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    Wolf,<br>
    <br>
    good questions, and I see that more detailed explanations are always
    necessary but most times not so appropriate so not to bore the
    reader.<br>
    <br>
    But to your details:<br>
    <br>
    The sub-particles must be mass-less as they move with speed of light
    c. This motion with c is necessary to explain dilation.
    (Historically this was already seen this way by Hendrik Lorentz and
    Joseph Lamor around the year 1900; later replaced by Einstein's
    approach which was purely mathematical rather than physical.)<br>
    <br>
    If the sub-particles ("Basic Particles") are mass-less then a
    planetary model is not applicable. So the other possibility is that
    they are bound to each other by a multi-pole field. This is not so
    special in physics as the bind of atoms in a molecule is also a
    multi-pole bind. Such field binds parts together and at the same
    time keep a distance as one partner resides in the potential minimum
    of the field of the other partner. In case of the bind between atoms
    it is the electric force, in case of the basic particle it is the
    strong force. But the structure of these fields is similar.<br>
    <br>
    There is no force necessary in the normal case to keep these
    particles on their orbit as there is no mass. A force occurs if an
    "external agent" will act.  But to say it again: As the
    sub-particles do not have any mass there is no equilibrium of forces
    to define the circular path.  The influence of an "external agent"
    will of course be also a field. This field overlays the internal
    field and for the time of such external action the fields are of
    course distorted to a certain amount. This is the situation were one
    can feel inertia.<br>
    <br>
    The "external agent" who makes the whole particle move will in the
    normal case be an electric field. But may be as well any other kind
    of force if existent. <br>
    <br>
    The orbital motion will explain an orbital momentum but also the
    existence of a magnetic moment in the case of an electrically
    charged particle. And that approach has very precise results from
    purely classical calculations, no QM necessary. <br>
    <br>
    Maybe the fields in the particle are more complicated than I assume
    them to be, but for the question of mass, magnetic moment etc. my
    assumptions are sufficient. <br>
    <br>
    Best wishes back<br>
    Albrecht<br>
    <br>
    <br>
    <div class="moz-cite-prefix">Am 03.02.2016 um 22:51 schrieb Wolfgang
      Baer:<br>
    </div>
    <blockquote cite="mid:56B27675.3020602@nascentinc.com" type="cite">
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      albrecht;<br>
      Your paragraph in bold below is a very nice and concise way to
      summarize your point, especially if the Lande factor can be fit.<br>
      I have "Relativity Based on Physical Processes Rather Than
      Space-Time" and the "can a photon be described...." article from
      SPIE 2015<br>
      I can see after eq. 2.6 the words "<i>this is now the inertial
        mass</i>...'<br>
      <br>
      this calculation makes sense but works out because you have <br>
      1) defined a specific binding field as a multipole bond<br>
      2) assumed mass-less particles which react individually to some
      "external agent" <br>
      <br>
      Is there a reference or can you explain both of these assumptions
      or else one might think you backed into them.<br>
      I mean your requirements for the sub-particles and their fields
      may be more complicated than the effects they explain.<br>
      <br>
      "for example you say the internal motion must be circular in order
      to account for angular momentum"<br>
      <br>
      Does that not imply an inertial mass when the particles are in
      their equilibrium orbits? <br>
      If it takes an external agent force to show the properties of
      inertial mass, how does this equilibrium field have a minimum.<br>
      in the planetary orbit model the minimum is produced by a a
      coulomb force pulling in and a centripetal force pulling out<br>
      how did you get your minimum?<br>
      <br>
      best wishes<br>
      wolf<br>
      <pre class="moz-signature" cols="72">Dr. Wolfgang Baer
Research Director
Nascent Systems Inc.
tel/fax 831-659-3120/0432
E-mail <a moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:wolf@NascentInc.com">wolf@NascentInc.com</a></pre>
      <div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 1/30/2016 1:22 PM, Albrecht Giese
        wrote:<br>
      </div>
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        Hello Richard,<br>
        <br>
        yes, we have to assume fundamentals in physics, and which those
        are, may be different for different physicists. In my view,
        forces are fundamental phenomena where I do not see an
        explanation on a lower level, at least at present. I follow QM
        at this point in so far, as forces are realized by exchange
        particles which are mass-less,  move with c and have a distance
        law of 1/r^2. .<br>
        <br>
        Momentum and inertia are in my view the same phenomenon. Someone
        said it earlier in this discussion: Momentum is the motion of an
        inertial mass. So, to explain inertial mass by momentum or
        momentum by inertia as general explanation are in my view
        tautological statements. There is something explained
        essentially by itself, nothing new about it.<br>
        <br>
        <b>Inertia is caused in my view (I think explained here several
          times) by a very fundamental process. Every extended object
          must have inertia. This is caused by nothing than the
          finiteness of the speed of light by which the internal forces
          in an object propagate. And without internal forces an
          extended object cannot exist. This is true for any type of
          force, so in our world the strong force and the electric
          force. In an elementary particle the strong force dominates,
          so I have restricted my explanation mostly to the strong
          force. To be precise, the electric force must not be
          overlooked. In my model the consideration of the electric
          force in the electron causes the Landé factor (very
          precisely!)</b><br>
        <br>
        So,  the fact that an extended object behaves inert, is not a
        possibility or some special theory, but it is completely
        unavoidable that an extended object is inert.<br>
        <br>
        Only because you mention it: In my model there does not exist a
        gravitational mass because gravity has nothing to do with mass.
        But this is another topic. If you are interested you can find it
        explained on my web site "origin of gravity" (which is the no. 1
        in the internet about this topic since 12 years).<br>
        <br>
        About Newton's law: As I have understood, Newton has defined
        mass as F/a. 'F' is in his view an elementary quantity visible
        e.g. by stretching a spring. 'a' is defined by length and time,
        both are also elementaries for him in the way that length is
        given by a prototype ruler and time by some sufficiently defined
        oscillators like a pendulum. We have better definitions now
        using means of higher precision, but that does not change the
        idea behind.<br>
        <br>
        One can of course have a lot of cognition-related thoughts about
        the understanding of these quantities, but that seems to me to
        be beyond the level which we need here.<br>
        <br>
        One famous American physicist ones wrote: Mass is a great
        mystery. I know that many understand it this way. But I am very
        sure that my finding that every extended object has inertial
        mass solves this "mystery" completely. It is my intention to
        convince my colleagues about this since more than 15 year on
        conferences and by the internet. And I have never got a refuting
        argument. Most main stream physicists refer to Higgs and say
        that one does not need another explanation. But never something
        more substantial.<br>
        <br>
        My model of inertia is in some way similar to the Higgs
        mechanism. According to the Higgs theory there are virtual
        particles intermediately generated in the Higgs field. These
        virtual particles couple to the real particle in view and keep
        staying at rest in the same inertial system as the real
        particle. If now the real particle is accelerated to any
        direction, it moves off the virtual Higgs and that needs a
        force. This force is inertia. - The similarity to my model is
        that in my model the role of the virtual Higgs is realized by
        the other (real) sub-particle in the elementary particle. <br>
        <br>
        My model does not explain why there are certain masses in
        particles realized and others not. Otto Greulich has found a
        numerical relation for the existing particles but no explanation
        why it works. In his algorithm the factor alpha plays an
        important role. And I have the impression that the relation of
        strong force and electric force, which is described by alpha,
        plays an essential role in the question if a particle is stable.
        Otto is looking for a possible mechanism, but up to now he has
        no solution. I also think about it, but presently also with no
        success.<br>
        <br>
        To your last comment: Momentum is the product of inertial mass
        and speed, as you surely know. Mass is scalar, that is right,
        but speed is a vector and so it is unavoidable that the product,
        called momentum, is a vector. But just from this definition of
        momentum it is visible that momentum is not fundamental but a
        combination of two other units. Isn't it?<br>
        <br>
        Albrecht<br>
        <br>
        <br>
        <div class="moz-cite-prefix">Am 28.01.2016 um 01:33 schrieb
          Richard Gauthier:<br>
        </div>
        <blockquote
          cite="mid:32A31459-EDB2-4B1B-922F-4C838FEB7CD1@gmail.com"
          type="cite">
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          <div class="">Hello Albrecht,</div>
          <div class=""><br class="">
          </div>
          <div class="">   You want to explain inertia and therefore
            momentum (in your view) by the strong force. But what is
            your “mechanism” or explanation for the strong force?  You
            have not explained or even tried to explain the strong force
            so you are actually doing what you are accusing me of doing
            — not explaining what momentum is or what is its
            “mechanism”.  But I’m not trying to explain momentum, I’m
            trying to explain inertial mass or inertia in terms of
            momentum. If inertia can be explained in terms of momentum,
            I would say that is progress. If this leads to a greater
            insights into why inertial mass equals gravitational mass
            (if it does), that would be further progress. Scientific
            progress occurs in steps, it’s not all or nothing.</div>
          <div class=""><br class="">
          </div>
          <div class="">    Newton’s F=ma is actually a tautological or
            circular relationship. A force F does not CAUSE
            acceleration. Acceleration is observed and measured. “Force"
            is DEFINED as ma, never observed. Or m is DEFINED as F/a.
             “Mass" is also never observed. Physical objects are
            hypothesized, observed, measured or inferred. None of
            Newton’s laws have ever been experimentally proved, at least
            according to MIT physics lecturer Walter Lewin (introduction
            to mechanics). You can’t prove or disprove a definition.
            F=ma is a circular relationship that works within certain
            limits without knowing what either force or mass is
            fundamentally.</div>
          <div class=""><br class="">
          </div>
          <div class="">     The cause of the inertia of the electron is
            considered to be one of the deepest mysteries of physics.
            Frank Wilczek in his article “The origin of mass” at <a
              class="moz-txt-link-freetext"
href="http://web.mit.edu/physics/news/physicsatmit/physicsatmit_03_wilczek_originofmass.pdf"><a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://web.mit.edu/physics/news/physicsatmit/physicsatmit_03_wilczek_originofmass.pdf">http://web.mit.edu/physics/news/physicsatmit/physicsatmit_03_wilczek_originofmass.pdf</a></a> concludes: </div>
          <div class="">
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              <div class="layoutArea">
                <div class="column">
                  <p class=""><span style="font-size: 11.000000pt;
                      font-family: 'Granjon'" class="">"Still, as I’ve
                      already mentioned, our understanding of the origin
                      of mass is by no means complete. We have achieved
                      a beautiful and profound understanding of the
                      origin of </span><span style="font-size:
                      11.000000pt; font-family: 'Granjon'; font-style:
                      italic" class="">most </span><span
                      style="font-size: 11.000000pt; font-family:
                      'Granjon'" class="">of the mass of ordinary
                      matter, but not of </span><span style="font-size:
                      11.000000pt; font-family: 'Granjon'; font-style:
                      italic" class="">all </span><span
                      style="font-size: 11.000000pt; font-family:
                      'Granjon'" class="">of it. The value of the
                      electron mass, in particular, remains deeply
                      mysterious even in our most advanced speculations
                      about unification and string theory. And ordinary
                      matter, we have recently learned, supplies only a
                      small fraction of mass in the Universe as a whole.
                      More beautiful and profound revelations surely
                      await discovery. We continue to search for
                      concepts and theories that will allow us to
                      understand the origin of mass in all its forms, by
                      unveiling more of Nature’s hidden symmetries." </span></p>
                </div>
              </div>
            </div>
          </div>
          <div class="">And Wilczek is talking about the origin of the
            magnitude of the electron’s mass, not the cause of the
            electron’s inertia.</div>
          <div class=""><br class="">
          </div>
          <div class=""> I am not claiming, as you do, to derive the
            electron’s mass m = 0.511 MeV/c^2  in a circular way from
            the Bohr magneton ehbar/2m which isn’t even the electron’s
            experimental magnetic moment, only an approximation
            calculated from the known measured values of e, h and m.
             But it is not tautological or circular to derive the
            electron’s inertial mass m = 0.511Mev/c^2 from a circulating
            photon model of an electron where this circulating photon
            has (for no known reason) energy hf = 0.511MeV and momentum
            p = 0.511MeV/c . After all, a photon’s rest mass (0 Mev/c^2)
             is not the same as a photon’s inertial mass (hf/c^2). And
            the rest mass m of a moving electron is not the same as the
            inertial mass gamma m of this moving electron. </div>
          <div class=""><br class="">
          </div>
          <div class="">As far as what you say about the Higgs mechanism
            and inertia, here’s an interesting quote from Bernhard
            Haisch in <a moz-do-not-send="true"
              class="moz-txt-link-freetext"
              href="http://www.calphysics.org/articles/newscientist.html">http://www.calphysics.org/articles/newscientist.html</a> .



