This
          becomes the basis of electron pairing that is responsible for
          chemical reactions. Quantisation of electron orbits are not
          necessary to explain why electrons' don't collapse into the
          nucleus. They are far too large to fit into even a uranium
          nucleus and even if they could, there are no energy levels in
          a stable nucleus to absorb them. </font></div>
      <div><font size="4"><br>
        </font></div>
      <div><font size="4">What I am trying to say in the above is that
          an electron is a particle and should be treated as such. The
          unique properties of the rotating photon model of the electron
          can explain many of its "quantum" properties. I would like to
          suggest you do not try to fit properties of either photons or
          particles into quantum mechanics. Rather try to fit them to
          what is observed. Observation is reality. IMHO early
          theoreticians (Schrödinger, Dirac et al.) did not have any
          known structure for an electron to apply particle physics to
          them. They had no alternative but to turn to wave equations
          for solutions. I would like to suggest that, using the
          rotating photon model of an electron, you should try to match
          it to observation. In my first attempt at that, Ref 1, I
          believe I gave a few matches to observation, as well as
          predicting a number of unknown properties. I am happy to let
          my theory survive on the detection of the predictions.</font></div>
      <div><font size="4"><br>
        </font></div>
      <div><font size="4">It is the same with general relativity.
          Einstein's field equations for space outside matter (gravity
          as we know it) fits all observations against which it has been
          tested. However it has only been tested for r > ≈ 10,000
          alpha (alpha = Schwarzschild radius 2GM/c^2). Using the
          principle of conservation of energy for the photon as I
          believe is described by John W and Martin vdM, it is possible
          to derive an alternative space-time geometry equation that
          matches all the observations that support Einstein's general
          theory of relativity at r >> alpha, but don't predict a
          singularity at r = alpha (Ref 2). </font></div>
      <div><font size="4"><br>
        </font></div>
      <div><font size="4">It is also possible to derive a similar
          expression for space-time inside matter, which describes the
          large scale gravitational attraction of the universe. When one
          does that it becomes apparent that an infinite static universe
          will not collapse under the gravitational attraction of its
          own mass. This leaves the possibility of an infinite static
          universe as an acceptable alternative to the Big Bang theory.
          In this theory there is no requirement for a cosmological
          constant to explain the non collapse stability of the universe
          if it is static. The observed ≈ 2.7˚K background temperature
          of space is just that. The tiny fluctuations are not due to
          the ripples in space-time about which galaxies formed. The
          higher temperature regions are close to galaxies because inter
          galactic gas and dust close to galaxies are heated more than
          those in the deep space between galaxies. I have predicted
          several measurements that can be made to distinguish between a
          universe that started from a Big Bang and one that is infinite
          and static. (This part of my work has not yet been published
          although I have put it together into a book form which is not
          yet available electronically.  John W, FYI I have
          significantly revised several aspects of the manuscript I gave
          you in July to overcome some if its significant deficiencies.)</font></div>
      <div><font size="4"><br>
        </font></div>
      <div><font size="4">4)<span class="Apple-tab-span" style="white-space:pre">       </span>There
          still appears to be a lack of experimental support for the
          theoretical ideas forward by various members in this group. I
          will restate, as does John W, experiment is the only arbiter
          of science. Using an eminent person's theory to support your
          theory may give credibility to your theory in the eyes of some
          people. It does nothing to support an observation. I
          will restate my earlier comment: If your want your theory to
          be accepted you need to show how it matches
          known experimental data and preferably make testable
          predictions. Without that these discussions go off at tangents
          that lead to nowhere and simply cause confusion. IMHO that is
          the outcome of the past few months discussion. I have been
          unable to pick up any conclusions that suggest otherwise but
          will be happy to read any summary that can show how the
          discussions have led to progress in the understanding of the
          nature of the photon.</font></div>
      <div><font size="4"><br>
        </font></div>
      <div><font size="4">Please note my change of email address to "<a
            moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:viv@universephysics.com"><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:viv@universephysics.com">viv@universephysics.com</a></a>".
          Could you please change my details, or indicate how I could
          make that change. Thank you! The website "<a
            moz-do-not-send="true" href="http://www.universephysics.com"><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.universephysics.com">www.universephysics.com</a></a>"
          is a website in progress. It has some information about my
          work, which I will update when I get more time and
          a better electronic format for my work. This work does make
          dozens of experimentally testable predictions and I am happy
          to let experiment adjudicate on it when I get it onto the
          website. I append a page from my study, which I have called
          "Explaining the Physical Universe" to suggest you should stop
          trying to match you theory to QM and GR and match observation.
