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    Al:<br>
    Glad to hear you say "wave function collpase in any version is a bag
    of crap!"<br>
    <br>
    However to prove it we would need to build or design a simultaneous
    monte-carlo simulation analog probability computer that can
    simultaneously hold multiple scenarios as reversible branches which
    explore various possibilities and then physically pull back from all
    but the chosen outcome.<br>
    I think my brain and perhaps a quantum computer could work that way.<br>
    <br>
    Its a project I've been intending to follow-up on but perhaps it has
    already been done. References welcome.<br>
    <br>
    thanks<br>
    wolf<br>
    <br>
    Also if atoms could be shown to act like resonance absorbing
    antennas then arrays of them would respond to wide area EM waves but
    only one would succeed in pulling in a quantum of energy. Its a
    version of Loading theory ( see Eric Reiters paper in te SPIE vol)
    that could provide a physical mechanism for an EM wave collapse. <br>
    <br>
    wb<br>
    <br>
    Dr. Wolfgang Baer
    Research Director
    Nascent Systems Inc.
    tel/fax 831-659-3120/0432
    E-mail <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:wolf@NascentInc.com">wolf@NascentInc.com</a>
    <div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 2/8/2016 11:48 AM,
      <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:af.kracklauer@web.de">af.kracklauer@web.de</a> wrote:<br>
    </div>
    <blockquote
cite="mid:trinity-93c16721-59f4-425e-a0d4-cfbaa09c894a-1454960907215@3capp-webde-bs08"
      type="cite">
      <div style="font-family: Verdana;font-size: 12.0px;">
        <div>
          <div>Hi Hodge et al.</div>
          <div> </div>
          <div>Well that's one way (and much more efficient one) of
            looking at it.  </div>
          <div> </div>
          <div>However, I think your redition of wave function collapse
            is not the fully orthodox version which supposes that the
            collapse occures by agency of a sentient being.  </div>
          <div> </div>
          <div>And, from Albrecht's point of view, the calculation of
            the band pattern done aforehand in accord with what he wants
            to call the conventional understanding should come out
            different than the actual result.  For him, the issue is
            inconsistence of the theory rather than mysterious lab
            results.  I gather, he would agree that the pattern does not
            change for the moving observer and conclude that, that fact
            is symptomatic of inconsistency in the conventional
            understanding of deB waves.</div>
          <div> </div>
          <div>FYI:  I hold that wave function collpase in any version
            is a bag of crap!  My arguments are fully given on
            <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.nonloco-physics.0catch.com">www.nonloco-physics.0catch.com</a>.</div>
          <div> </div>
          <div>Best, Al</div>
          <div> 
            <div name="quote" style="margin:10px 5px 5px 10px; padding:
              10px 0 10px 10px; border-left:2px solid #C3D9E5;
              word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space;
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              <div style="margin:0 0 10px 0;"><b>Gesendet:</b> Montag,
                08. Februar 2016 um 19:03 Uhr<br>
                <b>Von:</b> "Hodge John" <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:jchodge@frontier.com"><jchodge@frontier.com></a><br>
                <b>An:</b> "Nature of Light and Particles - General
                Discussion"
                <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org"><general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org></a><br>
                <b>Betreff:</b> Re: [General] De Broglie Wave</div>
              <div name="quoted-content">
                <div style="color: rgb(0,0,0);background-color:
                  rgb(255,255,255);font-family: HelveticaNeue ,
                  Helvetica Neue , Helvetica , Arial , Lucida Grande ,
                  sans-serif;font-size: 16.0px;">The screen is the
                  "observer" that causes the collapse of the
                  wavefunctin. A moving human will see bands. Will the
                  bands be in a different position if the human is
                  moving?
                  <div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1454954441262_2403"> </div>
                  <div class="qtdSeparateBR"><br>
                     </div>
                  <div class="yahoo_quoted" style="display: block;">
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                        <div><font size="2" face="Arial">On Monday,
                            February 8, 2016 11:20 AM,
                            <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:af.kracklauer@web.de">"af.kracklauer@web.de"</a>
                            <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:af.kracklauer@web.de"><af.kracklauer@web.de></a> wrote:</font></div>
                         
                        <div class="y_msg_container">
                          <div id="yiv9159182760">
                            <div>
                              <div style="font-family:
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                                <div>
                                  <div>Hi Albrecht:</div>
                                  <div> </div>
                                  <div>Your challenge is easy!  In fact
                                    my last responce covered it.   The
                                    RELEVANT velocity is the relative
                                    velocity between the particle and
                                    the slit; not that between the
                                    observer-particle or observer-slit.
