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Albrecht;<br>
Sorry to mistake your feelings it sounded like you were getting
frustrated at not being understood.<br>
<br>
However I'm getting frustrated since I've read much of your work and
have asked questions which have not been answered. Perhaps they have
not been clear or gotten lost, so here they are again. <br>
Ref: Albrecht;<br>
Sorry to mistake your feelings it sounded like you were getting
frustrated at not being understood.<br>
<br>
However I'm getting frustrated since I've read much of your work and
have asked questions which perhaps have not been clear or gotten
lost, so here they are again ref: The Origin of Gravity Figure
3.1: Basic Particle Model<br>
It looks like you are presenting a new explanation of inertial mass
with a theory which has a large number of assumptions:<br>
a) a new set of orbiting particles that are made of What?<br>
b) a force between those particles you made up to fit your desired
result, where does this force come from?<br>
why is the minimum not a combination of two forces like
a coulomb attraction and centrifugal repulsion <br>
c) assume this force also propagates at light speed "c" and Why does
rapid rotation not change the interaction energy curve?<br>
I always have trouble understanding the stability of
particles rotating at or near the speed of light when the force
signals<br>
are also moving at this speed. <br>
d) a media or space of propagation between those particles that is
flat<br>
e) a force on one of the particles from an outside agent that does
not effect the other particle<br>
so you can calculate the reaction force. Would the outside force
not introduce asymmetries depending on the angle of incidence?<br>
<br>
My question is not that your calculations are wrong but given the
above hidden assumptions<br>
1) why would I not simply say inertial mass is an intrinsic property
of matter?<br>
2) What advantage or new phenomena are you predicting?<br>
3) It looks like you are throwing out Mach's Principle since the
existence of distant masses<br>
has no effect on your calculations since inertia is now
still intrinsic to your orbiting particles rather than a point mass<br>
<br>
That said I agree with most of your criticism of current
interpretations, the most interesting for me is the simplicity
introduced by the use of a variable speed of light and a refraction
model to explain light bending. <br>
<br>
<br>
Best,<br>
Wolf<br>
<pre class="moz-signature" cols="72">Dr. Wolfgang Baer
Research Director
Nascent Systems Inc.
tel/fax 831-659-3120/0432
E-mail <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:wolf@NascentInc.com">wolf@NascentInc.com</a></pre>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 2/10/2016 5:13 AM, Albrecht Giese
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote cite="mid:56BB3790.2040700@a-giese.de" type="cite">
<meta content="text/html; charset=windows-1252"
http-equiv="Content-Type">
Hi Wolf,<br>
<br>
why do you think that I am frustrated? Why should I? Since I found
17 years ago the mechanism of inertia, which functions so straight
and logical with precise results, I am continuously happy. And the
appreciation by interested physicists is great. Since 14 years my
site about mass in internationally #1 in the internet. Only
sometimes the mass site of Nobel Prize winner Frank Wilzcek is one
step higher. But that is good companionship.<br>
<br>
True that it is a problem with Main Stream. They do not object but
just do not care. They love the Higgs model even though it is
proven not to work. - It just need patience. I still have it.<br>
<br>
<meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html;
charset=windows-1252">
<big> </big>Yes, quantum numbers work fine, but they are
physically little or not founded. It is similar to the known Pauli
Principle. That also works, but nobody knows why. And the bad
thing is that nobody from Main Stream concerned about this
non-understanding. That is the biggest weakness in today's physics
in my view.<br>
<br>
Albrecht<br>
<br>
<br>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">Am 09.02.2016 um 20:35 schrieb
Wolfgang Baer:<br>
</div>
<blockquote cite="mid:56BA3F8C.7000106@nascentinc.com" type="cite">
<meta content="text/html; charset=windows-1252"
http-equiv="Content-Type">
I can feel your frustration, Albrecht, <br>
The oldies are probably all wrong, but it's important to
remember that right or wrong they give us the platform from
which to see farther.<br>
"standing on the shoulders of others", and right or wrong they
give us something tangible to argue about<br>
and what quantum numbers have done for us to organize chemistry
is amazing.<br>
<br>
wolf<br>
<br>
<pre class="moz-signature" cols="72">Dr. Wolfgang Baer
Research Director
Nascent Systems Inc.