          FYI my findings are close to those of Einstein's. I suggest
          that anyone who disagrees with SR and GR doesn't understand
          his work. I am happy to accept that GR is based upon mass
          distorting space time. I use different sets of calculations to
          get different metrics which match observation. My metric for
          space inside matter - the structure of the universe - shows
          why an infinite static universe will not collapse under its
          own mass without the need for a cosmological constant.</font></div>
      <div><font size="4"><br>
        </font></div>
      <div><font size="4">Cheers,</font></div>
      <div><font size="4"><br>
        </font></div>
      <div><font size="4">Viv Robinson</font></div>
      <div><font size="4"><br>
        </font></div>
      <div>Ref 1 <span class="Apple-tab-span" style="white-space:pre"> </span><a
          moz-do-not-send="true"
          href="http://www.la-press.com/journal-particle-physics-insights-j105"><a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://www.la-press.com/journal-particle-physics-insights-j105">http://www.la-press.com/journal-particle-physics-insights-j105</a></a>
        (click on "A Proposal on the Structure and Properties of the
        Electron")</div>
      <div>Ref 2<span class="Apple-tab-span" style="white-space:pre">   </span><a
          moz-do-not-send="true"
          href="http://www.scirp.org/Journal/PaperInformation.aspx?PaperID=35823"><a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://www.scirp.org/Journal/PaperInformation.aspx?PaperID=35823">http://www.scirp.org/Journal/PaperInformation.aspx?PaperID=35823</a></a></div>
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          <div>On 07/11/2015, at 10:08 PM, John Williamson <<a
              moz-do-not-send="true"
              href="mailto:John.Williamson@glasgow.ac.uk"><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:John.Williamson@glasgow.ac.uk">John.Williamson@glasgow.ac.uk</a></a>>
            wrote:</div>
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              normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px;
              -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width:
              0px; ">
              <div style="direction: ltr; font-family: Tahoma;
                font-size: 10pt; ">Dear All,<br>
                <br>
                I agree with David - but I think it goes much further
                than this - and cuts both ways.<br>
                <br>
                Although a single (good) experiment should destroy a
                weak theory this is no longer the fashion in 21st
                century physics.<br>
                <br>
                For example there was in the 70's a VERY good experiment
                that  destroyed the quark-parton model. It was O'Fallon
                et el's Phys Rev letter (1977). Notwithstanding this QCD
                has soldiered on regardless for nearly half a century.
                The experiment has been repeated manay times -
                confirming the original results. The conclusion: the
                quark parton model is simply inconsistent with
                experiment! Likewise gluons. There should exist
                glueballs. We do not see em. QED, QCD is bollocks again.
                In fact it is stark disagreement with a whole host of
                experimental triumphs (such as the EMC effect - one of
                mine).  Experiment used to rule in science, but it rules
                "science" no more (except for in the tiny minds of one
                or two dinosaurs like me).<br>
              </div>
            </div>
          </blockquote>
          <div><br>
          </div>
          <font size="4">I agree with John W that experiment is the only
            arbiter of science. If you don't have experimental support
            for your concepts, are they valid?</font><br>
          <blockquote type="cite">
            <div ocsi="0" fpstyle="1" style="font-family: Helvetica;
              font-size: medium; font-style: normal; font-variant:
              normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal;
              line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: -webkit-auto;
              text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space:
              normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px;
              -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width:
              0px; ">
              <div style="direction: ltr; font-family: Tahoma;
                font-size: 10pt; "><br>
                On the other had there are many experiments purporting
                to "confirm" this theory or that when they do no such
                thing. One such is the 3K background temperature - often
                cited as "proof" of the big bang. It is no such thing.
                ANY reasonable theory would have a term for something
                that is just, after all, the measured black body
                temperature of the (not completely frozen) universe, as
                Viv has argued strongly.<br>
                <br>
                Many folk have read things into experimental results
                which were not there (including me - on my own
                experiments!). One needs to take care.<br>
                <br>
                Actually I think what one REALLY needs to do to make
                proper progress is not dis this or that theory( fun
                though it is)- but just get on with making up new ones
                which ACTUALLY work. Then let Darwinian selection loose.
