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<p><font face="Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif" size="-1">Dear Chandra
and dear Grahame,</font></p>
<p><font face="Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif" size="-1">firstly,
thank you, Chandra, for your feedback to my contribution. I
generally agree that there is a hierarchy of physical
quantities. But for your example of Einstein's m=E/c^2 </font><font
face="Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif" size="-1"> I am not so
sure. Is E more fundamental than m? True, m is not a fundamental
quantity on the lowest level. It describes the force which is
needed to accelerate an object. So, the quantity force should be
more fundamental. But what about E? In my understanding it is a
human concept which was brought up, when physicists detected one
day that in a closed system the quantity F*way is conserved. So
it received the name "energy". Is this energy always conserved?
I think that in some reactions of particle physics it is not.
And that is not only in the context of Heisenberg's uncertainty
relation. It is also violated by exchange particles.</font></p>
<p><font face="Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif" size="-1">So, what is
about exchange particles which mediate a force or a charge? You
both seem not to like it. But it has advantages. The general law
of distance of forces: 1/r^2 (e.g. the Coulomb law) can easily
be deduced by it if using the continuity relation and
geometrical broadening. In this context it is just simple
geometry. In addition the relativistic contraction (of fields)
is easily understandable if exchange particles are assumed. And
further, all explanations about gravity which do not use
Einstein's funny distorted space-time rely on exchange
particles.<br>
</font></p>
<p><font face="Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif" size="-1">Another point
in the discussion is the question of how photons can be
understood. It is said (at different places of the foregoing
discussion) that matter (i.e. leptons and quarks) can be
converted into pure energy, which means photons in this context.
Why is it denied that a photon is a particle? It has all
properties of a particle which the speciality that it
permanently moves with c. And with this latter property it is
very close to a neutrino for which nobody questions that it is a
particle. And a photon has a well defined energy. This fact was
indeed questioned by some contributions in this forum. To those
who are questioning it I would like to explain the following: <br>
</font></p>
<p><font face="Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif" size="-1">My PhD thesis
was about an experiment in which photons were scattered. The
source of the photon beam delivered photons with well defined
energy (it was a spectrum with a strong limit of an upper
energy). The photons were, after the scattering, detected by
pair production which took place when the photon passed a thin
sheet of metal. From the energy and direction of the
electron-positron pair the energy and the direction of the
photon was determined. The resulting energy of the scattered
photon was in agreement with the energy of the incoming photon.
So the energy of the individual photon was precisely measured
and so well defined. I do not see any argument for the position
that a photon is not an individual but just a beam with
properties which can only be statistically assumed. The photon
energy measured was clearly not defined by some property of the
detector what was sometimes suspected in the discussion here.<br>
</font></p>
<p><font face="Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif" size="-1">Sincerely<br>
Albrecht</font><br>
</p>
<br>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">Am 28.08.2016 um 00:51 schrieb Dr
Grahame Blackwell:<br>
</div>
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<div><font face="Arial" color="#000080" size="2">Roy (et al)</font></div>
<div> </div>
<div><font face="Arial" color="#000080" size="2">Thanks for this.
I believe I'm in full agreement with all you've said (as long
as I've understood it correctly); my only slight difference in
view is, I believe, a matter of semantics rather than science.</font></div>
<div> </div>
<div><font face="Arial" color="#000080" size="2">Like you, I don't
accept the concept of 'force-carrying particles'; this concept
appears to raise far more questions than it answers (if it
answers any) - it certainly doesn't in any way offer
significantly greater insight than the 'action at a distance'
proposed by Newton. [Not to put too fine a point on it, I
find it an insult to the intelligence as it appears to expect
a whole raft of counter-intuitive notions to be taken on
trust.] I agree 100% with your definition of rest-mass, also
the additional 'oscillatory energy' that relates to motion,
induced by some form of 'force gradient' that is itself an
extended consequence (part of the structure) of 'material
particles' and moves concomitantly with them. In this respect
such 'force effects' are not in some way communicated at
light-speed or faster, they are an integral part of the
particle producing that effect: if a complete unified singular
object moves as a whole, we don't propose that one part of the
object 'communicates its motion' to another part (at FTL
speed) so that it too moves - it just IS a unified moving
body. No threat to causality there. The fact that our
limited senses don't perceive the whole of that extended
entity doesn't mean that it can't exist - its very action
proves that it does, in accordance with our understanding of
EM effects.</font></div>
<div> </div>
<div><font face="Arial" color="#000080" size="2">My difference in
view relates to your observation that particles "are not made
of photons"; as I say, I believe this is a matter of semantics
- essentialy how one defines a photon. We agree that they are
formed from light-like oscillations of the universal field -
i.e. TEM wave packets. If one defines a photon simply as a
TEM wave packet then particles are formed from photons; if
however we add the stipulation that a photon radiates
rectilinearly from its dipole oscillatory source, then by
definition that wave packet forming a particle cannot be a
photon. The fact that elementary particles are (or at least
can be) initially created from photons is, I believe,
established by Landau & Lifshits (1934) and demonstrated
by the SLAC multiphoton Breit-Wheeler experiment of 1997.</font></div>
<div> </div>
<div><font face="Arial" color="#000080" size="2">I'm interested in
your observation that the 'force gradient' of a particle will
be distorted by a state of motion; I agree that this must be
true, since the configuration of its formative field will be
somewhat different. As you say, it would be interesting if it
were possible to construct an experiment to demonstrate this -
I suspect one would first have to persuade the experimenters
that SR is primarily a subjective effect, so that they don't
apply 'SR logic' as an objective truth to their readings!</font></div>
<div> </div>
<div><font face="Arial" color="#000080" size="2">Best regards,</font></div>
<div><font face="Arial" color="#000080" size="2">Grahame</font></div>
<div> </div>
<div> </div>
<div>----- Original Message ----- </div>
<blockquote style="BORDER-LEFT: #000080 2px solid; PADDING-LEFT:
5px; PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<div style="FONT: 10pt arial; BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; font-color:
black"><b>From:</b> <a moz-do-not-send="true"
title="chandra.roychoudhuri@uconn.edu"
href="mailto:chandra.roychoudhuri@uconn.edu">Roychoudhuri,
Chandra</a> </div>
<div style="FONT: 10pt arial"><b>To:</b> <a
moz-do-not-send="true"
title="general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org"
href="mailto:general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org">Nature
of Light and Particles - General Discussion</a> </div>
<div style="FONT: 10pt arial"><b>Sent:</b> Saturday, August 27,
2016 12:24 AM</div>
<div style="FONT: 10pt arial"><b>Subject:</b> Re: [General]
Gravity</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div class="WordSection1">
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New
Roman',serif; COLOR: windowtext">Chip, Albrecht, and the
rest of the team:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New
Roman',serif; COLOR: windowtext; FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><i><span style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times
New Roman',serif; COLOR: windowtext; FONT-SIZE: 14pt">Chip:<o:p></o:p></span></i></b></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New
Roman',serif; COLOR: windowtext; FONT-SIZE: 12pt">After
reading the article by Flandern, sent by Chip, I dug out a
possible later publication by Flandern. The link is given
below.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New
Roman',serif; COLOR: windowtext; FONT-SIZE: 9pt">……………………………..<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New
Roman',serif; COLOR: windowtext; FONT-SIZE: 9pt"><a
moz-do-not-send="true" title="Foundations of Physics"
href="http://link.springer.com/journal/10701"><span
style="COLOR: #8e2555">Foundations of Physics</span></a><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New
Roman',serif; COLOR: windowtext; FONT-SIZE: 9pt">July
2002, Volume 32, <a moz-do-not-send="true" title="Issue 7"
href="http://link.springer.com/journal/10701/32/7/page/1"><span
style="COLOR: #8e2555">Issue 7</span></a>, pp
1031–1068<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p style="MARGIN-BOTTOM: 9.35pt; BACKGROUND: #fcfcfc;
MARGIN-LEFT: 0in; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0in; mso-margin-top-alt:
9.35pt" class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times
New Roman',serif; COLOR: #333333; FONT-SIZE: 9pt"
lang="EN">“Experimental Repeal of the Speed Limit for
Gravitational, Electrodynamic, and Quantum Field
Interactions” by </span><span style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times
New Roman',serif; LETTER-SPACING: 0.2pt; COLOR: #333333;
FONT-SIZE: 9pt"><a moz-do-not-send="true" title="View
author's information"
href="http://link.springer.com/article/10.1023/A%3A1016530625645#author-details-1"><span
style="COLOR: #8e2555; TEXT-DECORATION: none">Tom Van
Flandern</span></a>, <a moz-do-not-send="true"
title="View author's information"
href="http://link.springer.com/article/10.1023/A%3A1016530625645#author-details-2"><span
style="COLOR: #8e2555; TEXT-DECORATION: none">Jean-Pierre Vigier</span></a><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New
Roman',serif; COLOR: windowtext">…………………………………………..<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New
Roman',serif; COLOR: windowtext"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New
Roman',serif; COLOR: windowtext">The beginning caveat – I
am not a theorist and am not conversant with the GR math.