tel/fax 831-659-3120/0432
E-mail <a moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:wolf@NascentInc.com">wolf@NascentInc.com</a></pre>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 2/9/2016 10:18 AM, Albrecht
Giese wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote cite="mid:56BA2D87.5090908@a-giese.de" type="cite">
<meta content="text/html; charset=windows-1252"
http-equiv="Content-Type">
Hi Al,<br>
<br>
the choice of de Broglie is not suboptimal, it is clearly
wrong. Badly wrong. The wave he has introduced does not exist,
and if it would exist its behaviour would cause a physical
behaviour which is in conflict with measurements (if those are
comprehensively done).<br>
<br>
I agree with you that the main object now is to move forward.
But we will not move successfully forward if we carry
millstones with us. De Broglie's wave is a millstone. I just
had a look into a new textbook about QM, which was highly
recommended by our university. It makes full use of de
Broglie's relation between momentum and wavelength, so this is
unfortunately not just history. <br>
<br>
But looking into the history: Bohr, Sommerfeld and others have
used the result of de Broglie to explain quantum numbers.
Particularly the quantisation of the angular momentum on
atomic shells is explained by "standing waves" where the
wavelength is the one defined by dB. This obviously hides the
true reason of this quantisation, but as anyone believes that
the Ansatz using de Broglie is right, nobody is looking for
the correct cause. - This is one of the reasons for our
sticking physics.<br>
<br>
Tschüss back<br>
Albrecht<br>
<br>
<br>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">Am 09.02.2016 um 14:57 schrieb <a
moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated"
href="mailto:af.kracklauer@web.de"><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:af.kracklauer@web.de">af.kracklauer@web.de</a></a>:<br>
</div>
<blockquote
cite="mid:trinity-72537819-ce78-41a7-b82e-b4d7545f4651-1455026275771@3capp-webde-bs59"
type="cite">
<div style="font-family: Verdana;font-size: 12.0px;">
<div>
<div>Hi Albrecht:</div>
<div> </div>
<div>As you fully know, the very same idea can be
expressed in various languages. This is true of
physics also. The very same structure can be attached
to variuos words and images. I do not defend
deBroglie's choice of words and images. I too find his
choice suboptimal and somewhat contrdictory. So what?
He was playing his hand at that time with the hand he
was delt at that time. Since then, other ideas have
been found in the deck, as it were. I find that,
without changing any of his math, one can tell a story
that is vastly less etherial and mysterious and,
depending on the reader's depth of analysis, less
self-contradictory. I think my story is the one
DeBrogle would have told if he had been inspired by
some facits of SED. And, some people have a greater
affinty and interest in abstract structures, in
particular when their mathematical redintion seems to
work, that for the stories told for their explication.
This is particularly true of all things QM. </div>
<div> </div>
<div>Anyway, the main object now (2016) is to move
forward, not critique historical personalitites. So,
I'm trying to contribute to this discussion by adding
what I know now, and what I have found to be useful.
We are "doing" physics, not history. Let's make new
errors, not just grind away on the old ones!</div>
<div> </div>
<div>BTW, to my info, both Dirac and Schrödinger would
agree that deBroglie proposed some not too cogent
arguments regarding the nature of QM-wave functions.
Still, the best there at that time. All the same, they
too went to their graves without having found a
satisfactory interpretation. SED throws some new
ingredients into the mix. </div>
<div> </div>
<div>Tschuss, Al </div>
<div>
<div name="quote" style="margin:10px 5px 5px 10px;
padding: 10px 0 10px 10px; border-left:2px solid
#C3D9E5; word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode:
space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space;">
<div style="margin:0 0 10px 0;"><b>Gesendet:</b> Dienstag,
09. Februar 2016 um 13:41 Uhr<br>
<b>Von:</b> "Albrecht Giese" <a
moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E"
href="mailto:genmail@a-giese.de"><a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:genmail@a-giese.de"><genmail@a-giese.de></a></a><br>
<b>An:</b> <a moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated"
href="mailto:af.kracklauer@web.de">af.kracklauer@web.de</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated"
href="mailto:general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org">general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org</a>,
"Richard Gauthier" <a moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E"
href="mailto:richgauthier@gmail.com"><richgauthier@gmail.com></a><br>
<b>Betreff:</b> Re: [General] De Broglie Wave</div>
<div name="quoted-content">
<div style="background-color: rgb(255,255,255);">Hi
Al,<br>
<br>
I have the impression that you have a solution
for particle scattering which is in some way
related to the idea of de Broglie. (I also have
of course a solution). But was this the goal of
our discussion and of my original contribution?