            Haisch and his colleagues have been studying inertia and its
            possible explanation for years: <span style="font-family:
              verdana; font-size: small; text-align: justify;
              background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);" class="">"But the
              Higgs mechanism does not explain why mass, or its energy
              equivalent, resists motion or reacts to gravity," says
              Bernard Haisch of the California Institute for Physics and
              Astrophysics in Palo Alto. He believes instead that
              inertia and gravity are manifestations of far more
              familiar effects. </span></div>
          <div class=""><br class="">
          </div>
          <div class="">So the Higgs field, while it may “explain” why
            some particles have rest mass and others don't, apparently
            doesn’t explain the inertia of mass. So your explanation of
            inertia is apparently not in competition with the Higgs
            mechanism of mass. But I would say that your explanation of
            inertial mass in terms of the strong nuclear force IS in
            competition with the derivation of inertial mass from
            momentum. And Occam’s razor and physical facts do apply.</div>
          <div class=""><br class="">
          </div>
          <div class="">One more comment. Momentum is a vector quantity,
            with both magnitude and direction. Inertial mass is a scalar
            quantity, with magnitude only. So Inertia cannot be the same
            as momentum unless inertia is also a vector quantity, having
            direction as well as magnitude. Perhaps inertia IS a vector
            quantity after all, subject to vector addition (and
            cancellation). That would be interesting.</div>
          <div class=""><br class="">
          </div>
          <div class="">Richard</div>
          <div class=""><br class="">
          </div>
          <div class=""><br class="">
          </div>
          <div class=""><br class="">
          </div>
          <div class="">  </div>
          <br class="">
          <div>
            <blockquote type="cite" class="">
              <div class="">On Jan 27, 2016, at 1:37 PM, Albrecht Giese
                <<a moz-do-not-send="true"
                  class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated"
                  href="mailto:genmail@a-giese.de">genmail@a-giese.de</a>>