                Dinosaur I may be, but lets just see what a real live
                dinosaur can do let loose on the current scientific
                (socio-) ecology.<br>
                <br>
                Happy hunting folks!<br>
                <br>
                Cheers, John (W).<br>
                <br>
                <br>
                <div style="font-family: 'Times New Roman'; font-size:
                  16px; ">
                  <hr tabindex="-1">
                  <div id="divRpF295057" style="direction: ltr; "><font
                      size="2" face="Tahoma"><b>From:</b><span
                        class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>General [<a
                        moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:general-bounces+john.williamson=glasgow.ac.uk@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org"><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:general-bounces+john.williamson=glasgow.ac.uk@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org">general-bounces+john.williamson=glasgow.ac.uk@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org</a></a>]
                      on behalf of<a moz-do-not-send="true"
                        href="mailto:davidmathes8@yahoo.com">davidmathes8@yahoo.com</a><span
                        class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>[<a
                        moz-do-not-send="true"
                        href="mailto:davidmathes8@yahoo.com"><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:davidmathes8@yahoo.com">davidmathes8@yahoo.com</a></a>]<br>
                      <b>Sent:</b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Friday,
                      November 06, 2015 7:27 PM<br>
                      <b>To:</b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Hodge
                      John;<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a
                        moz-do-not-send="true"
                        href="mailto:general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org"><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org">general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org</a></a>;
                      Nature of Light and Particles - General Discussion<br>
                      <b>Subject:</b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Re:
                      [General] What a model of photons must do<br>
                    </font><br>
                  </div>
                  <div>
                    <div style="background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);
                      font-family: HelveticaNeue, 'Helvetica Neue',
                      Helvetica, Arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif;
                      font-size: 16px; ">
                      <div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1446833930782_13886"
                        dir="ltr"><span>John H</span></div>
                      <div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1446833930782_13886"
                        dir="ltr"><br>
                      </div>
                      <div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1446833930782_13886"
                        dir="ltr">Nice summary.</div>
                      <div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1446833930782_13886"
                        dir="ltr"><br>
                      </div>
                      <div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1446833930782_13886"
                        dir="ltr">Here are a few of my more lucid notes.</div>
                      <div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1446833930782_13886"
                        dir="ltr"><br>
                      </div>
                      <div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1446833930782_13886"
                        dir="ltr">Within our universe, there appears to
                        enough uniformity that a ToE might be possible.
                        This immediately eliminates multiverses or the
                        space in between universes. Are they all
                        related? Until shown otherwise, yes. </div>
                      <div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1446833930782_13886"
                        dir="ltr"><br>
                      </div>
                      <div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1446833930782_13886"
                        dir="ltr">I like the idea of photonic cavitation
                        that limits the velocity to c. While not
                        implemented yet on ships, fluid supercavitation
                        permits higher velocities in water than a hard
                        surface bow. Spacetime cavitation may be the
                        solution to faster than light travel. Using phat
                        photons or a phat photon laser, spacetime
                        supercavitation may be possible although I would
                        expect that locally, one would have to exceed
                        the Schwinger limit or at least use some sort of
                        broadband parametric amplification. </div>
                      <div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1446833930782_13886"
                        dir="ltr"><br>
                      </div>
                      <div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1446833930782_13886"
                        dir="ltr"><span>></span>A single experiment
                        that is unexplained falsifies a proposed photon
                        model.</div>
                      <div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1446833930782_13886"
                        dir="ltr"><br>
                      </div>
                      <div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1446833930782_13886"
                        dir="ltr">That statement needs some
                        qualification. Popper falsification is limited
                        in application as the method only applies to
                        unbounded domains in physics, an attempt
                        essentially to reasonably reduce a Monte Carlo
                        analysis of infinite proportions. The general
                        approach for falsification is to look to the
                        least likely to be confirmed. While useful at
                        times, beyond physics there are
                        difficulties...for example, in biological
                        science, evolution cannot be Popper Falsified. </div>
                      <div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1446833930782_13886"
                        dir="ltr"><br>
                      </div>
                      <div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1446833930782_13886"
                        dir="ltr">The general assumption is that one can
                        measure what they are experimentally looking for
                        with precision and accuracy. The assumption is
                        they known what they are looking for and at the