It was not! My objection was de Broglie's
original idea as stated in his thesis and as
taken over by Schrödinger and Dirac.<br>
<br>
You have a lot of elements in your argumentation
which I do not find in the thesis of de Broglie.
(There is e.g. nothing at dB about SED ore
background.)<br>
<br>
The essential point of our discussion is the
meaning of his wave - and his wavelength. I
think it is very obvious from his thesis (which
you clearly know) that his "fictitious wave"
accompanies a particle like the electron<i> all
of the time</i>. There is no interaction
mentioned except that there is an observer at
rest who measures the frequency of the particle.
But without influencing the particle.<br>
<br>
Now it is normal knowledge that a frequency and
as well a wavelength appears changed for an
observer who is in motion. This is caused by the
Doppler effect. But the Doppler effect will
never cause that a finite wavelength changes to
Infinite if an observer moves at some speed
unequal to c. But just that happens to the wave
invented by de Broglie. It follows the equation<br>
<br>
lambda = h/(m*v) where v is the speed
difference between the particle and the observer
(to say it this time this way). And this is in
conflict to any physics we know.<br>
<br>
Best, Albrecht<br>
<br>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">Am 08.02.2016 um
17:20 schrieb <a moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated"
href="af.kracklauer@web.de" target="_parent">af.kracklauer@web.de</a>:</div>
<blockquote>
<div style="font-family: Verdana;font-size:
12.0px;">
<div>
<div>Hi Albrecht:</div>
<div> </div>
<div>Your challenge is easy! In fact my
last responce covered it. The RELEVANT
velocity is the relative velocity
between the particle and the slit; not
that between the observer-particle or
observer-slit. An observer will see
all kinds of distortions of the events,
starting with simple persepctive due to
being at some distance from the slit and
its registration screen. In additon
this observer will see those deB waves
affecting the particle (NOT from the
particle, nor from the slit, but from
the universal background there before
either the particle or slit came into
being) as
perspectively-relativistically distorted
(twin-clock type distortion). BUT, the
observer will still see the same
over-all background because the totality
of background signals (not just those to
which this particle is tuned), i.e., its
spectral energy density, is itself
Lorentz invariant. That is, the
observer's motion does not enable it
to empirically distinguish between the
background in the various frames, nor
does the background engender friction
forces.</div>
<div> </div>
<div>You have got to get your head around
the idea that deB waves are independant
of particles whatever their frame.</div>
<div> </div>
<div>Schrördinger did toy with some
aspects that deBroglie used, but never
did succeed in rationalizing his eq. in
those or any other terms. For him, when
died, wave functions were ontologically
completely mysterious. From SED
proponents, I'm told, my thoughts in #7
on <a moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated"
href="http://www.nonloco-physics.0catch.com">www.nonloco-physics.0catch.com</a>,
are unique in formulating S's eq. in
terms of deB concepts. Try it, maybe
you'll like it. </div>
<div> </div>
<div>There are other SED-type stories too,
but as they are based on diffusion
(parabolic, not hyperbolic) precesses, I
find them self contradictory.</div>
<div> </div>
<div>ciao, Al</div>
<div>
<div style="margin: 10.0px 5.0px 5.0px
10.0px;padding: 10.0px 0 10.0px
10.0px;border-left: 2.0px solid
rgb(195,217,229);">
<div style="margin: 0 0 10.0px 0;"><b>Gesendet:</b> Montag,
08. Februar 2016 um 141 Uhr<br>
<b>Von:</b> "Albrecht Giese" <a
moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E"
href="mailto:genmail@a-giese.de"><a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:genmail@a-giese.de"><genmail@a-giese.de></a></a><br>
<b>An:</b> <a moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated"
href="af.kracklauer@web.de"
target="_parent">af.kracklauer@web.de</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated"
href="general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org"
target="_parent">general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org</a>,
"Richard Gauthier" <a
moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E"
href="mailto:richgauthier@gmail.com"><a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:richgauthier@gmail.com"><richgauthier@gmail.com></a></a><br>
<b>Betreff:</b> Re: [General] De
Broglie Wave</div>
<div>
<div style="background-color:
rgb(255,255,255);">Hi Al,<br>
<br>
if you follow de Broglie, you
should have an explanation for the
following experiment (here again):<br>
<br>
Electrons move at 0.1 c towards
the double slit. Behind the double
slit there is an interference
pattern generated, which in the
frame of the slit follows the rule
of de Broglie. But now there is an
observer also moving at 0.1 c
parallel to the beam of electrons.
