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    Hi Wolf!<br>
    <br>
    The famous equation E=mc^2 is in my understanding one of the
    mystifications in physics created in the last century. Einstein did
    it in a very drastic way: according to him E and m are two symbols
    for the same physical phenomenon. Here I strictly disagree. Look to
    the definitions of mass and energy, they are definitely different.
    If one has a working model for elementary particles, this relation
    results as a <i>relation </i>(nothing more) originating in the
    internal structure of an elementary particle.<br>
    <br>
    You see a problem with the electron regarding the repelling force
    and the centrifugal force in an electron. Since the 1930s well known
    physicists have tried to explain the electron classically on the
    basis of the electric force. Their model failed all. So the
    conclusion was (written in text books) that the electron cannot be
    understood but only mathematically treated by QM. <br>
    <br>
    In my model I have gone another way by assuming that the essential
    force in any elementary particle is the strong force. The strong
    force is composed in the particle by positive and negative
    "charges". With this assumption the electron can be calculated (like
    the other leptons and also quarks) with very precise results.
    Particularly the centrifugal force is not a point as the internal
    parts in an elementary particle are mass-less. And the electron
    looks neutral from the outside regarding the strong force. <br>
    <br>
    Albrecht<br>
    <br>
    <br>
    <br>
    <div class="moz-cite-prefix">Am 25.01.2016 um 20:44 schrieb Wolfgang
      Baer:<br>
    </div>
    <blockquote cite="mid:56A67B01.8070703@nascentinc.com" type="cite">
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      Does this not all start with the E=mc^2 energy mass equivalence
      postulate?<br>
      A moving photon has energy therefore mass , if the wave is
      confined to a circular path the mass could be considered
      stationary<br>
      The equations can all be manipulated to come up with various
      quantities and interpretations.<br>
      <br>
      What to me is problematic is the centrifugal forces. What balances
      the tremendous outward pull?<br>
      An electron only has charge that repels, and now centrifugal
      forces, what holds it all together?<br>
      <br>
      Wolf<br>
      <pre class="moz-signature" cols="72">Dr. Wolfgang Baer
Research Director
Nascent Systems Inc.
tel/fax 831-659-3120/0432
E-mail <a moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:wolf@NascentInc.com">wolf@NascentInc.com</a></pre>
      <div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 1/25/2016 8:33 AM, Albrecht Giese
        wrote:<br>
      </div>
      <blockquote cite="mid:56A64E73.6010208@a-giese.de" type="cite">
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        Dear Richard,<br>
        <br>
        you know that I object to your derivation of inertial mass. You
        deduce it from momentum. That is mathematically possible by
        using the known relations. But it is not logical in so far as
        momentum depends on inertia. In a world without inertia there
        would be no momentum.<br>
        <br>
        So we have to explain first the mechanism of inertia itself,
        then we can derive the momentum and the inertial mass.<br>
        <br>
        Best<br>
        Albrecht<br>
        <br>
        <br>
        <div class="moz-cite-prefix">Am 24.01.2016 um 20:42 schrieb
          Richard Gauthier:<br>
        </div>
        <blockquote
          cite="mid:0907288F-7DBF-486D-B8E1-30751A151F73@gmail.com"
          type="cite">
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          <div class="">Hello Vladimir and Chandra and all,</div>
          <div class=""><br class="">
          </div>
          <div class="">  Yes, I definitely support the idea of the
            ether as material space, and that all physical particles are
            derived from this ether. This ether can also be called a
            plenum or Cosmic Tension Field.</div>
          <div class=""><br class="">
          </div>
          <div class="">   I don’t however think that it is necessary to
            explain the inertial mass of particles in relation to a
            "coefficient of inertia” or "the amount of momentum the
            ether resists." I have shown (<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="https://www.academia.edu/19652036/The_Origin_of_the_Electrons_Inertia"
              class="">https://www.academia.edu/19652036/The_Origin_of_the_Electrons_Inertia</a> )