My knowledge of GR is mostly from review articles without
math. Now, after reading Flandern, Now I believe, like
that for SR, GR does also have rather serious foundational
problems. And our understanding of momentum of a moving
object needs to explored deeper in light of the fact that
mass in not some immutable “substance”. It is the
perturbation energy that creates the resonant self-looped
oscillation of the cosmic Complex Tension Field (CTF); the
rest mass being the original oscillation-inducing energy.
Spatial (definitely not space-time) velocity, induced by
some “force gradient” adds further energy to a particle
in the form of “kinetic oscillations”. We need to
carefully analyze how we measure and interpret “momentum”
since mass is not an immutable intrinsic property. <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New
Roman',serif; COLOR: windowtext"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New
Roman',serif; COLOR: windowtext">Even with my limited
experimental expertise, I have always intuitively believed
that forces are not mediated by various force particles.
Thus, I clearly disagree with Flandern and Vigier. I have
said that in many of my publications, including my book.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New
Roman',serif; COLOR: windowtext"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New
Roman',serif; COLOR: windowtext">Based upon the various
intrinsic physical tension properties of the CTF, the
self-looped oscillations in the CTF generate various kinds
of decaying potential gradients of the CTF properties
around the oscillating “particle”. These gradients are not
exactly like the physical curvature in a stretched
membrane (prevailing GR analogy). Then the “particles” in
the vicinity of each other will move towards or away from
each other depending upon the sign of the potential
gradients. all into or are repulsed by this gradient.
Hence<b><i>, these force gradients are mobile with the
particles and would suffer spatial distortion at very
high velocity.</i></b> Attempts to measure these
distortion should open up new frontiers of physics. “The
potential gradients representing “forces”, obey the
principle of linear superposition; very much like the EM
wave amplitudes; even though the former is “stationary”
around the parent particle; and the latter is true
propagating wave that follows the classic wave equation.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New
Roman',serif; COLOR: windowtext"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New
Roman',serif; COLOR: windowtext">LCH should accommodate a
new group of experimentalist to design experiments to
measure the distortions in the electrostatic “force
gradient” generated by speeding electrons and protons.
Speedy protons-electron collision might help reveal the
distortion in their gravitational potential gradients.
These potential gradient based “forces” are not <b><i>communicated</i></b>
by some particles. Causality is not violated. “c” is not
exceeded by anything since even the particles are
light-like self-looped oscillations. Note that I am using
the phrase, light-like oscillations of the CTF; they are
not constructed out of photons. Photon wave packets are
linear propagating excitations of the CTF; perpetually
running away from the original point in space where they
were created by some dipole oscillation (from radio to
nuclear). <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New
Roman',serif; COLOR: windowtext"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><i><span style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times
New Roman',serif; COLOR: windowtext; FONT-SIZE: 14pt">Albrecht:
<o:p></o:p></span></i></b></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New
Roman',serif; COLOR: windowtext">In a separate recent
email you have raised a very important point, which in
some of my epistemology articles underscore as the
necessity of assigning the physical parameters in any
physics equation with the hierarchy of “primary”,
“secondary”, “tertiary”, etc., based upon the physical
roles they play in interactions with other entities; or
their emergence out of the CTF. So, I like your argument
related to </span><span style="FONT-FAMILY:
'Helvetica',sans-serif">√μ</span><span style="FONT-FAMILY:
'Cambria Math',serif">₀</span><span style="FONT-FAMILY:
'Helvetica',sans-serif; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">=1/</span><span
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Helvetica',sans-serif">c√(ε</span><span
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Cambria Math',serif; COLOR:
windowtext">₀</span><span style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New
Roman',serif; COLOR: windowtext">)</span><span
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New Roman',serif; COLOR:
windowtext; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">. </span><span
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New Roman',serif; COLOR:
windowtext; FONT-SIZE: 12pt">In this context, we may note
that Einstein</span><span style="FONT-FAMILY:
'Helvetica',sans-serif; COLOR: windowtext; FONT-SIZE:
12pt"> </span><span style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New
Roman',serif; COLOR: windowtext; FONT-SIZE: 12pt">preferred
to write m=E/c-squared; because m is not an immutable
property; it is an emergent property in our methods of
measuring it.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New
Roman',serif; COLOR: windowtext; FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New
Roman',serif; COLOR: windowtext; FONT-SIZE: 12pt">Sincerely,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New
Roman',serif; COLOR: windowtext; FONT-SIZE: 12pt">Chandra.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="COLOR: #1f497d"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div style="BORDER-BOTTOM: medium none; BORDER-LEFT: medium
none; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0in; PADDING-LEFT: 0in;
PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; BORDER-TOP: #e1e1e1 1pt solid;
BORDER-RIGHT: medium none; PADDING-TOP: 3pt">
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="COLOR: windowtext">From:</span></b><span
style="COLOR: windowtext"> General
[<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="mailto:general-bounces+chandra.roychoudhuri=uconn.edu@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org">mailto:general-bounces+chandra.roychoudhuri=uconn.edu@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org</a>]
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Chip Akins<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, August 25, 2016 5:41 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> 'Nature of Light and Particles - General
Discussion'
<a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org"><general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org></a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [General] Gravity<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New
Roman',serif; FONT-SIZE: 12pt">Hi Vladimir<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New
Roman',serif; FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New
Roman',serif; FONT-SIZE: 12pt">Here is one reference for
the speed of gravity and pulsars.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New
Roman',serif; FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">The speed of gravity – What the
experiments say – attached.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Chip<span style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New
Roman',serif; FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New
Roman',serif; FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div style="BORDER-BOTTOM: medium none; BORDER-LEFT: medium
none; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0in; PADDING-LEFT: 0in;
PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; BORDER-TOP: #e1e1e1 1pt solid;
BORDER-RIGHT: medium none; PADDING-TOP: 3pt">
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="COLOR: windowtext">From:</span></b><span
style="COLOR: windowtext"> Chip Akins [</span><a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:chipakins@gmail.com">mailto:chipakins@gmail.com</a><span
style="COLOR: windowtext">] <br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, August 25, 2016 4:15 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> 'Nature of Light and Particles - General
Discussion' <</span><a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org">general@lists..natureoflightandparticles.org</a><span
style="COLOR: windowtext">><br>
<b>Subject:</b> RE: [General] Gravity<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New
Roman',serif; FONT-SIZE: 12pt">Hi John D and Vladimir<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New
Roman',serif; FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New
Roman',serif; FONT-SIZE: 12pt">As it turns out gravity
needs to be 10000 to 20000 times as fast as light in order
for the orbits of the pulsars to be as we observe.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New
Roman',serif; FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New
Roman',serif; FONT-SIZE: 12pt">If most of the mass of a
black hole is inside the “event horizon” then how does the