                                      An observer will see all kinds of
                                    distortions of the events, starting
                                    with simple persepctive due to being
                                    at some distance from the slit and
                                    its registration screen.  In additon
                                    this observer will see those deB
                                    waves affecting the particle (NOT
                                    from the particle, nor from the
                                    slit, but from the universal
                                    background there before either the
                                    particle or slit came into being)
                                     as perspectively-relativistically
                                    distorted (twin-clock type
                                    distortion).  BUT, the observer will
                                    still see the same over-all
                                    background because the totality of
                                    background signals (not just those
                                    to which this particle is tuned),
                                    i.e., its spectral energy density,
                                    is itself Lorentz invariant.  That
                                    is, the observer's  motion does not
                                     enable it to empirically
                                    distinguish between the background
                                    in the various frames, nor does the
                                    background engender friction forces.</div>
                                  <div> </div>
                                  <div>You have got to get your head
                                    around the idea that deB waves are
                                    independant of particles whatever
                                    their frame.</div>
                                  <div> </div>
                                  <div>Schrördinger did toy with some
                                    aspects that deBroglie used, but
                                    never did succeed in rationalizing
                                    his eq. in those or any other terms.
                                     For him, when died, wave functions
                                    were ontologically completely
                                    mysterious.  From SED proponents,
                                    I'm told, my thoughts in #7 on <a
                                      moz-do-not-send="true"
                                      href="http://www.nonloco-physics.0catch.com"
                                      target="_blank"><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.nonloco-physics.0catch.com">www.nonloco-physics.0catch.com</a></a>,
                                    are unique in formulating S's eq. in
                                    terms of deB concepts.  Try it,
                                    maybe you'll like it.  </div>
                                  <div> </div>
                                  <div>There are other SED-type stories
                                    too, but as they are based on
                                    diffusion (parabolic, not
                                    hyperbolic) precesses, I find them
                                    self contradictory.</div>
                                  <div> </div>
                                  <div>ciao, Al</div>
                                  <div> 
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                                      <div style="margin: 0 0 10.0px 0;"><b>Gesendet:</b> Montag,
                                        08. Februar 2016 um 141 Uhr<br
                                          clear="none">
                                        <b>Von:</b> "Albrecht Giese"
                                        <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:genmail@a-giese.de"><genmail@a-giese.de></a><br
                                          clear="none">
                                        <b>An:</b> <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:af.kracklauer@web.de">af.kracklauer@web.de</a><br
                                          clear="none">
                                        <b>Cc:</b> <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org">general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org</a>,
                                        "Richard Gauthier"
                                        <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:richgauthier@gmail.com"><richgauthier@gmail.com></a><br
                                          clear="none">
                                        <b>Betreff:</b> Re: [General] De
                                        Broglie Wave</div>
                                      <div
                                        class="yiv9159182760yqt8242382347"
                                        id="yiv9159182760yqt88158">
                                        <div>
                                          <div style="background-color:
                                            rgb(255,255,255);">Hi Al,<br
                                              clear="none">
                                            <br clear="none">
                                            if you follow de Broglie,
                                            you should have an
                                            explanation for the
                                            following experiment (here
                                            again):<br clear="none">
                                            <br clear="none">
                                            Electrons move at 0.1 c
                                            towards the double slit.
                                            Behind the double slit there
                                            is an interference pattern
                                            generated, which in the
                                            frame of the slit follows
                                            the rule of de Broglie. But
                                            now there is an observer
                                            also moving at 0.1 c
                                            parallel to the beam of
                                            electrons. In his frame the
                                            electrons have momentum=0
                                            and so wavelength=infinite.
                                            That means: No interference
                                            pattern. But there is in
                                            fact a pattern which does
                                            not disappear just because
                                            there is another observer.