                wrote:</div>
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                <div text="#000000" bgcolor="#FFFFFF" class=""> Hello
                  Richard,<br class="">
                  <br class="">
                  there is not necessarily a hierarchy between mass and
                  momentum. But the origin of all is the resistance
                  against a change of the motion state. That resistance
                  is called inertia. And this resistance causes momentum
                  as well as mass. <br class="">
                  <br class="">
                  If you understand the momentum as on the top of the
                  hierarchy, you have to explain which mechanism causes
                  momentum. There must be one. What is it?<br class="">
                  <br class="">
                  My explanation of inertia is the only working one
                  which I know. And which of course is not a
                  tautological explanation. The other explanation
                  followed by main stream is the Higgs model. That is
                  derived from QM, and that is something which I
                  personally do not like very much. But the strong
                  argument against the Higgs model is the fact that the
                  necessary Higgs field does not exist as far as we
                  know. And again, I have never heard about another
                  model of inertial which is not tautological. <br
                    class="">
                  <br class="">
                  My model for leptons and for quarks has to function as
                  it does, under the assumption that inertia has to be
                  explained. And we may not ask for Occam's Razor if
                  there is no alternative. I do not see any. <br
                    class="">
                  <br class="">
                  My model explains the photon in a fundamentally
                  similar way as a lepton and a quark. But for the
                  photon something has to be added to explain its
                  constant speed, i.e. the fact that it cannot be found
                  at rest. And the fact of twice the spin. This letter
                  point seems to me not too serious. <br class="">
                  <br class="">
                  The relativistic increase of the particle mass at
                  motion (not only the electron, but all) is easily and
                  straight explained by the model. Take the calculation
                  of the inertial mass and adjust the distance of the
                  sub-particles for the relativistic contraction. Then
                  the straight result is the new mass increased by the
                  factor gamma. Your find it in my web site about
                  "origin of mass". And the relation energy to mass:
                  E=mc^2 follows immediately from the same calculation.
                  Who else has ever deduced the famous formula of
                  Einstein? I do not know any else deduction which
                  refers to a physical mechanism. <br class="">
                  <br class="">
                  Strong force? In the 1940s calculations of the
                  electron have been made in Germany which were based on
                  the assumption that there are only electrical forces
                  in the particle. The resulting mass turned out to be
                  too low by a factor of ca. 300. This is about the
                  factor by which the strong force is stronger than the
                  electrical one. So there is no surprise that with the
                  assumption of the strong force the results are
                  correct. I think this is a good argument. Isn't it?<br
                    class="">
                  <br class="">
                  Albrecht<br class="">
                  <br class="">
                  <br class="">
                  <br class="">
                  <div class="moz-cite-prefix">Am 26.01.2016 um 01:50
                    schrieb Richard Gauthier:<br class="">
                  </div>
                  <blockquote
                    cite="mid:7DEA6DFD-C1EB-4058-99AF-D71BF4807606@gmail.com"
                    type="cite" class="">
                    <meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html;
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                    Hello Albrecht,
                    <div class=""><br class="">
                      <div class="">   I know that you object to my
                        derivation, but I am proposing that momentum is
                        primary and inertia is secondary. You have got
                        it backwards. The inertial mass of an electron
                        is (in my approach) quantitatively due to the
                        circulating internal momentum of its charged (or
                        uncharged) photon. By extension, the inertial
                        mass of all particles with rest mass is likely
                        due to internally circulating momenta. It is
                        true as you say that in a world without inertia
                        (or inertial mass) there would be no momentum,
                        but in a world without momentum there would also
                        be no inertia (or inertial mass). Inertia (or
                        inertial mass) is due to momentum (in my
                        approach). Momentum is not due to inertia. </div>
                      <div class=""><br class="">
                      </div>
                      <div class="">  I know that your electron
                        hypothesis attempts to derive the inertia of an
                        electron differently. But I think you will have
                        to admit that my derivation of the electron’s
                        inertial mass from the electron’s proposed
                        circulating internal photon momentum is very
                        much simpler than yours (which is by the way
                        based on highly questionable premises since
                        there is no accepted experimental evidence for
                        the strong nuclear force influencing electric
                        charges, zero experimental evidence for two
                        sub-particles in an electron, and your electron
                        model’s apparently negative rest mass due to its
                        negative internal potential energy), and thus by
                        Occam's Razor, much to be preferred. Plus, your
                        model doesn’t derive the inertial mass of a
                        photon as hf/c^2 or the inertial mass of a
                        relativistically moving electron as gamma m,
                        does it?</div>
                      <div class=""><br class="">
                      </div>
                      <div class="">     Richard</div>
                      <div class=""><br class="">
                        <div class="">
                          <blockquote type="cite" class="">
                            <div class="">On Jan 25, 2016, at 8:33 AM,
                              Albrecht Giese <<a
                                class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated"
                                href="mailto:genmail@a-giese.de"><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:genmail@a-giese.de">genmail@a-giese.de</a></a>>