huge gravity field escape? It seem that all of the black
holes gravity escapes the event horizon with no problem.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New
Roman',serif; FONT-SIZE: 12pt">For a black hole to have
gravity which is related to its mass then gravity HAS to
travel faster than light.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New
Roman',serif; FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New
Roman',serif; FONT-SIZE: 12pt">Charge (the Coulomb field)
also travels “almost instantaneously” (10000 to 20000
times the speed of light).<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New
Roman',serif; FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New
Roman',serif; FONT-SIZE: 12pt">Yes John D. Transverse (S)
waves travel at the velocity:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><!--[if gte msEquation 12]><m:oMathPara><m:oMath><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Cambria Math",serif'><m:r><m:rPr><m:scr m:val="roman"/><m:sty m:val="p"/></m:rPr>v=</m:r></span><m:rad><m:radPr><m:degHide m:val="on"/><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Cambria Math",serif'><m:ctrlPr></m:ctrlPr></span></m:radPr><m:deg></m:deg><m:e><m:f><m:fPr><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Cambria Math",serif'><m:ctrlPr></m:ctrlPr></span></m:fPr><m:num><i><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Cambria Math",serif'><m:r>μ</m:r></span></i></m:num><m:den><i><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Cambria Math",serif'><m:r>ρ</m:r></span></i></m:den></m:f></m:e></m:rad></m:oMath></m:oMathPara><![endif]--><!--[if !msEquation]--><span
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri',sans-serif; COLOR: black;
FONT-SIZE: 11pt; mso-fareast-language: EN-US"><img
style="WIDTH: 0.527in; HEIGHT: 0.59in" id="_x0000_i1025"
src="cid:part9.F84D118A.060D0667@a-giese.de" height="57"
width="51"></span><!--[endif]--><span
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial',sans-serif; COLOR: windowtext;
FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New
Roman',serif; FONT-SIZE: 12pt">Where v is velocity of
propagation, </span><span style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Cambria
Math',serif; FONT-SIZE: 12pt">𝜇</span><span
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New Roman',serif; FONT-SIZE:
12pt"> is the transverse modulus of the medium, and </span><span
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Cambria Math',serif; FONT-SIZE: 12pt">𝜌</span><span
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New Roman',serif; FONT-SIZE:
12pt"> is the “density” of the medium.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New
Roman',serif; FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New
Roman',serif; FONT-SIZE: 12pt">And longitudinal (P) waves
travel at the velocity:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><!--[if gte msEquation 12]><m:oMathPara><m:oMath><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Cambria Math",serif'><m:r><m:rPr><m:scr m:val="roman"/><m:sty m:val="p"/></m:rPr>v=</m:r></span><m:rad><m:radPr><m:degHide m:val="on"/><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Cambria Math",serif'><m:ctrlPr></m:ctrlPr></span></m:radPr><m:deg></m:deg><m:e><m:f><m:fPr><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Cambria Math",serif'><m:ctrlPr></m:ctrlPr></span></m:fPr><m:num><i><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Cambria Math",serif'><m:r>K</m:r></span></i><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Cambria Math",serif'><m:r><m:rPr><m:scr m:val="roman"/><m:sty m:val="p"/></m:rPr>+ </m:r></span><m:d><m:dPr><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Cambria Math",serif'><m:ctrlPr></m:ctrlPr></span></m:dPr><m:e><m:f><m:fPr><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Cambria Math",serif'><m:ctrlPr></m:ctrlPr></span></m:fPr><m:num><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Cambria Math",serif'><m:r><m:rPr><m:scr m:val="roman"/><m:sty m:val="p"/></m:rPr>4</m:r></span></m:num><m:den><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Cambria Math",serif'><m:r><m:rPr><m:scr m:val="roman"/><m:sty m:val="p"/></m:rPr>3</m:r></span></m:den></m:f><i><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Cambria Math",serif'><m:r>μ</m:r></span></i></m:e></m:d></m:num><m:den><i><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Cambria Math",serif'><m:r>ρ</m:r></span></i></m:den></m:f></m:e></m:rad></m:oMath></m:oMathPara><![endif]--><!--[if !msEquation]--><span
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri',sans-serif; COLOR: black;
FONT-SIZE: 11pt; mso-fareast-language: EN-US"><img
style="WIDTH: 1.166in; HEIGHT: 0.777in"
id="_x0000_i1025"
src="cid:part10.4EC4B6D0.C7B68C4D@a-giese.de"
height="75" width="112"></span><!--[endif]--><span
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial',sans-serif; COLOR: windowtext;
FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New
Roman',serif; FONT-SIZE: 12pt">Where K is the bulk or
longitudinal modulus.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New
Roman',serif; FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New
Roman',serif; FONT-SIZE: 12pt">We have never found a
medium which supports transverse waves and does not
support longitudinal waves. Longitudinal waves are always
faster, and can be orders of magnitude faster.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New
Roman',serif; FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New
Roman',serif; FONT-SIZE: 12pt">Chip<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New
Roman',serif; FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New
Roman',serif; FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<div>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="COLOR: windowtext">From:</span></b><span
style="COLOR: windowtext"> General [</span><a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:general-bounces+chipakins=gmail.com@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org">mailto:general-bounces+chipakins=gmail.com@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org</a><span
style="COLOR: windowtext">] <b>On Behalf Of </b>John
Duffield<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, August 25, 2016 1:26 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> 'Nature of Light and Particles - General
Discussion' <</span><a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org">general@lists..natureoflightandparticles.org</a><span
style="COLOR: windowtext">><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [General] Gravity<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="COLOR: #1f497d" lang="EN-GB">Chip:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="COLOR: #1f497d" lang="EN-GB"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="COLOR: #1f497d" lang="EN-GB">I
don’t think it’s heresy. See </span><a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://hyperphysics.phy-astr.gsu.edu/hbase/waves/seismic.html"><span
lang="EN-GB">hyperphysics</span></a><span style="COLOR:
#1f497d" lang="EN-GB">: <i>“S waves travel typically 60%
of the speed of P waves”. <o:p></o:p></i></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><i><span style="COLOR: #1f497d"
lang="EN-GB"><o:p> </o:p></span></i></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="COLOR: #1f497d" lang="EN-GB">I
wouldn’t bat an eyelid if different types of waves in
space travelled at different speeds too. <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="COLOR: #1f497d" lang="EN-GB"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="COLOR: #1f497d" lang="EN-GB">But
I have to say I’m not totally convinced by the recent LIGO
news. <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="COLOR: #1f497d" lang="EN-GB"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="COLOR: #1f497d" lang="EN-GB">Regards<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="COLOR: #1f497d" lang="EN-GB">John<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="COLOR: #1f497d" lang="EN-GB"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<div>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="COLOR: windowtext">From:</span></b><span
style="COLOR: windowtext"> General [</span><a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:general-bounces+johnduffield=btconnect.com@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org">mailto:general-bounces+johnduffield=btconnect.com@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org</a><span
style="COLOR: windowtext">] <b>On Behalf Of </b>Vladimir
Tamari<br>
<b>Sent:</b> 25 August 2016 16:14<br>
<b>To:</b> Nature of Light and Particles - General
Discussion <</span><a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org">general@lists..natureoflightandparticles.org</a><span
style="COLOR: windowtext">><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [General] Gravity<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB">Chip</span><span
style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt" lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div id="AppleMailSignature">
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB">The pulsars analysis
sounds interesting - a reference would be appreciated.