                                            And the moving observer will
                                            see the pattern. - This is a
                                            falsification of de
                                            Broglie's rule. What else?<br
                                              clear="none">
                                            <br clear="none">
                                            The understanding that the
                                            de Broglie wave is a
                                            property of the particle
                                            (even though depending on
                                            their speed, but not on an
                                            interaction) was not my idea
                                            but the one of Schrödinger
                                            and Dirac and many others.
                                            Also by de Broglie himself.<br
                                              clear="none">
                                            <br clear="none">
                                            Ciao Albrecht<br
                                              clear="none">
                                            <br clear="none">
                                             
                                            <div
                                              class="yiv9159182760moz-cite-prefix">Am
                                              08.02.2016 um 03:30
                                              schrieb <a
                                                moz-do-not-send="true"
                                                class="yiv9159182760moz-txt-link-abbreviated"
                                                href=""><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:af.kracklauer@web.de">af.kracklauer@web.de</a></a>:</div>
                                            <blockquote>
                                              <div style="font-family:
                                                Verdana;font-size:
                                                12.0px;">
                                                <div>
                                                  <div>Hi Albrecht:</div>
                                                  <div> </div>
                                                  <div>BUT, the laws of
                                                    Physics for "being"
                                                    in a frame are not
                                                    the laws for
                                                    interacting between
                                                    frames!  The deB.
                                                    wave is not a
                                                    feature of a
                                                    particle in its own
                                                    frame, but a feature
                                                    of the interaction
                                                    of such a particle
                                                    with at least one
                                                    other particle in
                                                    another frame.  When
                                                    the two frames are
                                                    moving with respect
                                                    to each other, then
                                                    the features of the
                                                    interaction cannot
                                                    be Lorentz
                                                    invariants.  When
                                                    one particle is
                                                    interacting with
                                                    another particle (or
                                                    ensemble---slit say)
                                                    the relevant physics
                                                    is determined by the
                                                    deB wave in that
                                                    sitation, whatever
                                                    it looks like to an
                                                    observer in a third
                                                    frame with yet
                                                    different relative
                                                    velocities.  It is a
                                                    perspective effect:
                                                    a tree is the same
                                                    ontological size in
                                                    fact no matter how
                                                    small it appears to
                                                    distant observers.
                                                     Observed diminished
                                                    size(s) cannot be
                                                    "invriant."
                                                     Appearances =/=
                                                    ,,so sein''.</div>
                                                  <div> </div>
                                                  <div>You have gotten
                                                    your head stuck on
                                                    the idea that deB.
                                                    waves are
                                                    characteristics
                                                    intrinsic to
                                                    particles in an of
                                                    themselves.
                                                     Recalibrate!  DeB
                                                    waves are
                                                    charactteristics of
                                                    the mutual
                                                    interaction of
                                                    particles.</div>
                                                  <div> </div>
                                                  <div>Best, Al</div>
                                                  <div> 
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                                                      <div
                                                        style="margin: 0
                                                        0 10.0px 0;"><b>Gesendet:</b> Sonntag,
                                                        07. Februar 2016
                                                        um 22:10 Uhr<br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                        <b>Von:</b> "Albrecht
                                                        Giese" <a
                                                          moz-do-not-send="true"
class="yiv9159182760moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href=""><a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:genmail@a-giese.de"><genmail@a-giese.de></a></a><br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                        <b>An:</b> <a
                                                          moz-do-not-send="true"
class="yiv9159182760moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href=""><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:af.kracklauer@web.de">af.kracklauer@web.de</a></a><br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                        <b>Cc:</b> <a
                                                          moz-do-not-send="true"
class="yiv9159182760moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href=""><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org">general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org</a></a>,
                                                        "Richard
                                                        Gauthier" <a
                                                          moz-do-not-send="true"
class="yiv9159182760moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href=""><a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:richgauthier@gmail.com"><richgauthier@gmail.com></a></a><br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                        <b>Betreff:</b> Re:
                                                        [General] De
                                                        Broglie Wave</div>
                                                      <div>
                                                        <div
                                                          style="background-color:
rgb(255,255,255);">Hi Al,<br clear="none">
                                                          <br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                          at one of your
                                                          points I
                                                          really
                                                          disagree. The
                                                          physical laws
                                                          have to be
                                                          fulfilled in
                                                          every frame.