                        same time, there are no emergent properties or
                        hidden variables affecting the analysis. So the
                        Uncertainty Principle defines in part the limits
                        imposed by the tools we have. Since physics is
                        still on the hunt for a ToE, a single experiment
                        may not be enough especially when one only
                        understands 5% of the universe.</div>
                      <div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1446833930782_13886"
                        dir="ltr"><br>
                      </div>
                      <div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1446833930782_13886"
                        dir="ltr">Best</div>
                      <div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1446833930782_13886"
                        dir="ltr"><br>
                      </div>
                      <div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1446833930782_13886"
                        dir="ltr">David</div>
                      <div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1446833930782_13886"
                        dir="ltr"><br>
                      </div>
                      <div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1446833930782_13886"
                        dir="ltr"><br>
                      </div>
                      <div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1446833930782_13886"
                        dir="ltr"><br>
                      </div>
                      <div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1446833930782_13886"
                        dir="ltr"><br>
                      </div>
                      <div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1446833930782_13886"
                        dir="ltr"><br>
                      </div>
                      <div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1446833930782_13886"
                        dir="ltr"><br>
                      </div>
                      <br>
                      <blockquote id="yui_3_16_0_1_1446833930782_13703"
                        style="border-left-width: 2px;
                        border-left-style: solid; border-left-color:
                        rgb(16, 16, 255); margin-left: 5px; margin-top:
                        5px; padding-left: 5px; ">
                        <div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1446833930782_13702"
                          style="font-family: HelveticaNeue, 'Helvetica
                          Neue', Helvetica, Arial, 'Lucida Grande',
                          sans-serif; font-size: 16px; ">
                          <div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1446833930782_13701"
                            style="font-family: HelveticaNeue,
                            'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, 'Lucida
                            Grande', sans-serif; font-size: 16px; ">
                            <div dir="ltr"
                              id="yui_3_16_0_1_1446833930782_13885">
                              <hr id="yui_3_16_0_1_1446833930782_15234"
                                size="1"><font
                                id="yui_3_16_0_1_1446833930782_13884"
                                size="2" face="Arial"><b><span
                                    style="font-weight: bold; ">From:</span></b><span
                                  class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Hodge
                                John <<a moz-do-not-send="true"
                                  href="mailto:jchodge@frontier.com">jchodge@frontier.com</a>><br>
                                <b><span style="font-weight: bold; ">To:</span></b><span
                                  class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>"<a
                                  moz-do-not-send="true"
                                  href="mailto:general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org"><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org">general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org</a></a>"
                                <<a moz-do-not-send="true"
                                  href="mailto:general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org">general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org</a>><span
                                  class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>
                                <b><span style="font-weight: bold; ">Sent:</span></b><span
                                  class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Friday,
                                November 6, 2015 10:30 AM<br>
                                <b id="yui_3_16_0_1_1446833930782_16503"><span
id="yui_3_16_0_1_1446833930782_16502" style="font-weight: bold; ">Subject:</span></b><span
                                  class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>[General]
                                What a model of photons must do<br>
                              </font></div>
                            <div class="y_msg_container"
                              id="yui_3_16_0_1_1446833930782_13700"><br>
                              <div id="yiv9200667423">
                                <div
                                  id="yui_3_16_0_1_1446833930782_13744">
                                  <div
                                    id="yui_3_16_0_1_1446833930782_13743"
                                    style="background-color: rgb(255,
                                    255, 255); font-family:
                                    HelveticaNeue, 'Helvetica Neue',
                                    Helvetica, Arial, 'Lucida Grande',
                                    sans-serif; font-size: 16px; ">
                                    <div
                                      id="yiv9200667423yui_3_16_0_1_1446834386130_6906"
                                      class="yiv9200667423">Richard,Albrecht</div>
                                    <div
                                      id="yiv9200667423yui_3_16_0_1_1446834386130_6906"
                                      class="yiv9200667423"><br>
                                    </div>
                                    <div
                                      id="yiv9200667423yui_3_16_0_1_1446834386130_6903"
                                      class="yiv9200667423">I suggest a
                                      “unity” requirement to help
                                      identify light’s character. Our
                                      universe is one entity. Therefore,
                                      all in it must be related. Science
                                      is questing after a Theory of
                                      Everything (ToE) that must unite
                                      the big of cosmology, the small of
                                      light and particle physics, and
                                      the classical of our size domain.