Would it change calculation if one considers that just
as light slows down in a gravitational field (as John D
pointed out) gravity itself would slow down in its own
field. A gravitational wave starts out sluggish just
after starting out at the edge of the black holes and
reach c in empty space?<br>
<br>
Here is a thought: Following my own arguments would
measuring light velocity as c in the Earth's
gravitational field mean it is larger in space?!<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div id="AppleMailSignature">
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div id="AppleMailSignature">
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB">Cheers<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div id="AppleMailSignature">
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB">Vladimir<br>
_____________________<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://vladimirtamari.com"><span lang="EN-GB">vladimirtamari.com</span></a><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<p style="MARGIN-BOTTOM: 12pt" class="MsoNormal"><span
lang="EN-GB"><br>
On Aug 25, 2016, at 7:55 PM, Chip Akins <</span><a
moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:chipakins@gmail.com"><span
lang="EN-GB">chipakins@gmail.com</span></a><span
lang="EN-GB">> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<blockquote style="MARGIN-TOP: 5pt; MARGIN-BOTTOM: 5pt">
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New
Roman',serif; FONT-SIZE: 12pt" lang="EN-GB">Hi All</span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New
Roman',serif; FONT-SIZE: 12pt" lang="EN-GB"> </span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New
Roman',serif; FONT-SIZE: 12pt" lang="EN-GB">The issue
of gravity is a bit more involved than the density of
electromagnetic fields.</span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New
Roman',serif; FONT-SIZE: 12pt" lang="EN-GB"> </span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New
Roman',serif; FONT-SIZE: 12pt" lang="EN-GB">When we
study binary pulsars, we see orbits which are much
more stable than they would be if gravity traveled at
the speed of electromagnetic fields. Studying pulsars
is important because if the speed of gravity is the
same as the speed of light these pulsars would change
their orbits at a specific rate, but they do not. The
“static field” argument does not apply to pulsars
which are moving massive bodies with their
gravitational centers constantly changing. Studying
pulsars clearly indicates that gravity is much faster
than light (electromagnetic fields).</span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New
Roman',serif; FONT-SIZE: 12pt" lang="EN-GB"> </span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New
Roman',serif; FONT-SIZE: 12pt" lang="EN-GB">It seems
that gravity may be the result of the Coulomb field
(electric charge) density instead of electromagnetic
field density. (There is a significant difference
between the Coulomb field and electromagnetic fields).
</span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New
Roman',serif; FONT-SIZE: 12pt" lang="EN-GB"> </span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New
Roman',serif; FONT-SIZE: 12pt" lang="EN-GB">I have
quoted two experiments on this forum before, conducted
in Italy, which indicate that the Coulomb field
(charge) is much faster than the speed of light, just
a Feynman found in one of his papers.</span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New
Roman',serif; FONT-SIZE: 12pt" lang="EN-GB"> </span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New
Roman',serif; FONT-SIZE: 12pt" lang="EN-GB">While
moving charge creates electromagnetic fields, charge
is not the same as an electromagnetic field. It is not
even the same as the E portion of the EM field. Charge
is a quantized quantity, EM radiation may be any
magnitude.</span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New
Roman',serif; FONT-SIZE: 12pt" lang="EN-GB"> </span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New
Roman',serif; FONT-SIZE: 12pt" lang="EN-GB">There are
things in this universe which travel much faster than
light.</span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New
Roman',serif; FONT-SIZE: 12pt" lang="EN-GB"> </span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New
Roman',serif; FONT-SIZE: 12pt" lang="EN-GB">I know
some will consider these statements to be “heresy”,
but take a good look at the experimental evidence and
the issue of binary pulsars.</span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New
Roman',serif; FONT-SIZE: 12pt" lang="EN-GB"> </span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New
Roman',serif; FONT-SIZE: 12pt" lang="EN-GB">Happy to
provide references for those interested.</span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New
Roman',serif; FONT-SIZE: 12pt" lang="EN-GB"> </span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New
Roman',serif; FONT-SIZE: 12pt" lang="EN-GB">Chip</span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New
Roman',serif; FONT-SIZE: 12pt" lang="EN-GB"> </span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New
Roman',serif; FONT-SIZE: 12pt" lang="EN-GB"> </span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<div>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="COLOR:
windowtext" lang="EN-GB">From:</span></b><span
style="COLOR: windowtext" lang="EN-GB"> General [</span><a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:general-bounces+chipakins=gmail.com@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org"><span
lang="EN-GB">mailto:general-bounces+chipakins=gmail.com@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org</span></a><span
style="COLOR: windowtext" lang="EN-GB">] <b>On
Behalf Of </b>John Duffield<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, August 25, 2016 2:08 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> 'Nature of Light and Particles -
General Discussion' <</span><a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org"><span
lang="EN-GB">general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org</span></a><span
style="COLOR: windowtext" lang="EN-GB">><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [General] Gravity</span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="COLOR: #1f497d;
FONT-SIZE: 14pt" lang="EN-GB">Vlad:</span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="COLOR: #1f497d;
FONT-SIZE: 14pt" lang="EN-GB"> </span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="COLOR: #1f497d;
FONT-SIZE: 14pt" lang="EN-GB">It’s the Einstein
digital papers. See </span><a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://einsteinpapers.press.princeton.edu/vol7-trans/156?highlightText=%22spatially%20variable%22"><span
style="FONT-SIZE: 14pt" lang="EN-GB">this</span></a><span
style="COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-SIZE: 14pt" lang="EN-GB">.
The first page is </span><a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://einsteinpapers.press.princeton.edu/vol7-trans/129?ajax"><span
style="FONT-SIZE: 14pt" lang="EN-GB">here</span></a><span
style="COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-SIZE: 14pt" lang="EN-GB">.