In his frame the electrons have
momentum=0 and so
wavelength=infinite. That means:
No interference pattern. But there
is in fact a pattern which does
not disappear just because there
is another observer. And the
moving observer will see the
pattern. - This is a falsification
of de Broglie's rule. What else?<br>
<br>
The understanding that the de
Broglie wave is a property of the
particle (even though depending on
their speed, but not on an
interaction) was not my idea but
the one of Schrödinger and Dirac
and many others. Also by de
Broglie himself.<br>
<br>
Ciao Albrecht<br>
<br>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">Am
08.02.2016 um 03:30 schrieb <a
moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated"
href="mailto:af.kracklauer@web.de"><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:af.kracklauer@web.de">af.kracklauer@web.de</a></a>:</div>
<blockquote>
<div style="font-family:
Verdana;font-size: 12.0px;">
<div>
<div>Hi Albrecht:</div>
<div> </div>
<div>BUT, the laws of
Physics for "being" in a
frame are not the laws for
interacting between
frames! The deB. wave is
not a feature of a
particle in its own frame,
but a feature of the
interaction of such a
particle with at least one
other particle in another
frame. When the two
frames are moving with
respect to each other,
then the features of the
interaction cannot be
Lorentz invariants. When
one particle is
interacting with another
particle (or
ensemble---slit say) the
relevant physics is
determined by the deB wave
in that sitation, whatever
it looks like to an
observer in a third frame
with yet different
relative velocities. It
is a perspective effect: a
tree is the same
ontological size in fact
no matter how small it
appears to distant
observers. Observed
diminished size(s) cannot
be "invriant."
Appearances =/= ,,so
sein''.</div>
<div> </div>
<div>You have gotten your
head stuck on the idea
that deB. waves are
characteristics intrinsic
to particles in an of
themselves. Recalibrate!
DeB waves are
charactteristics of the
mutual interaction of
particles.</div>
<div> </div>
<div>Best, Al</div>
<div>
<div style="margin: 10.0px
5.0px 5.0px
10.0px;padding: 10.0px 0
10.0px
10.0px;border-left:
2.0px solid
rgb(195,217,229);">
<div style="margin: 0 0
10.0px 0;"><b>Gesendet:</b> Sonntag,
07. Februar 2016 um
22:10 Uhr<br>
<b>Von:</b> "Albrecht
Giese" <a
moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:genmail@a-giese.de"><a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:genmail@a-giese.de"><genmail@a-giese.de></a></a><br>
<b>An:</b> <a
moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:af.kracklauer@web.de"><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:af.kracklauer@web.de">af.kracklauer@web.de</a></a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a
moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated"
href="mailto:general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org"><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org">general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org</a></a>,
"Richard Gauthier" <a
moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E"
href="mailto:richgauthier@gmail.com"><a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:richgauthier@gmail.com"><richgauthier@gmail.com></a></a><br>
<b>Betreff:</b> Re:
[General] De Broglie
Wave</div>
<div>
<div
style="background-color:
rgb(255,255,255);">Hi
Al,<br>
<br>
at one of your
points I really
disagree. The
physical laws have
to be fulfilled in
every frame. That
means that all
physical processes
have to obey the
same laws in all
frames. So also the
process at the
double slit. But the
rule given by de
Broglie looks
correct in only one
frame, that is the
frame where the
double slit is at
rest. For an
observer in motion
the diffraction
pattern looks very
similar as for the
observer at rest,
but for the observer
in motion the
results according to
de Broglie are
completely
different, because
the momentum of the
particle is
different in a wide
range in the frame
of a moving observer
and so is the
wavelength assigned
to the particle.<br>
<br>
The specific case:
At electron
scattering, the
observer co-moving
with the electron
will see a similar
pattern as the
observer at rest,
but de Broglie says
that for this
observer there does
not exist any
pattern. That is
strongly incorrect.<br>
<br>
The Schrödinger
equation and also
the Dirac function
should have correct
results in different
frames, at least at
non-relativistic
speeds. This
requirement is
clearly violated
through their use of
de Broglie's rule.<br>
<br>
Grüße<br>
Albrecht<br>
<br>
PS: Your article
refers to
"Stochastic
Electrodynamics".