                                      The corollary is that the weird
                                      quantum assumptions should beg for
                                      another explanation following the
                                      observations in the cosmological
                                      and classics domains.</div>
                                    <div
                                      id="yiv9200667423yui_3_16_0_1_1446834386130_6903"
                                      class="yiv9200667423"><br>
                                    </div>
                                    <div
                                      id="yiv9200667423yui_3_16_0_1_1446834386130_6904"
                                      class="yiv9200667423">I like to
                                      think from observations to model
                                      other observations.</div>
                                    <div
                                      id="yiv9200667423yui_3_16_0_1_1446834386130_6904"
                                      class="yiv9200667423"><br>
                                    </div>
                                    <div
                                      id="yiv9200667423yui_3_16_0_1_1446834386130_6910"
                                      class="yiv9200667423">Cosmology
                                      suggests that matter (discrete,
                                      extended, with edges) warps
                                      “space” (continuous or infinitely
                                      divisible, gravitational ether,
                                      plenum, quantum vacuum, fills
                                      between matter particles) and
                                      “space” directs particles.
                                      Therefore, the de Broglie–Bohm
                                      theory of 2 components of our
                                      universe seems much more likely to
                                      yield a ToE than the weird duality
                                      notion. It helps that the de
                                      Broglie–Bohm theory can derive the
                                      Schrödinger equation because real
                                      waves direct the particles.</div>
                                    <div
                                      id="yiv9200667423yui_3_16_0_1_1446834386130_6910"
                                      class="yiv9200667423"><br>
                                    </div>
                                    <div
                                      id="yiv9200667423yui_3_16_0_1_1446834386130_6912"
                                      class="yiv9200667423">The source
                                      of the wave field that directs the
                                      particles is still a problem for
                                      the de Broglie–Bohm theory if we
                                      insist the speed of the waves is<span
                                        class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><i
                                        class="yiv9200667423"
                                        id="yiv9200667423yui_3_16_0_1_1446834386130_6914">c</i><span
                                        class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>or
                                      less. Thomas van Flandern has
                                      championed the idea the speed of
                                      gravitational waves is much
                                      (billions of times) faster than<span
                                        class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><i
                                        class="yiv9200667423"
                                        id="yiv9200667423yui_3_16_0_1_1446834386130_6916">c</i>.
                                      If only matter is limited to<span
                                        class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><i
                                        class="yiv9200667423"
                                        id="yiv9200667423yui_3_16_0_1_1446834386130_6918">c</i>,
                                      the instruments measurements would
                                      be the same. But that doesn’t make
                                      the “space”, gravitational ether,
                                      plenum, or quantum vacuum any less
                                      real.</div>
                                    <div
                                      id="yiv9200667423yui_3_16_0_1_1446834386130_6920"
                                      class="yiv9200667423"><br>
                                    </div>
                                    <div
                                      id="yiv9200667423yui_3_16_0_1_1446834386130_6920"
                                      class="yiv9200667423">Afshar
                                      suggested his low intensity
                                      diffraction experiments were
                                      measuring single photons. I have
                                      some difficulty with this because
                                      laser light is stimulated emission
                                      light in pulses. However, the
                                      “walking drop” experiments show
                                      diffraction effects with only a
                                      single drop. (Linking the walking
                                      drop with de Broglie–Bohm theory
                                      seems to be becoming popular.) The
                                      unity postulate suggests the
                                      forces governing the drop may be
                                      similar to the forces governing
                                      light. Therefore, considering a
                                      single photon in the experiment at
                                      a time and the photon being
                                      directed when it is between the
                                      mask and screen is required. How
                                      does the de Broglie–Bohm theory
                                      develop the wave coming through
                                      the slit? Well, it doesn’t - oops.</div>
                                    <div
                                      id="yiv9200667423yui_3_16_0_1_1446834386130_6922"
                                      class="yiv9200667423"><br>
                                    </div>
                                    <div
                                      id="yiv9200667423yui_3_16_0_1_1446834386130_6922"
                                      class="yiv9200667423">The walking
                                      drop produces a wave as it drops
                                      then bounces off the surface. But
                                      an object staying in the medium
                                      does not produce a wave that can
                                      interfere with other waves unless
                                      in bounces in a direction
                                      perpendicular to the medium’s
                                      surface. What direction is
                                      perpendicular to the medium
                                      (space) the photon is in? The
                                      unity principle suggests only 3
                                      directions. How are the multiple,
                                      interfering waves generated from
                                      the photon? Is the photon agitated
                                      - what is the source of the energy
                                      for this? Gravity, the mass of the
                                      drop, and the external vibration
                                      of the medium produce energy
                                      externally for the walking drop.