Einstein was talking about the <i>“Fundamental Ideas
and Methods of the Theory of Relativity, Presented
in Their Development”.</i></span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span class="t-search-snippet1"><span
style="FONT-FAMILY: inherit; COLOR: #222222"
lang="EN-GB"> </span></span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="COLOR: #1f497d;
FONT-SIZE: 14pt" lang="EN-GB">Note though that
Einstein wasn’t talking in terms of “a car
decelerating because it takes a curve”. He was talking
about a car’s path curving to the left <i>because</i>
the speed of its wheels on the left is less than the
speed of its wheels on the right. Imagine you’re
driving down a country road. The road is muddy on the
left, so the car pulls left. We steer tanks in this
fashion. </span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="COLOR: #1f497d;
FONT-SIZE: 14pt" lang="EN-GB"> </span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="COLOR: #1f497d;
FONT-SIZE: 14pt" lang="EN-GB">Your paper reminds me of
Inhomogeneous Vaccuum, an Alternative Interpretation
of Curved Spacetime. See attached. </span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="COLOR: #1f497d;
FONT-SIZE: 14pt" lang="EN-GB"> </span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB"><image002.jpg><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="COLOR: #1f497d;
FONT-SIZE: 14pt" lang="EN-GB"> </span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="COLOR: #1f497d;
FONT-SIZE: 14pt" lang="EN-GB">Regards</span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="COLOR: #1f497d;
FONT-SIZE: 14pt" lang="EN-GB">John </span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="COLOR: #1f497d"
lang="EN-GB"> </span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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BORDER-RIGHT: medium none; PADDING-TOP: 3pt">
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="COLOR:
windowtext" lang="EN-GB">From:</span></b><span
style="COLOR: windowtext" lang="EN-GB"> General [</span><a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:general-bounces+johnduffield=btconnect.com@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org"><span
lang="EN-GB">mailto:general-bounces+johnduffield=btconnect.com@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org</span></a><span
style="COLOR: windowtext" lang="EN-GB">] <b>On
Behalf Of </b>Vladimir Tamari<br>
<b>Sent:</b> 25 August 2016 03:04<br>
<b>To:</b> Nature of Light and Particles - General
Discussion <</span><a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org"><span
lang="EN-GB">general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org</span></a><span
style="COLOR: windowtext" lang="EN-GB">><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [General] Gravity</span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB">Very good
Grahame<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB">John D. What is
the book you quoted about light speed varying? <o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB">Yes Einstein
admitted that the speed of light had to vary, as in
mechanics the speed slows down with curvature - that
is the link between gravity and acceleration -
actually deceleration when a car takes a curve.
Unfortunately the whole unnecessarily complex
structure of General Relativity equations remained
expressed in the language of variable spacetime!<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB">In my 1993 paper
United Dipole Field I show how curvature of light
rays ie gravity occured in the variable refractive
index of a dipole. </span><a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://vladimirtamari.com/United-Dipole-Field-Tamari.pdf"><span
lang="EN-GB">http://vladimirtamari.com/United-Dipole-Field-Tamari.pdf</span></a><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB">Here is a figure
from the Dipole paper. I generalized this idea in my
Beautiful Universe model for an entire Universe made
up of such dipoles.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB">Cheers<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB">Vladimir<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB"><image003.jpg><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB">Cheers<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB">Vladimir<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB">_____________________<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://vladimirtamari.com"><span
lang="EN-GB">vladimirtamari.com</span></a><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<p style="MARGIN-BOTTOM: 12pt" class="MsoNormal"><span
lang="EN-GB"><br>
On Aug 25, 2016, at 2:47 AM, John Duffield <</span><a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:johnduffield@btconnect.com"><span
lang="EN-GB">johnduffield@btconnect.com</span></a><span
lang="EN-GB">> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<blockquote style="MARGIN-TOP: 5pt; MARGIN-BOTTOM: 5pt">
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="COLOR: #1f497d"
lang="EN-GB">Grahame:</span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="COLOR: #1f497d"
lang="EN-GB"> </span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="COLOR: #1f497d"
lang="EN-GB">Sorry I haven’t got back to you on
your paper yet, I’ve been busy. But note that
Einstein never said light curves because spacetime
was curved. He said light curves because the speed
of light varies with position. </span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="COLOR: #1f497d"
lang="EN-GB"> </span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="COLOR: #1f497d"
lang="EN-GB"><image001.jpg></span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="COLOR: #1f497d"
lang="EN-GB"> </span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="COLOR: #1f497d"
lang="EN-GB">Light curves for the same reason
sonar waves curve.</span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="COLOR: #1f497d"
lang="EN-GB"> </span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB"><image002.gif><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="COLOR: #1f497d"
lang="EN-GB"> </span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="COLOR: #1f497d"
lang="EN-GB"> </span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="COLOR: #1f497d"
lang="EN-GB"> </span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="COLOR: #1f497d"
lang="EN-GB">Regards</span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="COLOR: #1f497d"
lang="EN-GB">JohnD</span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="COLOR: #1f497d"
lang="EN-GB"> </span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div style="BORDER-BOTTOM: medium none; BORDER-LEFT:
medium none; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0in; PADDING-LEFT:
0in; PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; BORDER-TOP: #e1e1e1 1pt
solid; BORDER-RIGHT: medium none; PADDING-TOP:
3pt">
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="COLOR:
windowtext" lang="EN-GB">From:</span></b><span
style="COLOR: windowtext" lang="EN-GB">
General [</span><a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:general-bounces+johnduffield=btconnect.com@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org"><span
lang="EN-GB">mailto:general-bounces+johnduffield=btconnect.com@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org</span></a><span
style="COLOR: windowtext" lang="EN-GB">] <b>On
Behalf Of </b>Dr Grahame Blackwell<br>
<b>Sent:</b> 23 August 2016 14:38<br>
<b>To:</b> Nature of Light and Particles -
General Discussion <</span><a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org"><span
lang="EN-GB">general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org</span></a><span
style="COLOR: windowtext" lang="EN-GB">><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [General] Gravity</span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY:
'Arial',sans-serif; COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE:
10pt" lang="EN-GB">Dear Chandra, John D, John H,
Wolf and others,</span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY:
'Times New Roman',serif; COLOR: windowtext;
FONT-SIZE: 12pt" lang="EN-GB"> </span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY:
'Arial',sans-serif; COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE:
10pt" lang="EN-GB">Thanks, Chandra, for your
response. I totally agree that the answer to
the gravitation issue (as to so many others)
involves reverse engineering the system we refer
to as reality. More on that below. (I also
find myself in strong agreement with your views
on 'the spacetime continuum'.)</span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY:
'Times New Roman',serif; COLOR: windowtext;
FONT-SIZE: 12pt" lang="EN-GB"> </span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY:
'Arial',sans-serif; COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE:
10pt" lang="EN-GB">John D, I agree also the the
'curvature' of spacetime is in fact
inhomogeneity of the electromagnetic field
density - which also appears to concur with
Hammond's view. More on this also below.</span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY:
'Times New Roman',serif; COLOR: windowtext;