                                                          That means
                                                          that all
                                                          physical
                                                          processes have
                                                          to obey the
                                                          same laws in
                                                          all frames. So
                                                          also the
                                                          process at the
                                                          double slit.
                                                          But the rule
                                                          given by de
                                                          Broglie looks
                                                          correct in
                                                          only one
                                                          frame, that is
                                                          the frame
                                                          where the
                                                          double slit is
                                                          at rest. For
                                                          an observer in
                                                          motion the
                                                          diffraction
                                                          pattern looks
                                                          very similar
                                                          as for the
                                                          observer at
                                                          rest, but for
                                                          the observer
                                                          in motion the
                                                          results
                                                          according to
                                                          de Broglie are
                                                          completely
                                                          different,
                                                          because the
                                                          momentum of
                                                          the particle
                                                          is different
                                                          in a wide
                                                          range in the
                                                          frame of a
                                                          moving
                                                          observer and
                                                          so is the
                                                          wavelength
                                                          assigned to
                                                          the particle.<br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                          <br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                          The specific
                                                          case: At
                                                          electron
                                                          scattering,
                                                          the observer
                                                          co-moving with
                                                          the electron
                                                          will see a
                                                          similar
                                                          pattern as the
                                                          observer at
                                                          rest, but de
                                                          Broglie says
                                                          that for this
                                                          observer there
                                                          does not exist
                                                          any pattern.
                                                          That is
                                                          strongly
                                                          incorrect.<br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                          <br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                          The
                                                          Schrödinger
                                                          equation and
                                                          also the Dirac
                                                          function
                                                          should have
                                                          correct
                                                          results in
                                                          different
                                                          frames, at
                                                          least at
                                                          non-relativistic
                                                          speeds. This
                                                          requirement is
                                                          clearly
                                                          violated
                                                          through their
                                                          use of de
                                                          Broglie's
                                                          rule.<br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                          <br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                          Grüße<br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                          Albrecht<br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                          <br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                          PS: Your
                                                          article refers
                                                          to "Stochastic
                                                          Electrodynamics".
                                                          That is in my
                                                          knowledge not
                                                          standard
                                                          physics and so
                                                          a new
                                                          assumption.<br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                          <br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                           
                                                          <div
                                                          class="yiv9159182760moz-cite-prefix">Am
                                                          07.02.2016 um
                                                          19:03 schrieb
                                                          <a
                                                          moz-do-not-send="true"
class="yiv9159182760moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href=""><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:af.kracklauer@web.de">af.kracklauer@web.de</a></a>:</div>
                                                          <blockquote>
                                                          <div
                                                          style="font-family:
                                                          Verdana;font-size:
                                                          12.0px;">
                                                          <div>
                                                          <div>Hi
                                                          Albrecht:</div>
                                                          <div> </div>
                                                          <div>In my
                                                          view the story
                                                          in my paper
                                                          has no new
                                                          assunptions,
                                                          rather new
                                                          words for old
                                                          assumptions.
                                                           As I, along
                                                          with most
                                                          others, see
                                                          it, there is
                                                          no conflict
                                                          with
                                                          experiment,
                                                          but a less
                                                          than fully
                                                          transparent
                                                          explantion for
                                                          experimental
                                                          observations
                                                          (particle beam
                                                          diffrction)
                                                          otherwise
                                                          unexplained.
                                                           At the time
                                                          of writing,
                                                          and nowadays
                                                          too (although
                                                          I'd to think
                                                          that my paper
                                                          rationalizes
                                                          DeB's story)
                                                          it was the
                                                          most widely
                                                          accepted story
                                                          for this
                                                          phenomna.  </div>
                                                          <div> </div>
                                                          <div>The only
                                                          entities that
                                                          logically need
                                                          to be Lorentz
                                                          invariant are
                                                          the particle.
                                                           I the deB
                                                          wave is not a
                                                          'Bestandteil'
                                                          of the
                                                          particle, but
                                                          of its
                                                          relations with
                                                          its
                                                          envionment,
                                                          then
                                                          invariance is
                                                          not defined
                                                          nor useful.</div>
                                                          <div> </div>
                                                          <div>M.f.G.