            by a very simple derivation that the inertial mass m of an
            electron may be derived from the momentum of the circling
            photon in a circulating-photon model of the electron, whose
            circling photon has momentum mc where m = Eo/c^2 = hf/c^2 ,
             where Eo is the rest energy 0.511 MeV of the electron and f
            is the frequency of the circulating photon in the resting
            electron. Secondly, in a similar way I derived a linearly
            moving photon's inertial mass to be M-inertial = hf/c^2 ,
            where f is the photon’s frequency, even though a photon has
            zero rest mass. Thirdly, I derived the inertial mass of a
            relativistic electron, whose momentum is p=gamma mv, to be
             M-inertial = gamma m , even though the moving electron's
            rest mass is m.  </div>
          <div class=""><br class="">
          </div>
          <div class="">   I present these  derivations below, taken
            from the <a moz-do-not-send="true"
              href="http://academia.edu" class="">academia.edu</a> session
            on my electron inertia article at <a moz-do-not-send="true"
              href="https://www.academia.edu/s/a26afd55e0?source=link"
              class="">https://www.academia.edu/s/a26afd55e0?source=link</a> :</div>
          <div class=""><br class="">
          </div>
          <div class=""><span class="js-non-expanded-comment" style="box-sizing: border-box; color: rgb(73, 72, 72); font-family: Georgia, serif; font-size: 14px; line-height: 22px; white-space: pre-wrap;">"One reason people don’t think that a photon has any inertial mass (because it has no rest mass) is that how do you get a photon to change its momentum (i.e. accelerate) in order to measure its inertial mass. It can’t go faster or slower than c in a vacuum, so it can’t accelerate in a linear direction, and in normal physics a photon doesn’t follow a curved path (except with gravity), which would make it possible to measure its centripetal acceleration c^2/R . But as I showed in my short el</span><span class="js-expanded-comment" style="box-sizing: border-box; color: rgb(73, 72, 72); font-family: Georgia, serif; font-size: 14px; line-height: 22px; white-space: pre-wrap;">ectron inertia  article at <a moz-do-not-send="true" href="https://www.academia.edu/19652036/The_Origin_of_%0A%2
0th%0A%2%0A0e_Elect%0A%0Arons_Inertia" class="">https://www.academia.edu/19652036/The_Origin_of_the_Electrons_Inertia</a> , the electron model in a resting electron has the photon going in a circle, with momentum mc and speed c, and the electron's inertial mass is then calculated to be M-inertial =(dp/dt)/Acentrifugal =wmc/(c^2/r)= m which is the inertial mass of the electron. But this calculation of the circling charged photon's inertial mass is independent of the radius of the charged photon’s circular orbit. Let that circular radius go towards infinity and you get a photon traveling in essentially a straight line, still having its inertial mass M =hf/c^2 (where the photon frequency f decreases as the radius of the circle increases) . So according to this logic,  a linearly moving photon DOES have inertial mass M-inertial =hf/c^2 even though a photon has zero rest mass. And when a relativistic electron with momentum p=gamma mv travels in a circle with speed v, the inertial mass cal
cul
 ation ab
ove
  gives M
-in
ertial = gamma m for a circling relativistic electron, and not just m the electron’s rest mass . Extending the radius here towards infinity also gives a linearly moving electron an inertial mass M = gamma m and not just the electron's rest mass m."</span></div>
          <div class=""><span class="js-expanded-comment" style="box-sizing: border-box; color: rgb(73, 72, 72); font-family: Georgia, serif; font-size: 14px; line-height: 22px; white-space: pre-wrap;">
</span></div>
          <div class=""><span class="js-expanded-comment" style="box-sizing: border-box; color: rgb(73, 72, 72); font-family: Georgia, serif; font-size: 14px; line-height: 22px; white-space: pre-wrap;"><span style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; line-height: normal; white-space: normal;" class="">      As far as I know these are all original derivations of the inertial mass of a resting electron, a photon and a relativistic electron based on a circulating photon model of an electron. I would be pleased to be shown otherwise.</span></span></div>
          <div class=""><span class="js-expanded-comment" style="box-sizing: border-box; color: rgb(73, 72, 72); font-family: Georgia, serif; font-size: 14px; line-height: 22px; white-space: pre-wrap;"><span style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; line-height: normal; white-space: normal;" class="">
</span></span></div>
          <div class=""><span class="js-expanded-comment" style="box-sizing: border-box; color: rgb(73, 72, 72); font-family: Georgia, serif; font-size: 14px; line-height: 22px; white-space: pre-wrap;"><span style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; line-height: normal; white-space: normal;" class="">  Richard</span></span></div>
          <div class=""><span class="js-expanded-comment" style="box-sizing: border-box; color: rgb(73, 72, 72); font-family: Georgia, serif; font-size: 14px; line-height: 22px; white-space: pre-wrap;">    </span></div>
          <br class="">
          <div>
            <blockquote type="cite" class="">
              <div class="">On Jan 24, 2016, at 6:42 AM, Roychoudhuri,
                Chandra <<a moz-do-not-send="true"
                  href="mailto:chandra.roychoudhuri@uconn.edu" class="">chandra.roychoudhuri@uconn.edu</a>>