                              wrote:</div>
                            <br class="Apple-interchange-newline">
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                                class=""> Dear Richard,<br class="">
                                <br class="">
                                you know that I object to your
                                derivation of inertial mass. You deduce
                                it from momentum. That is mathematically
                                possible by using the known relations.
                                But it is not logical in so far as
                                momentum depends on inertia. In a world
                                without inertia there would be no
                                momentum.<br class="">
                                <br class="">
                                So we have to explain first the
                                mechanism of inertia itself, then we can
                                derive the momentum and the inertial
                                mass.<br class="">
                                <br class="">
                                Best<br class="">
                                Albrecht<br class="">
                                <br class="">
                                <br class="">
                                <div class="moz-cite-prefix">Am
                                  24.01.2016 um 20:42 schrieb Richard
                                  Gauthier:<br class="">
                                </div>
                                <blockquote
                                  cite="mid:0907288F-7DBF-486D-B8E1-30751A151F73@gmail.com"
                                  type="cite" class="">
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                                  <div class="">Hello Vladimir and
                                    Chandra and all,</div>
                                  <div class=""><br class="">
                                  </div>
                                  <div class="">  Yes, I definitely
                                    support the idea of the ether as
                                    material space, and that all
                                    physical particles are derived from
                                    this ether. This ether can also be
                                    called a plenum or Cosmic Tension
                                    Field.</div>
                                  <div class=""><br class="">
                                  </div>
                                  <div class="">   I don’t however think
                                    that it is necessary to explain the
                                    inertial mass of particles in
                                    relation to a "coefficient of
                                    inertia” or "the amount of momentum
                                    the ether resists." I have shown (<a
                                      class="moz-txt-link-freetext"
href="https://www.academia.edu/19652036/The_Origin_of_the_Electrons_Inertia"><a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://www.academia.edu/19652036/The_Origin_of_the_Electrons_Inertia">https://www.academia.edu/19652036/The_Origin_of_the_Electrons_Inertia</a></a> )