                                                           Al</div>
                                                          <div> 
                                                          <div
                                                          style="margin:
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                                                          10.0px 0
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                                                          <div
                                                          style="margin:
                                                          0 0 10.0px 0;"><b>Gesendet:</b> Sonntag,
                                                          07. Februar
                                                          2016 um 14:39
                                                          Uhr<br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                          <b>Von:</b> "Albrecht
                                                          Giese" <a
                                                          moz-do-not-send="true"
class="yiv9159182760moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href=""><a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:genmail@a-giese.de"><genmail@a-giese.de></a></a><br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                          <b>An:</b> <a
moz-do-not-send="true" class="yiv9159182760moz-txt-link-abbreviated"
                                                          href=""><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:af.kracklauer@web.de">af.kracklauer@web.de</a></a><br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                          <b>Cc:</b> <a
moz-do-not-send="true" class="yiv9159182760moz-txt-link-abbreviated"
                                                          href=""><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org">general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org</a></a>,
                                                          "Richard
                                                          Gauthier" <a
moz-do-not-send="true" class="yiv9159182760moz-txt-link-rfc2396E"
                                                          href=""><a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:richgauthier@gmail.com"><richgauthier@gmail.com></a></a><br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                          <b>Betreff:</b> Re:
                                                          [General] De
                                                          Broglie Wave</div>
                                                          <div>
                                                          <div
                                                          style="background-color:
rgb(255,255,255);">Hi Al,<br clear="none">
                                                          <br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                          thank you for
                                                          your
                                                          reference.
                                                          Your paper has
                                                          a lot of
                                                          intelligent
                                                          thoughts but
                                                          also a lot of
                                                          additional
                                                          assumptions.
                                                          With reference
                                                          to the de
                                                          Broglie wave,
                                                          I think, is
                                                          the situation
                                                          much simpler
                                                          on the level
                                                          of
                                                          conservative
                                                          knowledge. De
                                                          Broglie has
                                                          misunderstood
                                                          relativity
                                                          (particularly
                                                          dilation) and
                                                          so seen a
                                                          conflict which
                                                          does in fact
                                                          not exist. He
                                                          has solved the
                                                          conflict by
                                                          inventing an
                                                          additional
                                                          "fictitious"
                                                          wave which has
                                                          no other
                                                          foundation in
                                                          physics, and
                                                          also his
                                                          "theorem of
                                                          harmonic
                                                          phases" which
                                                          as well is an
                                                          invention
                                                          without need.
                                                          And his result
                                                          is in conflict
                                                          with the
                                                          experiment if
                                                          we ask for
                                                          Lorentz
                                                          invariance or
                                                          even for
                                                          Galilean
                                                          invariance. - 
                                                          If we follow
                                                          the basic idea
                                                          of de Broglie
                                                          by, however,
                                                          avoiding his
                                                          logical error
                                                          about
                                                          relativity, we
                                                          come easily to
                                                          a description
                                                          of matter
                                                          waves without
                                                          logical
                                                          conflicts.
                                                          This does not
                                                          need new
                                                          philosophy or
                                                          other effort
                                                          at this level.<br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                          <br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                          Best, Albrecht<br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                          <br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                           
                                                          <div
                                                          class="yiv9159182760moz-cite-prefix">Am
                                                          06.02.2016 um
                                                          03:15 schrieb
                                                          <a
                                                          moz-do-not-send="true"
class="yiv9159182760moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href=""><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:af.kracklauer@web.de">af.kracklauer@web.de</a></a>:</div>
                                                          <blockquote>
                                                          <div
                                                          style="font-family:
                                                          Verdana;font-size:
                                                          12.0px;">
                                                          <div>
                                                          <div>Hi
                                                          Albrecht:</div>
                                                          <div> </div>
                                                          <div>DeBroglie's
                                                          verbage is
                                                          indeed quite
                                                          rococo!