That is in my
knowledge not
standard physics and
so a new assumption.<br>
<br>
<div
class="moz-cite-prefix">Am
07.02.2016 um
19:03 schrieb <a
moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated"
href="mailto:af.kracklauer@web.de"><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:af.kracklauer@web.de">af.kracklauer@web.de</a></a>:</div>
<blockquote>
<div
style="font-family:
Verdana;font-size:
12.0px;">
<div>
<div>Hi
Albrecht:</div>
<div> </div>
<div>In my
view the story
in my paper
has no new
assunptions,
rather new
words for old
assumptions.
As I, along
with most
others, see
it, there is
no conflict
with
experiment,
but a less
than fully
transparent
explantion for
experimental
observations
(particle beam
diffrction)
otherwise
unexplained.
At the time
of writing,
and nowadays
too (although
I'd to think
that my paper
rationalizes
DeB's story)
it was the
most widely
accepted story
for this
phenomna. </div>
<div> </div>
<div>The only
entities that
logically need
to be Lorentz
invariant are
the particle.
I the deB
wave is not a
'Bestandteil'
of the
particle, but
of its
relations with
its
envionment,
then
invariance is
not defined
nor useful.</div>
<div> </div>
<div>M.f.G.
Al</div>
<div>
<div
style="margin:
10.0px 5.0px
5.0px
10.0px;padding:
10.0px 0
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2.0px solid
rgb(195,217,229);">
<div
style="margin:
0 0 10.0px 0;"><b>Gesendet:</b> Sonntag,
07. Februar
2016 um 14:39
Uhr<br>
<b>Von:</b> "Albrecht
Giese" <a
moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:genmail@a-giese.de"><a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:genmail@a-giese.de"><genmail@a-giese.de></a></a><br>
<b>An:</b> <a
moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated"
href="mailto:af.kracklauer@web.de"><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:af.kracklauer@web.de">af.kracklauer@web.de</a></a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a
moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated"
href="mailto:general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org"><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org">general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org</a></a>,
"Richard
Gauthier" <a
moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E"
href="mailto:richgauthier@gmail.com"><a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:richgauthier@gmail.com"><richgauthier@gmail.com></a></a><br>
<b>Betreff:</b> Re:
[General] De
Broglie Wave</div>
<div>
<div
style="background-color:
rgb(255,255,255);">Hi Al,<br>
<br>
thank you for
your
reference.
Your paper has
a lot of
intelligent
thoughts but
also a lot of
additional
assumptions.
With reference
to the de
Broglie wave,
I think, is
the situation
much simpler
on the level
of
conservative
knowledge. De
Broglie has
misunderstood
relativity
(particularly
dilation) and
so seen a
conflict which
does in fact
not exist. He
has solved the
conflict by
inventing an
additional
"fictitious"
wave which has
no other
foundation in
physics, and
also his
"theorem of
harmonic
phases" which
as well is an
invention
without need.
And his result
is in conflict
with the
experiment if
we ask for
Lorentz
invariance or
even for
Galilean
invariance. -
If we follow
the basic idea
of de Broglie
by, however,
avoiding his
logical error
about
relativity, we
come easily to
a description
of matter
waves without
logical
conflicts.