FONT-SIZE: 12pt" lang="EN-GB"> </span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY:
'Arial',sans-serif; COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE:
10pt" lang="EN-GB">Wolf, I understand your
preference for considering the interplay of
electricity and gravity/inertia; however, given
that gravitation is an effect wholly engendered
by particles of matter, it seems most unlikely
that we're going to understand gravity without
getting a clear grip on those particles.</span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY:
'Times New Roman',serif; COLOR: windowtext;
FONT-SIZE: 12pt" lang="EN-GB"> </span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY:
'Arial',sans-serif; COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE:
10pt" lang="EN-GB">The SR 'explanation' of
gravitation as 'curvature of spacetime' is in
fact no explanation at all - it says nothing
about WHAT is being curved, HOW it's being
curved, WHAT it is about matter that causes that
curvature or WHY light and material objects move
in accordance with that 'curvature'. It's a
useful picture, certainly, but in terms of
explanation it appears to add little to Newton's
action-at-a-distance (other than relativistic
effects).</span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY:
'Times New Roman',serif; COLOR: windowtext;
FONT-SIZE: 12pt" lang="EN-GB"> </span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY:
'Arial',sans-serif; COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE:
10pt" lang="EN-GB">So let's try a bit of that
reverse systems engineering:</span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY:
'Times New Roman',serif; COLOR: windowtext;
FONT-SIZE: 12pt" lang="EN-GB"> </span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY:
'Arial',sans-serif; COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE:
10pt" lang="EN-GB">Fact (1): It's known (and has
been since at least 1934) that particles of
matter are (time-varying) electromagnetic
constructs.</span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY:
'Times New Roman',serif; COLOR: windowtext;
FONT-SIZE: 12pt" lang="EN-GB"> </span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY:
'Arial',sans-serif; COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE:
10pt" lang="EN-GB">Fact (2): Given fact (1), and
given that electromagnetic field effects drop
off inverse-quadratically in relation to the
distance from their source, it follows that
material particles will have a presence that
likewise drops off as the inverse square of
distance; that presence is detectable - we refer
to it by two names: gravitation and electrical
charge.</span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY:
'Times New Roman',serif; COLOR: windowtext;
FONT-SIZE: 12pt" lang="EN-GB"> </span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY:
'Arial',sans-serif; COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE:
10pt" lang="EN-GB">Fact (3): In this very real
sense every particle of matter is in fact
unlimited spatially in its extent; the
limitations that we attribute to such particles
are in fact limitations of our own perception,
which is only capable of detecting them through
'virtual photon' interactions, which are
interactions between the central 'cores' (loops)
of particles being sensed and particles doing
the sensing.</span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY:
'Times New Roman',serif; COLOR: windowtext;
FONT-SIZE: 12pt" lang="EN-GB"> </span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY:
'Arial',sans-serif; COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE:
10pt" lang="EN-GB">Fact (4): Given facts (1) -
(3), it follows that the whole of space will be
permeated by the totality of (time-varying)
electromagnetic field effects from all the
particles in the universe, each contributing in
accordance with the inverse square law; given
also the evening out of 'positive' and
'negative' charge effects on a macroscopic
scale, these field effects constitute what we
refer to as 'the universal gravitational field'.</span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY:
'Times New Roman',serif; COLOR: windowtext;
FONT-SIZE: 12pt" lang="EN-GB"> </span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY:
'Arial',sans-serif; COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE:
10pt" lang="EN-GB">Fact (5): That field will
vary in intensity in accordance with distance
from the various massive bodies that form it;
this varying intensity of electromagnetic field
effects will influence the behaviour of other
electromagnetic constructs passing through that
field, i.e. ensembles of particles that form
massive bodies; (it is implicit in this, of
course, that the principle of coherent
superposition of linear photons won't apply to
these non-linear time-varying electromagnetic
field effects - i.e.they will influence each
other through a complex process of mutual
interference).</span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY:
'Times New Roman',serif; COLOR: windowtext;
FONT-SIZE: 12pt" lang="EN-GB"> </span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY:
'Arial',sans-serif; COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE:
10pt" lang="EN-GB">Fact (6): This varying
density of field effects will give this
continuum a 'shape' defined by the surfaces of
equal intensity of those effects; these 3-D
contours will effectively determine the motion
of electromagnetic constructs - light, particles
- through that medium; (any scuba diver who has
seen or felt a thermocline in water will have a
good analogy to work from here).</span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY:
'Times New Roman',serif; COLOR: windowtext;
FONT-SIZE: 12pt" lang="EN-GB"> </span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY:
'Arial',sans-serif; COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE:
10pt" lang="EN-GB">Fact (7): It's implicit, and
would necessarily be the case, that, although
electrostatic charge 'cancel out' if they are
equal and opposite, the electromagnetic field
effects giving rise to those charges will in
fact be additive across the cosmos; likewise,
though gravitational 'pull' from opposing
directions may appear to cancel out, there may
still be a strong gravitational field in that
location - think of a plateau high on a great
mountain, with a small hillock on that platea.</span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY:
'Times New Roman',serif; COLOR: windowtext;
FONT-SIZE: 12pt" lang="EN-GB"> </span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY:
'Arial',sans-serif; COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE:
10pt" lang="EN-GB">Fact (8): Substantial
supporting detail for this perspective on
gravitation can be found in my paper 'Cosmic
System Dynamics', posted with my email of 20th
August.</span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY:
'Times New Roman',serif; COLOR: windowtext;
FONT-SIZE: 12pt" lang="EN-GB"> </span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY:
'Arial',sans-serif; COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE:
10pt" lang="EN-GB">A couple of points as a
postscript:</span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY:
'Arial',sans-serif; COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE:
10pt" lang="EN-GB">(a) This means that we
ourselves, being ensembles of material
particles, actually extend across the whole
cosmos; this may prove relevant;</span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY:
'Arial',sans-serif; COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE:
10pt" lang="EN-GB">(b) The entire cosmos is in
fact one electromagnetic entity; from the QM
point of view there is just ONE wavefunction,
spanning the whole universe: wavefunctions for
single particles or ensembles of particles are
in fact local approximations to this universal
wavefunction, in which terms for more distant
influences have been ignored as being
insignificant; this could well have something to
say about 'quantum randomness', which may in
fact be those other influences tipping the
balance (this is also expanded upon in my book).</span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY:
'Times New Roman',serif; COLOR: windowtext;
FONT-SIZE: 12pt" lang="EN-GB"> </span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY:
'Arial',sans-serif; COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE:
10pt" lang="EN-GB">Best regards to all,</span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY:
'Arial',sans-serif; COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE:
10pt" lang="EN-GB">Grahame</span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY:
'Times New Roman',serif; COLOR: windowtext;
FONT-SIZE: 12pt" lang="EN-GB"> </span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<blockquote style="BORDER-BOTTOM: medium none;
BORDER-LEFT: navy 1.5pt solid; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0in;
MARGIN: 5pt 0in 5pt 3.75pt; PADDING-LEFT: 4pt;
PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; BORDER-TOP: medium none;
BORDER-RIGHT: medium none; PADDING-TOP: 0in">
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY:
'Arial',sans-serif; COLOR: windowtext;