                wrote:</div>
              <br class="Apple-interchange-newline">
              <div class="">
                <div class="WordSection1" style="page: WordSection1;
                  font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style:
                  normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal;
                  letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans:
                  auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px;
                  text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows:
                  auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width:
                  0px;">
                  <div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt;
                    font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span
                      style="font-size: 11pt;" class="">Yes, Vlad, that
                      is also my viewpoint.<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div>
                  <div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt;
                    font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span
                      style="font-size: 11pt;" class="">I do not
                      remember whether I have attached this paper while
                      communicating with you earlier. I call the
                      “plenum” Cosmic Tension Field (CTF), to be
                      descriptive in its essential properties.<o:p
                        class=""></o:p></span></div>
                  <div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt;
                    font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span
                      style="font-size: 11pt;" class="">Chandra.<o:p
                        class=""></o:p></span></div>
                  <div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt;
                    font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><a
                      moz-do-not-send="true" name="_MailEndCompose"
                      class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt;
                        font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31,
                        73, 125);" class=""> </span></a></div>
                  <div class="">
                    <div style="border-style: solid none none;
                      border-top-color: rgb(181, 196, 223);
                      border-top-width: 1pt; padding: 3pt 0in 0in;"
                      class="">
                      <div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size:
                        12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;"
                        class=""><b class=""><span style="font-size:
                            10pt; font-family: Tahoma, sans-serif;"
                            class="">From:</span></b><span
                          style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma,
                          sans-serif;" class=""><span
                            class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>General

                          [<a moz-do-not-send="true"
                            class="moz-txt-link-freetext"
href="mailto:general-bounces+chandra.roychoudhuri=uconn.edu@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org">mailto:general-bounces+chandra.roychoudhuri=uconn.edu@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org</a>]<span
                            class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><b
                            class="">On Behalf Of<span
                              class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></b>Vladimir



                          Tamari<br class="">
                          <b class="">Sent:</b><span
                            class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Saturday,


                          January 23, 2016 7:00 PM<br class="">
                          <b class="">To:</b><span
                            class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Nature
                          of Light and Particles - General Discussion<br
                            class="">
                          <b class="">Subject:</b><span
                            class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Re:
                          [General] (no subject)<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div>
                    </div>
                  </div>
                  <div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt;
                    font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><o:p
                      class=""> </o:p></div>
                  <div class="">
                    <div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size:
                      12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;"
                      class="">Hi Richard <o:p class=""></o:p></div>
                  </div>
                  <div class="">
                    <div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size:
                      12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;"
                      class="">I barge into your discussion without
                      knowing your views on a "plenum field" but if it
                      is an ether I definitely think there is one. A
                      "coefficent of inertia" might be defined as the
                      amount of momentum the ether resists. In a charged
                      or gravitational field this coefficent would
                      increase...I think of this in terms of my
                      Beautiful Universe ether of dielectric nodes,
                      except this may give the wrong idea it is
                      something matter wades in.. not so. Matter and
                      ether are made if the selfsame nodes of energy!<o:p
                        class=""></o:p></div>
                  </div>
                  <div class="">
                    <div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size:
                      12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;"
                      class="">Cheers<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
                  </div>
                  <div class="">
                    <div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size:
                      12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;"
                      class="">Vladimir<br class="">
                      <br class="">
                      _____________________<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
                    <div class="">
                      <div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size:
                        12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;"
                        class=""><a moz-do-not-send="true"
                          href="http://vladimirtamari.com/"
                          style="color: purple; text-decoration:
                          underline;" class="">vladimirtamari.com</a><o:p
                          class=""></o:p></div>
                    </div>
                  </div>
                  <div class="">
                    <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin: 0in 0in 12pt;
                      font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman',
                      serif;"><br class="">
                      On Jan 21, 2016, at 7:41 AM, Richard Gauthier <<a
                        moz-do-not-send="true"
                        class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated"
                        href="mailto:richgauthier@gmail.com"><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:richgauthier@gmail.com">richgauthier@gmail.com</a></a>>