                                                           Nonetheless,
                                                          his
                                                          machinations,
                                                          although
                                                          verbalized, in
                                                          the true
                                                          tradtion of
                                                          quantum
                                                          mechanics,
                                                          mysteriously,
                                                          can be
                                                          reinterpreted
                                                          (i.e.,
                                                          alternate
                                                          verbage found
                                                          without
                                                          changing any
                                                          of the math)
                                                          so as to tell
                                                          a fully, if
                                                          (somewhat)
                                                          hetrodoxical,
                                                          story.  See
                                                          #11 on <a
                                                          moz-do-not-send="true"
class="yiv9159182760moz-txt-link-abbreviated"
                                                          href="http://www.nonloco-physics.0catch.com/"
target="_blank"><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.Nonloco-Physics.0catch.com">www.Nonloco-Physics.0catch.com</a></a>.</div>
                                                          <div> </div>
                                                          <div>cc:
                                                           Waves are
                                                          never a
                                                          characteristic
                                                          of a single,
                                                          point-like
                                                          entity, but
                                                          colletive
                                                          motion of a
                                                          medium.  IF
                                                          they exist at
                                                          all.  My view
                                                          is that
                                                          E&M waves
                                                          are a fiction
                                                          wrought by
                                                          Fourier
                                                          analysis.  The
                                                          only real
                                                          physical part
                                                          is an
                                                          "interaction",
                                                          which mnight
                                                          as well be
                                                          thought of an
                                                          absract string
                                                          between
                                                          charges.
                                                           Also,
                                                          neutrons have
                                                          electric
                                                          multipole
                                                          moments; i.e.,
                                                          they are
                                                          totally
                                                          neutral but
                                                          not
                                                          charge-free. </div>
                                                          <div> </div>
                                                          <div>Best,
                                                           Al </div>
                                                          <div> 
                                                          <div
                                                          style="margin:
                                                          10.0px 5.0px
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                                                          10.0px 0
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                                                          rgb(195,217,229);">
                                                          <div
                                                          style="margin:
                                                          0 0 10.0px 0;"><b>Gesendet:</b> Freitag,
                                                          05. Februar
                                                          2016 um 21:43
                                                          Uhr<br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                          <b>Von:</b> "Albrecht
                                                          Giese" <a
                                                          moz-do-not-send="true"
class="yiv9159182760moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href=""><a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:genmail@a-giese.de"><genmail@a-giese.de></a></a><br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                          <b>An:</b> <a
moz-do-not-send="true" class="yiv9159182760moz-txt-link-abbreviated"
                                                          href=""><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:af.kracklauer@web.de">af.kracklauer@web.de</a></a>,
                                                          <a
                                                          moz-do-not-send="true"
class="yiv9159182760moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href=""><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org">general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org</a></a><br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                          <b>Cc:</b> "Richard
                                                          Gauthier" <a
moz-do-not-send="true" class="yiv9159182760moz-txt-link-rfc2396E"
                                                          href=""><a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:richgauthier@gmail.com"><richgauthier@gmail.com></a></a><br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                          <b>Betreff:</b> Re:
                                                          [General] De
                                                          Broglie Wave</div>
                                                          <div>
                                                          <div
                                                          style="background-color:
rgb(255,255,255);">Hi Al,<br clear="none">
                                                          <br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                          true, in the
                                                          frame of the
                                                          particle the
                                                          dB wavelength
                                                          is infinite.
                                                          Because in its
                                                          own frame the
                                                          momentum of
                                                          the particle
                                                          is 0. The
                                                          particle
                                                          oscillates
                                                          with the
                                                          frequency of
                                                          the particle's
                                                          Zitterbewegung
                                                          (which
                                                          background
                                                          fields do you
                                                          have in mind?
                                                          De Brogie does
                                                          not mention
                                                          them). This
                                                          oscillation is
                                                          in no
                                                          contradiction
                                                          with this
                                                          wavelength as
                                                          the phase
                                                          speed is also
                                                          infinite. For
                                                          the
                                                          imagination,
                                                          the latter
                                                          means that all
                                                          points of that
                                                          wave oscillate
                                                          with the same
                                                          phase at any
                                                          point.<br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                          <br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                          Which 
                                                          background
                                                          waves do you
                                                          have in mind?
                                                          What is the
                                                          CNONOICAL
                                                          momentum? And
                                                          what about
                                                          E&M
                                                          interactions?