                                    by a very simple derivation that the
                                    inertial mass m of an electron may
                                    be derived from the momentum of the
                                    circling photon in a
                                    circulating-photon model of the
                                    electron, whose circling photon has
                                    momentum mc where m = Eo/c^2 =
                                    hf/c^2 ,  where Eo is the rest
                                    energy 0.511 MeV of the electron and
                                    f is the frequency of the
                                    circulating photon in the resting
                                    electron. Secondly, in a similar way
                                    I derived a linearly moving photon's
                                    inertial mass to be M-inertial =
                                    hf/c^2 , where f is the photon’s
                                    frequency, even though a photon has
                                    zero rest mass. Thirdly, I derived
                                    the inertial mass of a relativistic
                                    electron, whose momentum is p=gamma
                                    mv, to be  M-inertial = gamma m ,
                                    even though the moving electron's
                                    rest mass is m.  </div>
                                  <div class=""><br class="">
                                  </div>
                                  <div class="">   I present these
                                     derivations below, taken from the <a
                                      moz-do-not-send="true"
                                      href="http://academia.edu/"
                                      class="">academia.edu</a> session
                                    on my electron inertia article at <a
                                      class="moz-txt-link-freetext"
                                      href="https://www.academia.edu/s/a26afd55e0?source=link"><a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://www.academia.edu/s/a26afd55e0?source=link">https://www.academia.edu/s/a26afd55e0?source=link</a></a> :</div>
                                  <div class=""><br class="">
                                  </div>
                                  <div class=""><span class="js-non-expanded-comment" style="box-sizing: border-box; color: rgb(73, 72, 72); font-family: Georgia, serif; font-size: 14px; line-height: 22px; white-space: pre-wrap;">"One reason people don’t think that a photon has any inertial mass (because it has no rest mass) is that how do you get a photon to change its momentum (i.e. accelerate) in order to measure its inertial mass. It can’t go faster or slower than c in a vacuum, so it can’t accelerate in a linear direction, and in normal physics a photon doesn’t follow a curved path (except with gravity), which would make it possible to measure its centripetal acceleration c^2/R . But as I showed in my short el</span><span class="js-expanded-comment" style="box-sizing: border-box; color: rgb(73, 72, 72); font-family: Georgia, serif; font-size: 14px; line-height: 22px; white-space: pre-wrap;">ectron inertia  article at <a moz-do-not-send="true" href="https://www.academia.edu/1%0A
%0A%2%0A09652036%0A/The_Origin_of_the_Elect%0Arons_Inertia" class="">https://www.academia.edu/19652036/The_Origin_of_the_Electrons_Inertia</a> , the electron model in a resting electron has the photon going in a circle, with momentum mc and speed c, and the electron's inertial mass is then calculated to be M-inertial =(dp/dt)/Acentrifugal =wmc/(c^2/r)= m which is the inertial mass of the electron. But this calculation of the circling charged photon's inertial mass is independent of the radius of the charged photon’s circular orbit. Let that circular radius go towards infinity and you get a photon traveling in essentially a straight line, still having its inertial mass M =hf/c^2 (where the photon frequency f decreases as the radius of the circle increases) . So according to this logic,  a linearly moving photon DOES have inertial mass M-inertial =hf/c^2 even though a photon has zero rest mass. And when a relativistic electron with momentum p=gamma mv travels in a circle with speed v, 
the
 iner
tia
 l mass c
alculation
 above gives M
-in
ertial = gamma m for a circling relativistic electron, and not just m the electron’s rest mass . Extending the radius here towards infinity also gives a linearly moving electron an inertial mass M = gamma m and not just the electron's rest mass m."</span></div>
                                  <div class=""><span class="js-expanded-comment" style="box-sizing: border-box; color: rgb(73, 72, 72); font-family: Georgia, serif; font-size: 14px; line-height: 22px; white-space: pre-wrap;">
</span></div>
                                  <div class=""><span class="js-expanded-comment" style="box-sizing: border-box; color: rgb(73, 72, 72); font-family: Georgia, serif; font-size: 14px; line-height: 22px; white-space: pre-wrap;"><span style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; line-height: normal; white-space: normal;" class="">      As far as I know these are all original derivations of the inertial mass of a resting electron, a photon and a relativistic electron based on a circulating photon model of an electron. I would be pleased to be shown otherwise.</span></span></div>
                                  <div class=""><span class="js-expanded-comment" style="box-sizing: border-box; color: rgb(73, 72, 72); font-family: Georgia, serif; font-size: 14px; line-height: 22px; white-space: pre-wrap;"><span style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; line-height: normal; white-space: normal;" class="">
</span></span></div>
                                  <div class=""><span class="js-expanded-comment" style="box-sizing: border-box; color: rgb(73, 72, 72); font-family: Georgia, serif; font-size: 14px; line-height: 22px; white-space: pre-wrap;"><span style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; line-height: normal; white-space: normal;" class="">  Richard</span></span></div>
                                  <div class=""><span class="js-expanded-comment" style="box-sizing: border-box; color: rgb(73, 72, 72); font-family: Georgia, serif; font-size: 14px; line-height: 22px; white-space: pre-wrap;">    </span></div>
                                  <br class="">
                                  <div class="">
                                    <blockquote type="cite" class="">
                                      <div class="">On Jan 24, 2016, at
                                        6:42 AM, Roychoudhuri, Chandra
                                        <<a moz-do-not-send="true"
                                          class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated"
href="mailto:chandra.roychoudhuri@uconn.edu">chandra.roychoudhuri@uconn.edu</a>>