                      wrote:<o:p class=""></o:p></p>
                  </div>
                  <blockquote style="margin-top: 5pt; margin-bottom:
                    5pt;" class="">
                    <div class="">
                      <div class="">
                        <div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size:
                          12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;"
                          class="">Hi Hodge,<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
                      </div>
                      <div class="">
                        <div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size:
                          12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;"
                          class="">    I don’t remember asking that. But
                          if I did, I’m glad the question was helpful.<o:p
                            class=""></o:p></div>
                      </div>
                      <div class="">
                        <div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size:
                          12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;"
                          class="">   I’m thinking about inertia these
                          days. Do you or others have any insights about
                          its nature?<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
                      </div>
                      <div class="">
                        <div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size:
                          12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;"
                          class="">         Richard<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
                      </div>
                      <div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size:
                        12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;"
                        class=""><o:p class=""> </o:p></div>
                      <div class="">
                        <blockquote style="margin-top: 5pt;
                          margin-bottom: 5pt;" class="">
                          <div class="">
                            <div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt;
                              font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New
                              Roman', serif;" class="">On Jan 20, 2016,
                              at 1:43 PM, Hodge John <<a
                                moz-do-not-send="true"
                                class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated"
                                href="mailto:jchodge@frontier.com"><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:jchodge@frontier.com">jchodge@frontier.com</a></a>>



                              wrote:<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
                          </div>
                          <div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt;
                            font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New
                            Roman', serif;" class=""><o:p class=""> </o:p></div>
                          <div class="">
                            <div class="">
                              <div class="">
                                <div
                                  id="yui_3_16_0_1_1453325918779_2533"
                                  class="">
                                  <div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt;
                                    font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times
                                    New Roman', serif; background-color:
                                    white;" class=""><span
                                      style="font-family: Helvetica,
                                      sans-serif;" class="">Richard
                                      Gauthier:<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div>
                                </div>
                                <div
                                  id="yui_3_16_0_1_1453325918779_2535"
                                  class="">
                                  <div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt;
                                    font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times
                                    New Roman', serif; background-color:
                                    white;" class=""><span
                                      style="font-family: Helvetica,
                                      sans-serif;" class="">You asked if
                                      the galaxy redshift, Pioneer
                                      anomaly, Pound--Rebka experiment
                                      model had a velocity term. I
                                      looked at redshift data for 1
                                      galaxy and found no indication of
                                      a velocity term.<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div>
                                </div>
                                <div
                                  id="yui_3_16_0_1_1453325918779_2537"
                                  class="">
                                  <div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt;
                                    font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times
                                    New Roman', serif; background-color:
                                    white;" class=""><span
                                      style="font-family: Helvetica,
                                      sans-serif;" class=""> <o:p
                                        class=""></o:p></span></div>
                                </div>
                                <div
                                  id="yui_3_16_0_1_1453325918779_2539"
                                  class="">
                                  <div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt;
                                    font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times
                                    New Roman', serif; background-color:
                                    white;" class=""><span
                                      style="font-family: Helvetica,
                                      sans-serif;" class="">I had not
                                      noticed this in the equations.
                                      Your suggestion that the plenum
                                      field can look like the Higgs
                                      field seems valid. That is, the
                                      acceleration of the plenum field
                                      looks like it adds energy (mass)
                                      is a Higgs Field characteristic.
                                      Thus, the plenum is closer to the
                                      idea of a quantum field and Higgs
                                      field (weak force).<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div>
                                </div>
                                <div
                                  id="yui_3_16_0_1_1453325918779_2541"
                                  class="">
                                  <div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt;
                                    font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times
                                    New Roman', serif; background-color:
                                    white;" class=""><span
                                      style="font-family: Helvetica,
                                      sans-serif;" class=""> <o:p
                                        class=""></o:p></span></div>
                                </div>
                                <div
                                  id="yui_3_16_0_1_1453325918779_2543"
                                  class="">
                                  <div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt;
                                    font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times
                                    New Roman', serif; background-color:
                                    white;" class=""><span
                                      style="font-family: Helvetica,
                                      sans-serif;" class="">Thanks for
                                      the insight.<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div>
                                </div>
                                <div
                                  id="yui_3_16_0_1_1453325918779_2545"
                                  class="">
                                  <div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt;
                                    font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times
                                    New Roman', serif; background-color:
                                    white;" class=""><span
                                      style="font-family: Helvetica,
                                      sans-serif;" class=""> <o:p
                                        class=""></o:p></span></div>
                                </div>
                                <div
                                  id="yui_3_16_0_1_1453325918779_2579"
                                  class="">
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                                    font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times
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                                    white;" class="">Hodge<span
                                      style="font-family: Helvetica,
                                      sans-serif;" class=""><o:p
                                        class=""></o:p></span></div>
                                </div>
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