FONT-SIZE: 10pt" lang="EN-GB">----- Original
Message ----- </span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4" class="MsoNormal"><b><span
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial',sans-serif;
COLOR: windowtext; FONT-SIZE: 10pt"
lang="EN-GB">From:</span></b><span
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial',sans-serif; COLOR:
windowtext; FONT-SIZE: 10pt" lang="EN-GB"> </span><a
moz-do-not-send="true"
title="chandra.roychoudhuri@uconn.edu"
href="mailto:chandra.roychoudhuri@uconn.edu"><span
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial',sans-serif;
FONT-SIZE: 10pt" lang="EN-GB">Roychoudhuri,
Chandra</span></a><span style="FONT-FAMILY:
'Arial',sans-serif; COLOR: windowtext;
FONT-SIZE: 10pt"> </span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="FONT-FAMILY:
'Arial',sans-serif; COLOR: windowtext;
FONT-SIZE: 10pt" lang="EN-GB">To:</span></b><span
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial',sans-serif; COLOR:
windowtext; FONT-SIZE: 10pt" lang="EN-GB"> </span><a
moz-do-not-send="true"
title="general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org"
href="mailto:general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org"><span
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial',sans-serif;
FONT-SIZE: 10pt" lang="EN-GB">Nature of
Light and Particles - General Discussion</span></a><span
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial',sans-serif; COLOR:
windowtext; FONT-SIZE: 10pt" lang="EN-GB"> ; </span><a
moz-do-not-send="true"
title="chandra.roychoudhuri@uconn.edu"
href="mailto:chandra.roychoudhuri@uconn.edu"><span
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial',sans-serif;
FONT-SIZE: 10pt" lang="EN-GB">Roychoudhuri,
Chandra</span></a><span style="FONT-FAMILY:
'Arial',sans-serif; COLOR: windowtext;
FONT-SIZE: 10pt" lang="EN-GB"> ; </span><a
moz-do-not-send="true"
title="chandra@phys.uconn.edu"
href="mailto:chandra@phys.uconn.edu"><span
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial',sans-serif;
FONT-SIZE: 10pt" lang="EN-GB">Chandra UConn</span></a><span
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial',sans-serif; COLOR:
windowtext; FONT-SIZE: 10pt"> </span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="FONT-FAMILY:
'Arial',sans-serif; COLOR: windowtext;
FONT-SIZE: 10pt" lang="EN-GB">Sent:</span></b><span
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial',sans-serif; COLOR:
windowtext; FONT-SIZE: 10pt" lang="EN-GB">
Sunday, August 21, 2016 3:54 PM</span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="FONT-FAMILY:
'Arial',sans-serif; COLOR: windowtext;
FONT-SIZE: 10pt" lang="EN-GB">Subject:</span></b><span
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial',sans-serif; COLOR:
windowtext; FONT-SIZE: 10pt" lang="EN-GB"> Re:
[General] Gravity and ultraweak-photonemission</span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY:
'Times New Roman',serif; COLOR: windowtext;
FONT-SIZE: 12pt" lang="EN-GB"> </span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY:
'Times New Roman',serif; COLOR: windowtext;
FONT-SIZE: 12pt" lang="EN-GB">Grahame: I like
your spirit, the mode of thinking. I call it
ergently needed "Evolution Process Congruent
Thinking", which I sometimes express as,
"Reverse System Engineering Thinking".</span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY:
'Times New Roman',serif; COLOR: windowtext;
FONT-SIZE: 12pt" lang="EN-GB">My papers can be
downloaded from the web: </span><a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://phy.ucon.edu"><span
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New Roman',serif;
FONT-SIZE: 12pt" lang="EN-GB">phy.ucon.edu</span></a><span
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New Roman',serif;
COLOR: windowtext; FONT-SIZE: 12pt"
lang="EN-GB"> -- faculty -- research; the link
is below my image.</span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY:
'Times New Roman',serif; COLOR: windowtext;
FONT-SIZE: 12pt" lang="EN-GB">Keep up the good
spirit.</span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY:
'Times New Roman',serif; COLOR: windowtext;
FONT-SIZE: 12pt" lang="EN-GB">Chandra. </span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY:
'Times New Roman',serif; COLOR: windowtext;
FONT-SIZE: 12pt" lang="EN-GB"> </span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY:
'Times New Roman',serif; COLOR: windowtext;
FONT-SIZE: 12pt" lang="EN-GB"> </span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY:
'Times New Roman',serif; COLOR: windowtext;
FONT-SIZE: 12pt" lang="EN-GB"> </span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div id="composer_signature">
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY:
'Times New Roman',serif; COLOR: #575757;
FONT-SIZE: 10pt" lang="EN-GB">Sent via the
Samsung Galaxy S® 5 ACTIVE™, an AT&T 4G
LTE smartphone</span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p style="MARGIN-BOTTOM: 12pt" class="MsoNormal"><span
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New Roman',serif;
COLOR: windowtext; FONT-SIZE: 12pt" lang="EN-GB"><br>
<br>
-------- Original message --------<br>
From: Dr Grahame Blackwell <</span><a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:grahame@starweave.com"><span
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New Roman',serif;
FONT-SIZE: 12pt" lang="EN-GB">grahame@starweave.com</span></a><span
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New Roman',serif;
COLOR: windowtext; FONT-SIZE: 12pt" lang="EN-GB">>
<br>
Date: 8/21/2016 8:04 AM (GMT-05:00) <br>
To: Nature of Light and Particles - General
Discussion <</span><a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org"><span
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New Roman',serif;
FONT-SIZE: 12pt" lang="EN-GB">general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org</span></a><span
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New Roman',serif;
COLOR: windowtext; FONT-SIZE: 12pt" lang="EN-GB">>
<br>
Subject: Re: [General] Gravity and
ultraweak-photonemission </span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY:
'Arial',sans-serif; COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE:
10pt" lang="EN-GB">Thanks John,</span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY:
'Times New Roman',serif; COLOR: windowtext;
FONT-SIZE: 12pt" lang="EN-GB"> </span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY:
'Arial',sans-serif; COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE:
10pt" lang="EN-GB">I'm more than ever
convinced that unless we can get a better
grasp of what 'space-time' actually IS -
which fundamentally means a proper
understanding of gravitation - then our
species is at very serious risk of imploding
and taking much (most?) of life on this
planet with us. For the past century or
more we've been looking inward rather than
outward; humankind is essentally an
outward-looking race (the very word 'race'
implies that!), and without somewhere to
look outward TO we tend to flounder and
bicker - just look around the planet today!
The world is so vastly overcrowded now, and
set to be increasingly more so, with
numerous environmental issues to compound
the problem. We need new horizons, new
frontiers, more than we ever did in the time
of Vasco de Gama and Columbus!</span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY:
'Times New Roman',serif; COLOR: windowtext;
FONT-SIZE: 12pt" lang="EN-GB"> </span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY:
'Arial',sans-serif; COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE:
10pt" lang="EN-GB">[As an aside, I hope we'd
also be rather more considerate of
any indigenous lifeforms that those who
followed Columbus!]</span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY:
'Times New Roman',serif; COLOR: windowtext;
FONT-SIZE: 12pt" lang="EN-GB"> </span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY:
'Arial',sans-serif; COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE:
10pt" lang="EN-GB">That's a major reason why
I've offered my proposal on gravitation for
consideration. If we don't crack this one,
VERY soon, we may run out of time,
lebensraum AND the ability to deal with the
pressure-cooker environment we've created
for ourselves. David Attenborough is
proposing that we seriously limit population
growth; the Chinese have tried that and it
didn't work - and it never will; the 'prime
directive' built into our makeup by
evolution is procreation. Our planet is
like a dandelion head full of seeds ready to
fly - we've even been exploring the heavens
around us for places to fly TO! What we
need now is the way to do it; I earnestly
believe that the way to do it is there in a
greater understanding of matter, space-time
and gravitation - but not as long as the
established scientific community insists on
hanging on to outdated paradigms and
doggedly refuses to even look at things from
a new perspective.</span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY:
'Times New Roman',serif; COLOR: windowtext;
FONT-SIZE: 12pt" lang="EN-GB"> </span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY:
'Arial',sans-serif; COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE:
10pt" lang="EN-GB">Ok, off my soap-box now.