                                      The analogy is breaking down. </div>
                                    <div
                                      id="yiv9200667423yui_3_16_0_1_1446834386130_6922"
                                      class="yiv9200667423"><br>
                                    </div>
                                    <div
                                      id="yiv9200667423yui_3_16_0_1_1446834386130_6922"
                                      class="yiv9200667423">A boat
                                      traveling along the surface of
                                      water produces waves to the side,
                                      a relatively flat surface behind
                                      and no waves in front as the boat
                                      expends all its forward energy.
                                      This is not a good analogy for a
                                      diffraction pattern exerting force
                                      on photons. An object can produce
                                      sonic waves as it moves through
                                      fluids by cavitation. But this
                                      expends tremendous energy. Indeed,
                                      this may be the reason the photons
                                      have limited speed. Over all this
                                      (producing an interference wave)
                                      is another oops. This is the cause
                                      of creating the Huygens- Fresnel
                                      wavelet idea. This principle is
                                      another violation of the unity
                                      principle and a cause of
                                      weirdness.</div>
                                    <div
                                      id="yiv9200667423yui_3_16_0_1_1446834386130_6924"
                                      class="yiv9200667423"><br>
                                    </div>
                                    <div
                                      id="yiv9200667423yui_3_16_0_1_1446834386130_6924"
                                      class="yiv9200667423">Examine the
                                      walking drop experiment again (see
                                      Johnn Bush “The new wave of
                                      pilot-wave theory” in Physics
                                      Today Aug 2015. There are also
                                      several U-Tube videos). The
                                      bouncing drop casues a wave
                                      outward from the drop. The
                                      barriers of the slit reflect the
                                      wave (this is difficult to see
                                      because of the strobing) and
                                      another part goes through the
                                      slit. This creates a standing wave
                                      that directs the drop. Quantum
                                      mechanics require not just the<span
                                        class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><span
                                        class="yiv9200667423"
                                        id="yiv9200667423yui_3_16_0_1_1446834386130_6926"
                                        style="font-family: Symbol; ">y</span><span
                                        class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>but
                                      also a<span
                                        class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><span
                                        class="yiv9200667423"
                                        id="yiv9200667423yui_3_16_0_1_1446834386130_6930"
                                        style="font-family: Symbol; ">y</span>*.
                                      The conjugate could be a wave
                                      directed toward the photon. Here
                                      we have analogy - reflected wave
                                      in the unity argument and<span
                                        class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><span
                                        class="yiv9200667423"
                                        id="yiv9200667423yui_3_16_0_1_1446834386130_6934"
                                        style="font-family: Symbol; ">y</span>*
                                      in quantum mechanics like the<span
                                        class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><span
                                        class="yiv9200667423"
                                        id="yiv9200667423yui_3_16_0_1_1446834386130_6938"
                                        style="font-family: Symbol; ">y</span>*
                                      of the Transaction Interpretation.
                                      Other models have to assume the
                                      intensity is<span
                                        class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><span
                                        class="yiv9200667423"
                                        id="yiv9200667423yui_3_16_0_1_1446834386130_6942"
                                        style="font-family: Symbol; ">y</span>*<span
                                        class="yiv9200667423"
                                        id="yiv9200667423yui_3_16_0_1_1446834386130_6946"
                                        style="font-family: Symbol; ">y</span><span
                                        class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>-
                                      more weirdness.</div>
                                    <div
                                      id="yiv9200667423yui_3_16_0_1_1446834386130_6950"
                                      class="yiv9200667423">Quantum
                                      mechanics also has a “no crossing”
                                      rule (assumption). Figure 5c in
                                      Bush’s paper shows red lines on
                                      the left side and blue lines on
                                      the right side entering the region
                                      near the slit. These lines cross
                                      and so that the red lines are
                                      mostly on the right and blue lines
                                      are mostly on the left beyond the
                                      slit. If photons are particles,
                                      their stream can cross.</div>
                                    <div
                                      id="yiv9200667423yui_3_16_0_1_1446834386130_6952"
                                      class="yiv9200667423"><br>
                                    </div>
                                    <div
                                      id="yiv9200667423yui_3_16_0_1_1446834386130_6952"
                                      class="yiv9200667423">The Airy
                                      patterns formed by each star
                                      through a telescopes aperture seem
                                      to not interfere. Peng, Barootkop,
                                      Roychoudhuri explored this in
                                      their Non-Interference of light
                                      (NIL) papers. If light within a
                                      beam of light from a single star
                                      can interfere, why doesn’t light
                                      (photons) interfere when the beams
                                      are coincident (yeah I know, but
                                      hold on a minute). Now consider
                                      the light from one star. It is
                                      coherent because it does from
                                      diffraction patterns when passed
                                      through a slit. Further, the light
                                      consists of several colors (energy
                                      of photon) and each color is
                                      diffracted. But the pattern has
                                      colors separated on the secondary
                                      peaks of the diffraction pattern.