                                                          De Broglie has
                                                          not related
                                                          his wave to a
                                                          specific
                                                          field. An
                                                          E&M field
                                                          would anyway
                                                          have no effect
                                                          in the case of
                                                          neutron
                                                          scattering for
                                                          which the same
                                                          de Broglie
                                                          formalism is
                                                          used. And into
                                                          which frame do
                                                          you see the
                                                          wave
                                                          Lorentz-transformed?<br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                          <br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                          So, an
                                                          electron in
                                                          his frame has
                                                          an infinite
                                                          wavelength and
                                                          in his frame
                                                          has the double
                                                          slit moving
                                                          towards the
                                                          particle. How
                                                          can an
                                                          interference
                                                          at the slits
                                                          occur? No
                                                          interference
                                                          can happen
                                                          under these
                                                          conditions.
                                                          But, as I have
                                                          explained in
                                                          the paper, the
                                                          normal wave
                                                          which
                                                          accompanies
                                                          the electron
                                                          by normal
                                                          rules (i.e.
                                                          phase speed =
                                                          c) will have
                                                          an
                                                          interference
                                                          with its own
                                                          reflection,
                                                          which has then
                                                          a wavelength
                                                          which fits to
                                                          the
                                                          expectation of
                                                          de Broglie.
                                                          But that is a
                                                          very local
                                                          event (in a
                                                          range of
                                                          approx. 10^-12
                                                          m for the
                                                          electron) and
                                                          it is not at
                                                          all a property
                                                          of the
                                                          electron as de
                                                          Broglie has
                                                          thought.<br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                          <br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                          To say it
                                                          again: The de
                                                          Broglie
                                                          wavelength
                                                          cannot be a
                                                          steady
                                                          property of
                                                          the particle.
                                                          But
                                                          Schrödinger
                                                          and Dirac have
                                                          incorporated
                                                          it into their
                                                          QM equations
                                                          with this
                                                          understanding.<br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                          <br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                          If I should
                                                          have
                                                          misunderstood
                                                          you, please
                                                          show the
                                                          mathematical
                                                          calculations
                                                          which you
                                                          mean.<br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                          <br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                          Ciao, Albrecht<br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                          <br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                           
                                                          <div
                                                          class="yiv9159182760moz-cite-prefix">Am
                                                          05.02.2016 um
                                                          19:20 schrieb
                                                          <a
                                                          moz-do-not-send="true"
class="yiv9159182760moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href=""><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:af.kracklauer@web.de">af.kracklauer@web.de</a></a>:</div>
                                                          <blockquote>
                                                          <div
                                                          style="font-family:
                                                          Verdana;font-size:
                                                          12.0px;">
                                                          <div>
                                                          <div>Hi:
                                                          Albrecht:</div>
                                                          <div> </div>
                                                          <div>Your
                                                          arguments
                                                          don't resonate
                                                          with me.  The
                                                          deB' wave
                                                          length is
                                                          infinite in
                                                          the particles
                                                          frame: it is
                                                          the standing
                                                          wave formed by
                                                          the inpinging
                                                          background
                                                          waves having a
                                                          freq. = the
                                                          particle's
                                                          Zitterbewegung.
                                                           If these TWO
                                                          waves are each
                                                          Lorentz
                                                          x-formed to
                                                          another frame
                                                          and added
                                                          there, they
                                                          exhibit
                                                          exactly the
                                                          DeB'
                                                          modulation
                                                          wavelength
                                                          proportional
                                                          to the
                                                          particle's
                                                          momentum.  The
                                                          only
                                                          mysterious
                                                          feature then
                                                          is that the
                                                          proportionality
                                                          is to the
                                                          CNONICAL
                                                          momentum,
                                                          i.e.,
                                                          including the
                                                          vector
                                                          potential of
                                                          whatever
                                                          exterior
                                                          E&M
                                                          interactions
                                                          are in-coming.
                                                           Nevertheless,
                                                          everything
                                                          works our
                                                          without
                                                          contradiction.
                                                           A particle
                                                          oscillates in
                                                          place at its
                                                          Zitter freq.