This does not
need new
philosophy or
other effort
at this level.<br>
<br>
Best, Albrecht<br>
<br>
<div
class="moz-cite-prefix">Am
06.02.2016 um
03:15 schrieb
<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:af.kracklauer@web.de"><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:af.kracklauer@web.de">af.kracklauer@web.de</a></a>:</div>
<blockquote>
<div
style="font-family:
Verdana;font-size:
12.0px;">
<div>
<div>Hi
Albrecht:</div>
<div> </div>
<div>DeBroglie's
verbage is
indeed quite
rococo!
Nonetheless,
his
machinations,
although
verbalized, in
the true
tradtion of
quantum
mechanics,
mysteriously,
can be
reinterpreted
(i.e.,
alternate
verbage found
without
changing any
of the math)
so as to tell
a fully, if
(somewhat)
hetrodoxical,
story. See
#11 on <a
moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated"
href="http://www.Nonloco-Physics.0catch.com"><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.Nonloco-Physics.0catch.com">www.Nonloco-Physics.0catch.com</a></a>.</div>
<div> </div>
<div>cc:
Waves are
never a
characteristic
of a single,
point-like
entity, but
colletive
motion of a
medium. IF
they exist at
all. My view
is that
E&M waves
are a fiction
wrought by
Fourier
analysis. The
only real
physical part
is an
"interaction",
which mnight
as well be
thought of an
absract string
between
charges.
Also,
neutrons have
electric
multipole
moments; i.e.,
they are
totally
neutral but
not
charge-free. </div>
<div> </div>
<div>Best,
Al </div>
<div>
<div
style="margin:
10.0px 5.0px
5.0px
10.0px;padding:
10.0px 0
10.0px
10.0px;border-left:
2.0px solid
rgb(195,217,229);">
<div
style="margin:
0 0 10.0px 0;"><b>Gesendet:</b> Freitag,
05. Februar
2016 um 21:43
Uhr<br>
<b>Von:</b> "Albrecht
Giese" <a
moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:genmail@a-giese.de"><a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:genmail@a-giese.de"><genmail@a-giese.de></a></a><br>
<b>An:</b> <a
moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated"
href="mailto:af.kracklauer@web.de"><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:af.kracklauer@web.de">af.kracklauer@web.de</a></a>,
<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated"
href="mailto:general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org"><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org">general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org</a></a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> "Richard
Gauthier" <a
moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E"
href="mailto:richgauthier@gmail.com"><a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:richgauthier@gmail.com"><richgauthier@gmail.com></a></a><br>
<b>Betreff:</b> Re:
[General] De
Broglie Wave</div>
<div>
<div
style="background-color:
rgb(255,255,255);">Hi Al,<br>
<br>
true, in the
frame of the
particle the
dB wavelength
is infinite.
Because in its
own frame the
momentum of
the particle
is 0. The
particle
oscillates
with the
frequency of
the particle's
Zitterbewegung
(which
background
fields do you
have in mind?
De Brogie does
not mention
them). This
oscillation is
in no
contradiction
with this
wavelength as
the phase
speed is also
infinite. For
the
imagination,
the latter
means that all
points of that
wave oscillate
with the same
phase at any
point.<br>
<br>
Which
background
waves do you
have in mind?
What is the
CNONOICAL
momentum? And
what about
E&M
interactions?
De Broglie has
not related
his wave to a
specific
field. An
E&M field
would anyway
have no effect
in the case of
neutron
scattering for
which the same
de Broglie
formalism is
used. And into
which frame do
you see the
wave
Lorentz-transformed?<br>
<br>
So, an
electron in
his frame has
an infinite
wavelength and
in his frame
has the double
slit moving
towards the
particle. How
can an
interference
at the slits
occur? No
interference
can happen
under these
conditions.
But, as I have
explained in
the paper, the
normal wave
which
accompanies
the electron
by normal
rules (i.e.
phase speed =
c) will have
an
interference
with its own
reflection,
which has then
a wavelength
which fits to
the
expectation of
de Broglie.
But that is a
very local
event (in a
range of
approx. 10^-12
m for the
electron) and
it is not at
all a property
of the
electron as de
Broglie has
thought.<br>
<br>
To say it
again: The de
Broglie
wavelength
cannot be a
steady
property of
the particle.