                                        wrote:</div>
                                      <br
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                                              class="">Yes, Vlad, that
                                              is also my viewpoint.<o:p
                                                class=""></o:p></span></div>
                                          <div style="margin: 0in 0in
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                                              style="font-size: 11pt;"
                                              class="">I do not remember
                                              whether I have attached
                                              this paper while
                                              communicating with you
                                              earlier. I call the
                                              “plenum” Cosmic Tension
                                              Field (CTF), to be
                                              descriptive in its
                                              essential properties.<o:p
                                                class=""></o:p></span></div>
                                          <div style="margin: 0in 0in
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                                              style="font-size: 11pt;"
                                              class="">Chandra.<o:p
                                                class=""></o:p></span></div>
                                          <div style="margin: 0in 0in
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                                            Roman', serif;" class=""><a
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                                              name="_MailEndCompose"
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                                                style="font-size: 11pt;
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                                                class=""> </span></a></div>
                                          <div class="">
                                            <div style="border-style:
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                                              <div style="margin: 0in
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                                                  class=""><span
                                                    style="font-size:
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                                                    class="">From:</span></b><span
                                                  style="font-size:
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                                                  class=""><span
                                                    class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>General

                                                  [<a
                                                    class="moz-txt-link-freetext"
href="mailto:general-bounces+chandra.roychoudhuri=uconn.edu@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org"><a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="mailto:general-bounces+chandra.roychoudhuri=uconn.edu@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org">mailto:general-bounces+chandra.roychoudhuri=uconn.edu@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org</a></a>]<span
class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><b class="">On Behalf Of<span
                                                      class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></b>Vladimir