                                                          while the
                                                          Zitter signals
                                                          are modulated
                                                          by the DeB'
                                                          wavelength as
                                                          they move
                                                          through slits,
                                                          say.</div>
                                                          <div> </div>
                                                          <div>ciao,  L</div>
                                                          <div> 
                                                          <div
                                                          style="margin:
                                                          10.0px 5.0px
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                                                          10.0px 0
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                                                          2.0px solid
                                                          rgb(195,217,229);">
                                                          <div
                                                          style="margin:
                                                          0 0 10.0px 0;"><b>Gesendet:</b> Freitag,
                                                          05. Februar
                                                          2016 um 12:28
                                                          Uhr<br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                          <b>Von:</b> "Albrecht
                                                          Giese" <a
                                                          moz-do-not-send="true"
class="yiv9159182760moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href=""><a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:genmail@a-giese.de"><genmail@a-giese.de></a></a><br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                          <b>An:</b> "Richard
                                                          Gauthier" <a
moz-do-not-send="true" class="yiv9159182760moz-txt-link-rfc2396E"
                                                          href=""><a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:richgauthier@gmail.com"><richgauthier@gmail.com></a></a>,
                                                          <a
                                                          moz-do-not-send="true"
class="yiv9159182760moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href=""><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org">general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org</a></a><br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                          <b>Betreff:</b> Re:
                                                          [General] De
                                                          Broglie Wave</div>
                                                          <div>Hi
                                                          Richard and
                                                          Al, hi All,<br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                          <br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                          recently we
                                                          had a
                                                          discussion
                                                          here about two
                                                          topics:<br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                          <br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                          1. The
                                                          functionality
                                                          of the de
                                                          Broglie wave,
                                                          particularly
                                                          its wavelength<br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                          if seen from a
                                                          different
                                                          inertial
                                                          system. Such
                                                          cases lead to
                                                          illogical<br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                          situations.<br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                          2. The problem
                                                          of the
                                                          apparent
                                                          asymmetry at
                                                          relativistic
                                                          dilation.<br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                          <br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                          I have
                                                          investigated
                                                          these cases
                                                          and found that
                                                          they are in
                                                          some way<br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                          connected.
                                                          Relativistic
                                                          dilation is
                                                          not as simple
                                                          as it is
                                                          normally<br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                          taken. It
                                                          looks
                                                          asymmetric if
                                                          it is
                                                          incorrectly
                                                          treated. An
                                                          asymmetry<br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                          would falsify
                                                          Special
                                                          Relativity.
                                                          But it is in
                                                          fact
                                                          symmetrical if<br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                          properly
                                                          handled and
                                                          understood.<br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                          <br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                          It is funny
                                                          that both
                                                          problems are
                                                          connected to
                                                          each other
                                                          through the<br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                          fact that de
                                                          Broglie
                                                          himself has
                                                          misinterpreted
                                                          dilation. From
                                                          this<br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                          incorrect
                                                          understanding
                                                          he did not
                                                          find another
                                                          way out than
                                                          to invent<br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                          his "theorem
                                                          of phase
                                                          harmony"; with
                                                          all logical
                                                          conflicts
                                                          resulting<br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                          from this
                                                          approach.<br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                          <br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                          If relativity
                                                          is properly
                                                          understood,
                                                          the problem
                                                          seen by de
                                                          Broglie<br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                          does not
                                                          exist.
                                                          Equations
                                                          regarding
                                                          matter waves
                                                          can be derived
                                                          which<br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                          work properly,
                                                          i.e. conform
                                                          to the
                                                          experiments
                                                          but avoid the
                                                          logical<br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                          conflicts.<br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                          <br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                          As announced,
                                                          I have
                                                          composed a
                                                          paper about
                                                          this. It can
                                                          be found at:<br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                          <br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                          <a
                                                          moz-do-not-send="true"
class="yiv9159182760moz-txt-link-freetext"
href="https://www.academia.edu/21564534/The_Conflict_with_the_De_Broglie_Wavelength"
target="_blank"><a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://www.academia.edu/21564534/The_Conflict_with_the_De_Broglie_Wavelength">https://www.academia.edu/21564534/The_Conflict_with_the_De_Broglie_Wavelength</a></a><br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                          .<br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                          <br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                          I thank
                                                          Richard
                                                          Gauthier for
                                                          the discussion
                                                          which we had
                                                          about this<br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                          topic. It
                                                          caused me to
                                                          investigate
                                                          the problem
                                                          and to find a
                                                          solution.<br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                          <br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                          Albrecht<br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                          <br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                          <br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                          <br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                          <br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                          <br
                                                          clear="none">
                                                          ---<br
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