But
Schrödinger
and Dirac have
incorporated
it into their
QM equations
with this
understanding.<br>
<br>
If I should
have
misunderstood
you, please
show the
mathematical
calculations
which you
mean.<br>
<br>
Ciao, Albrecht<br>
<br>
<div
class="moz-cite-prefix">Am
05.02.2016 um
19:20 schrieb
<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:af.kracklauer@web.de"><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:af.kracklauer@web.de">af.kracklauer@web.de</a></a>:</div>
<blockquote>
<div
style="font-family:
Verdana;font-size:
12.0px;">
<div>
<div>Hi:
Albrecht:</div>
<div> </div>
<div>Your
arguments
don't resonate
with me. The
deB' wave
length is
infinite in
the particles
frame: it is
the standing
wave formed by
the inpinging
background
waves having a
freq. = the
particle's
Zitterbewegung.
If these TWO
waves are each
Lorentz
x-formed to
another frame
and added
there, they
exhibit
exactly the
DeB'
modulation
wavelength
proportional
to the
particle's
momentum. The
only
mysterious
feature then
is that the
proportionality
is to the
CNONICAL
momentum,
i.e.,
including the
vector
potential of
whatever
exterior
E&M
interactions
are in-coming.
Nevertheless,
everything
works our
without
contradiction.
A particle
oscillates in
place at its
Zitter freq.
while the
Zitter signals
are modulated
by the DeB'
wavelength as
they move
through slits,
say.</div>
<div> </div>
<div>ciao, L</div>
<div>
<div
style="margin:
10.0px 5.0px
5.0px
10.0px;padding:
10.0px 0
10.0px
10.0px;border-left:
2.0px solid
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<div
style="margin:
0 0 10.0px 0;"><b>Gesendet:</b> Freitag,
05. Februar
2016 um 12:28
Uhr<br>
<b>Von:</b> "Albrecht
Giese" <a
moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:genmail@a-giese.de"><a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:genmail@a-giese.de"><genmail@a-giese.de></a></a><br>
<b>An:</b> "Richard
Gauthier" <a
moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E"
href="mailto:richgauthier@gmail.com"><a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:richgauthier@gmail.com"><richgauthier@gmail.com></a></a>,
<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated"
href="mailto:general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org"><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org">general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org</a></a><br>
<b>Betreff:</b> Re:
[General] De
Broglie Wave</div>
<div>Hi
Richard and
Al, hi All,<br>
<br>
recently we
had a
discussion
here about two
topics:<br>
<br>
1. The
functionality
of the de
Broglie wave,
particularly
its wavelength<br>
if seen from a
different
inertial
system. Such
cases lead to
illogical<br>
situations.<br>
2. The problem
of the
apparent
asymmetry at
relativistic
dilation.<br>
<br>
I have
investigated
these cases
and found that
they are in
some way<br>
connected.
Relativistic
dilation is
not as simple
as it is
normally<br>
taken. It
looks
asymmetric if
it is
incorrectly
treated. An
asymmetry<br>
would falsify
Special
Relativity.
But it is in
fact
symmetrical if<br>
properly
handled and
understood.<br>
<br>
It is funny
that both
problems are
connected to
each other
through the<br>
fact that de
Broglie
himself has
misinterpreted
dilation. From
this<br>
incorrect
understanding
he did not
find another
way out than
to invent<br>
his "theorem
of phase
harmony"; with
all logical
conflicts
resulting<br>
from this
approach.<br>
<br>
If relativity
is properly
understood,
the problem
seen by de
Broglie<br>
does not
exist.
Equations
regarding
matter waves
can be derived
which<br>
work properly,
i.e. conform
to the
experiments
but avoid the
logical<br>
conflicts.<br>
<br>
As announced,
I have
composed a
paper about
this. It can
be found at:<br>
<br>
<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-freetext"
href="https://www.academia.edu/21564534/The_Conflict_with_the_De_Broglie_Wavelength"><a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://www.academia.edu/21564534/The_Conflict_with_the_De_Broglie_Wavelength">https://www.academia.edu/21564534/The_Conflict_with_the_De_Broglie_Wavelength</a></a><br>
.<br>
<br>
I thank
Richard
Gauthier for
the discussion
which we had
about this<br>
topic. It
caused me to
investigate
the problem
and to find a
solution.<br>
<br>
Albrecht<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
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