                                      Each color is coherent but the
                                      multiple colors are in the beams
                                      and apparently not acting
                                      coherently as NIL suggests. Light
                                      from an incandescent source (black
                                      body radiation of a star) is not
                                      coherent initially but become
                                      coherent as it travels long
                                      distances or passes through a
                                      slit. The NIL experiments suggest
                                      coherent light can be made to be
                                      incoherent with a Fresnel lens.
                                      What makes light (photons)
                                      coherent? It cannot be the energy
                                      level of a photon because laser
                                      light is also coherent. Because
                                      each energy level photons create a
                                      slightly different diffraction
                                      pattern (different frequency),
                                      each color must produce a
                                      different frequency wave. The NIL
                                      energies is experienced in the
                                      classical world by common radios
                                      and TVs. Different frequency waves
                                      in a medium do not interfere or
                                      resonate. This implies a photon
                                      has structure and may not be the
                                      smallest thing in the universe
                                      (speculation: just because
                                      electromagnetic pulse travel at
                                      the speed of light doesn’t means
                                      the particles conveying the energy
                                      is photons - it could be these
                                      smaller particles). What
                                      characteristic of a photon
                                      determines its energy? The<i
                                        class="yiv9200667423"
                                        id="yiv9200667423yui_3_16_0_1_1446834386130_6954">E=mc</i>^2
                                      relation has<span
                                        class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><i
                                        class="yiv9200667423"
                                        id="yiv9200667423yui_3_16_0_1_1446834386130_6956">m</i><span
                                        class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>as
                                      inertial energy.</div>
                                    <div
                                      id="yiv9200667423yui_3_16_0_1_1446834386130_6958"
                                      class="yiv9200667423"><br>
                                    </div>
                                    <div
                                      id="yiv9200667423yui_3_16_0_1_1446834386130_6958"
                                      class="yiv9200667423">The
                                      Equivalence Principle is still a
                                      postulate not a derived relation.
                                      What is the structure of the
                                      photon that (warps space) produces
                                      gravitation and inertia? When a
                                      particle reaction has energy
                                      released and the mass (<i
                                        class="yiv9200667423"
                                        id="yiv9200667423yui_3_16_0_1_1446834386130_6960">m</i>)
                                      decreases, radiation in the form
                                      of photons is released. That is,
                                      photons comprise particles. If
                                      photons comprise particles, then
                                      of course particles also diffract.
                                      Then the structure of the
                                      particles and the structure of the
                                      photons must have some means to
                                      limit their velocity to less than<span
                                        class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><i
                                        class="yiv9200667423"
                                        id="yiv9200667423yui_3_16_0_1_1446834386130_6962">c</i>.</div>
                                    <div
                                      id="yiv9200667423yui_3_16_0_1_1446834386130_6964"
                                      class="yiv9200667423"><br>
                                    </div>
                                    <div
                                      id="yiv9200667423yui_3_16_0_1_1446834386130_6964"
                                      class="yiv9200667423">What makes
                                      the energy levels of photons not
                                      only different but also discrete
                                      (a characteristic of matter not a
                                      continuous medium)? Perhaps it is
                                      the number of sub-photon matter
                                      that makes the photon have
                                      discrete level. The continuous
                                      field can have discrete influences
                                      because the waves in the field
                                      have low energy troughs that the
                                      field pushes the particles into.<span
                                        class="yiv9200667423"
                                        id="yiv9200667423yui_3_16_0_1_1446834386130_6966"> </span></div>
                                    <div
                                      id="yiv9200667423yui_3_16_0_1_1446834386130_6968"
                                      class="yiv9200667423"> </div>
                                    <div
                                      id="yiv9200667423yui_3_16_0_1_1446834386130_6970"
                                      class="yiv9200667423">Now think of
                                      single model that meets all these
                                      issues. A single experiment that
                                      is unexplained falsifies a
                                      proposed photon model.</div>
                                  </div>
                                </div>
                              </div>
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