                                                  Tamari<br class="">
                                                  <b class="">Sent:</b><span
class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Saturday, January 23, 2016 7:00 PM<br
                                                    class="">
                                                  <b class="">To:</b><span
class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Nature of Light and Particles -
                                                  General Discussion<br
                                                    class="">
                                                  <b class="">Subject:</b><span
class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Re: [General] (no subject)<o:p
                                                    class=""></o:p></span></div>
                                            </div>
                                          </div>
                                          <div style="margin: 0in 0in
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                                              class=""> </o:p></div>
                                          <div class="">
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                                              0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt;
                                              font-family: 'Times New
                                              Roman', serif;" class="">Hi


                                              Richard <o:p class=""></o:p></div>
                                          </div>
                                          <div class="">
                                            <div style="margin: 0in 0in
                                              0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt;
                                              font-family: 'Times New
                                              Roman', serif;" class="">I
                                              barge into your discussion
                                              without knowing your views
                                              on a "plenum field" but if
                                              it is an ether I
                                              definitely think there is
                                              one. A "coefficent of
                                              inertia" might be defined
                                              as the amount of momentum
                                              the ether resists. In a
                                              charged or gravitational
                                              field this coefficent
                                              would increase...I think
                                              of this in terms of my
                                              Beautiful Universe ether
                                              of dielectric nodes,
                                              except this may give the
                                              wrong idea it is something
                                              matter wades in.. not so.
                                              Matter and ether are made
                                              if the selfsame nodes of
                                              energy!<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
                                          </div>
                                          <div class="">
                                            <div style="margin: 0in 0in
                                              0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt;
                                              font-family: 'Times New
                                              Roman', serif;" class="">Cheers<o:p
                                                class=""></o:p></div>
                                          </div>
                                          <div class="">
                                            <div style="margin: 0in 0in
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                                              font-family: 'Times New
                                              Roman', serif;" class="">Vladimir<br
                                                class="">
                                              <br class="">
                                              _____________________<o:p
                                                class=""></o:p></div>
                                            <div class="">
                                              <div style="margin: 0in
                                                0in 0.0001pt; font-size:
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                                                'Times New Roman',
                                                serif;" class=""><a
                                                  moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://vladimirtamari.com/" style="color: purple; text-decoration:
                                                  underline;" class="">vladimirtamari.com</a><o:p
                                                  class=""></o:p></div>
                                            </div>
                                          </div>
                                          <div class="">
                                            <p class="MsoNormal"
                                              style="margin: 0in 0in
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                                              font-family: 'Times New
                                              Roman', serif;"><br
                                                class="">
                                              On Jan 21, 2016, at 7:41
                                              AM, Richard Gauthier <<a
class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:richgauthier@gmail.com"><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:richgauthier@gmail.com">richgauthier@gmail.com</a></a>>

                                              wrote:<o:p class=""></o:p></p>
                                          </div>
                                          <blockquote style="margin-top:
                                            5pt; margin-bottom: 5pt;"
                                            class="">
                                            <div class="">
                                              <div class="">
                                                <div style="margin: 0in
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                                                  class="">Hi Hodge,<o:p
                                                    class=""></o:p></div>
                                              </div>
                                              <div class="">
                                                <div style="margin: 0in
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                                                  class="">    I don’t
                                                  remember asking that.
                                                  But if I did, I’m glad
                                                  the question was
                                                  helpful.<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
                                              </div>
                                              <div class="">
                                                <div style="margin: 0in
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                                                  class="">   I’m
                                                  thinking about inertia
                                                  these days. Do you or
                                                  others have any
                                                  insights about its
                                                  nature?<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
                                              </div>
                                              <div class="">
                                                <div style="margin: 0in
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                                                  font-family: 'Times
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                                                  class="">       
                                                   Richard<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
                                              </div>
                                              <div style="margin: 0in
                                                0in 0.0001pt; font-size:
                                                12pt; font-family:
                                                'Times New Roman',
                                                serif;" class=""><o:p
                                                  class=""> </o:p></div>
                                              <div class="">
                                                <blockquote
                                                  style="margin-top:
                                                  5pt; margin-bottom:
                                                  5pt;" class="">
                                                  <div class="">
                                                    <div style="margin:
                                                      0in 0in 0.0001pt;
                                                      font-size: 12pt;
                                                      font-family:
                                                      'Times New Roman',
                                                      serif;" class="">On

                                                      Jan 20, 2016, at
                                                      1:43 PM, Hodge
                                                      John <<a
                                                        class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated"
href="mailto:jchodge@frontier.com"><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:jchodge@frontier.com">jchodge@frontier.com</a></a>> wrote:<o:p
                                                        class=""></o:p></div>
                                                  </div>
                                                  <div style="margin:
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                                                    class=""><o:p
                                                      class=""> </o:p></div>
                                                  <div class="">
                                                    <div class="">
                                                      <div class="">
                                                        <div
                                                          id="yui_3_16_0_1_1453325918779_2533"
                                                          class="">
                                                          <div
                                                          style="margin:
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                                                          0.0001pt;
                                                          font-size:
                                                          12pt;
                                                          font-family:
                                                          'Times New
                                                          Roman', serif;
                                                          background-color:



                                                          white;"
                                                          class=""><span
                                                          style="font-family:




                                                          Helvetica,
                                                          sans-serif;"
                                                          class="">Richard




                                                          Gauthier:<o:p
                                                          class=""></o:p></span></div>
                                                        </div>
                                                        <div
                                                          id="yui_3_16_0_1_1453325918779_2535"
                                                          class="">
                                                          <div
                                                          style="margin:
                                                          0in 0in
                                                          0.0001pt;
                                                          font-size:
                                                          12pt;
                                                          font-family:
                                                          'Times New
                                                          Roman', serif;
                                                          background-color:



                                                          white;"
                                                          class=""><span
                                                          style="font-family:




                                                          Helvetica,
                                                          sans-serif;"
                                                          class="">You
                                                          asked if the
                                                          galaxy
                                                          redshift,
                                                          Pioneer
                                                          anomaly,
                                                          Pound--Rebka
                                                          experiment
                                                          model had a
                                                          velocity term.
                                                          I looked at
                                                          redshift data
                                                          for 1 galaxy
                                                          and found no
                                                          indication of
                                                          a velocity
                                                          term.<o:p
                                                          class=""></o:p></span></div>
                                                        </div>
                                                        <div
                                                          id="yui_3_16_0_1_1453325918779_2537"
                                                          class="">
                                                          <div
                                                          style="margin:
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                                                          0.0001pt;
                                                          font-size:
                                                          12pt;
                                                          font-family:
                                                          'Times New
                                                          Roman', serif;
                                                          background-color:



                                                          white;"
                                                          class=""><span
                                                          style="font-family:




                                                          Helvetica,
                                                          sans-serif;"
                                                          class=""> <o:p
                                                          class=""></o:p></span></div>
                                                        </div>
                                                        <div
                                                          id="yui_3_16_0_1_1453325918779_2539"
                                                          class="">
                                                          <div
                                                          style="margin:
                                                          0in 0in
                                                          0.0001pt;
                                                          font-size:
                                                          12pt;
                                                          font-family:
                                                          'Times New
                                                          Roman', serif;
                                                          background-color:



                                                          white;"
                                                          class=""><span
                                                          style="font-family:




                                                          Helvetica,
                                                          sans-serif;"
                                                          class="">I had
                                                          not noticed
                                                          this in the
                                                          equations.
                                                          Your
                                                          suggestion
                                                          that the
                                                          plenum field
                                                          can look like
                                                          the Higgs
                                                          field seems
                                                          valid. That
                                                          is, the
                                                          acceleration
                                                          of the plenum
                                                          field looks
                                                          like it adds
                                                          energy (mass)
                                                          is a Higgs
                                                          Field
                                                          characteristic.
                                                          Thus, the
                                                          plenum is
                                                          closer to the
                                                          idea of a
                                                          quantum field
                                                          and Higgs
                                                          field (weak
                                                          force).<o:p
                                                          class=""></o:p></span></div>
                                                        </div>
                                                        <div
                                                          id="yui_3_16_0_1_1453325918779_2541"
                                                          class="">
                                                          <div
                                                          style="margin:
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                                                          0.0001pt;
                                                          font-size:
                                                          12pt;
                                                          font-family:
                                                          'Times New
                                                          Roman', serif;
                                                          background-color:



                                                          white;"
                                                          class=""><span
                                                          style="font-family:




                                                          Helvetica,
                                                          sans-serif;"
                                                          class=""> <o:p
                                                          class=""></o:p></span></div>
                                                        </div>
                                                        <div
                                                          id="yui_3_16_0_1_1453325918779_2543"
                                                          class="">
                                                          <div
                                                          style="margin:
                                                          0in 0in
                                                          0.0001pt;
                                                          font-size:
                                                          12pt;
                                                          font-family:
                                                          'Times New
                                                          Roman', serif;
                                                          background-color:



                                                          white;"
                                                          class=""><span
                                                          style="font-family:




                                                          Helvetica,
                                                          sans-serif;"
                                                          class="">Thanks



                                                          for the
                                                          insight.<o:p
                                                          class=""></o:p></span></div>
                                                        </div>
                                                        <div
                                                          id="yui_3_16_0_1_1453325918779_2545"
                                                          class="">
                                                          <div
                                                          style="margin:
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                                                          Roman', serif;
                                                          background-color:



                                                          white;"
                                                          class=""><span
                                                          style="font-family:




                                                          Helvetica,
                                                          sans-serif;"
                                                          class=""> <o:p
                                                          class=""></o:p></span></div>
                                                        </div>
                                                        <div
                                                          id="yui_3_16_0_1_1453325918779_2579"
                                                          class="">
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                                                          class="">Hodge<span
                                                          style="font-family:




                                                          Helvetica,
                                                          sans-serif;"
                                                          class=""><o:p
                                                          class=""></o:p></span></div>
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