But I do really hope that a few of you out
there will take a look at my paper posted
with my last email; if there's something
clearly wrong with it, please tell me - if
not, please tell others! Thanks.</span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY:
'Times New Roman',serif; COLOR: windowtext;
FONT-SIZE: 12pt" lang="EN-GB"> </span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY:
'Arial',sans-serif; COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE:
10pt" lang="EN-GB">Grahame</span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY:
'Times New Roman',serif; COLOR: windowtext;
FONT-SIZE: 12pt" lang="EN-GB"> </span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<blockquote style="BORDER-BOTTOM: medium none;
BORDER-LEFT: navy 1.5pt solid; PADDING-BOTTOM:
0in; MARGIN: 5pt 0in 5pt 3.75pt; PADDING-LEFT:
4pt; PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; BORDER-TOP: medium
none; BORDER-RIGHT: medium none; PADDING-TOP:
0in">
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY:
'Arial',sans-serif; COLOR: windowtext;
FONT-SIZE: 10pt" lang="EN-GB">-----
Original Message ----- </span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4"
class="MsoNormal"><b><span
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial',sans-serif;
COLOR: windowtext; FONT-SIZE: 10pt"
lang="EN-GB">From:</span></b><span
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial',sans-serif;
COLOR: windowtext; FONT-SIZE: 10pt"
lang="EN-GB"> </span><a
moz-do-not-send="true"
title="johnduffield@btconnect.com"
href="mailto:johnduffield@btconnect.com"><span
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial',sans-serif;
FONT-SIZE: 10pt" lang="EN-GB">John
Duffield</span></a><span
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial',sans-serif;
COLOR: windowtext; FONT-SIZE: 10pt"> </span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial',sans-serif;
COLOR: windowtext; FONT-SIZE: 10pt"
lang="EN-GB">To:</span></b><span
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial',sans-serif;
COLOR: windowtext; FONT-SIZE: 10pt"
lang="EN-GB"> </span><a
moz-do-not-send="true"
title="general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org"
href="mailto:general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org"><span
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial',sans-serif;
FONT-SIZE: 10pt" lang="EN-GB">'Nature of
Light and Particles - General
Discussion'</span></a><span
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial',sans-serif;
COLOR: windowtext; FONT-SIZE: 10pt"> </span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial',sans-serif;
COLOR: windowtext; FONT-SIZE: 10pt"
lang="EN-GB">Sent:</span></b><span
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial',sans-serif;
COLOR: windowtext; FONT-SIZE: 10pt"
lang="EN-GB"> Saturday, August 20, 2016
6:04 PM</span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial',sans-serif;
COLOR: windowtext; FONT-SIZE: 10pt"
lang="EN-GB">Subject:</span></b><span
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial',sans-serif;
COLOR: windowtext; FONT-SIZE: 10pt"
lang="EN-GB"> Re: [General] Gravity and
ultraweak-photonemission</span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="FONT-FAMILY:
'Times New Roman',serif; COLOR:
windowtext; FONT-SIZE: 12pt" lang="EN-GB"> </span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="COLOR:
#1f497d" lang="EN-GB">Grahame:</span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="COLOR:
#1f497d" lang="EN-GB">I share your general
sentiment. I’ll read through your paper
and get back to you. Meanwhile I rather
think the “shake the rug” waves are light
waves. A gravitational field is a place
where space is inhomogeneous, not curved.
See what Percy Hammond says</span><span
class="comment-copy"><span
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Georgia',serif;
COLOR: #242729; FONT-SIZE: 10pt"
lang="EN-GB"> </span></span><a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://www.compumag.org/jsite/images/stories/newsletter/ICS-99-06-2-Hammond.pdf"><span
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Georgia',serif;
FONT-SIZE: 10pt" lang="EN-GB">here</span></a><span
class="comment-copy"><span
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Georgia',serif;
COLOR: #242729; FONT-SIZE: 10pt"
lang="EN-GB">: <i>"We conclude that the
field describes the curvature that
characterizes the electromagnetic
interaction"</i>. </span></span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="COLOR:
#1f497d" lang="EN-GB">Regards</span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="COLOR:
#1f497d" lang="EN-GB">John D</span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div style="BORDER-BOTTOM: medium none;
BORDER-LEFT: medium none; PADDING-BOTTOM:
0in; PADDING-LEFT: 0in; PADDING-RIGHT:
0in; BORDER-TOP: #e1e1e1 1pt solid;
BORDER-RIGHT: medium none; PADDING-TOP:
3pt">
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span
style="COLOR: windowtext"
lang="EN-GB">From:</span></b><span
style="COLOR: windowtext" lang="EN-GB">
General [</span><a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:general-bounces+johnduffield=btconnect.com@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org"><span
lang="EN-GB">mailto:general-bounces+johnduffield=btconnect.com@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org</span></a><span
style="COLOR: windowtext" lang="EN-GB">]
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Dr Grahame
Blackwell<br>
<b>Sent:</b> 20 August 2016 16:37<br>
<b>To:</b> Nature of Light and
Particles - General Discussion <</span><a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org"><span
lang="EN-GB">general@lists.natureoflightandparticles.org</span></a><span
style="COLOR: windowtext" lang="EN-GB">><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [General] Gravity
and ultraweak-photonemission</span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial',sans-serif;
COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE: 10pt"
lang="EN-GB">Hi Wolfgang, John M, John
D, Hubert, Vladimir, Beverly et al.,</span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial',sans-serif;
COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE: 10pt"
lang="EN-GB">There appear to be very
strong reasons to believe that
gravitation is in fact an EM effect. If
one starts from the premise that
elementary particles are themselves
electromagnetic constructs then it's
almost a foregone conclusion. That
premise was strongly evidenced by Landau
& Lifshits in Sov. Phys., 1934,
reinforced by Breit & Wheeler later
that same year and proved beyond all
reasonable doubt at SLAC in 1997 by
Burke et al. (Phys Rev Lett 79,
pp1626-9).</span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial',sans-serif;
COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE: 10pt"
lang="EN-GB">It's at times somewhat
paradoxical to me that physicists
(present company excepted!) all too
often go looking for complicated
explanations when there's a simple one
staring them in the face. If one simply
sees the force of attraction between
unlike unit charges as being minutely
greater than the force of repulsion
between like charges - and there's no
known reason why they should be
identical (in fact it's likely that they
won't) - then gravitation drops out
totally naturally as the difference
between those two effects. This would
seem to sit well with Occam's razor
since it eliminates the need for one
otherwise totally unexplained cosmic
force at a stroke. We know that every
nucleon is made up of a mix of particles
of opposing charge (quarks) to give an
overall charge; it seems eminently
likely that even those quarks are formed
from energies that, taken separately,
would give rise to either positive or
negative charge elements to give the
overall charge for a quark - this links
the gravitational effect of a particle
directly to its total energy content and
so to its total mass.</span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial',sans-serif;
COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE: 10pt"
lang="EN-GB">I've attached a copy of my
paper, published in 'Kybernetes' five
years ago, that details this proposal
for gravitation. You'll see that it
posits the notion that space(-time) has
a 'texture' (also explaining its
'stiffness' and the 'curvature of
spacetime') given by the summation of
all time-varying EM field effects
emanating from all of the material
particles in the universe - this of
course draws on the fact that
electromagnetic fields are unlimited in
their reach (and electromagnetic
potential is unblockable - Aharonov-Bohm
Effect), i.e. that what we experience as
a localised particle is just the 'core',
so to speak, of an electromagnetic field
effect unlimited in its extent. The
(-time) in brackets above reflects the
fact that this 'texture' of this
'neo-aether' is continually varying as
celestial bodies (and groups of
celestial bodies) are themselves in
continuous motion, so also is their
contribution to this 'textured'
continuum.</span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial',sans-serif;
COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE: 10pt"
lang="EN-GB">I'd be most interested in
any feedback on this proposal, including
of course any clear reasons (if any such
exist) why it may not be a feasible
proposition. You'll note that this
concept includes a pretty thorough
explanation for every aspect of the
Equivalence Principle as included in
GR. There's also the strong implication
that the gravity waves recently detected
are themselves electromagnetic
constructs (since the fabric of
spacetime is itself EM in nature, and so
susceptible to being 'shaken like a rug'
by such waves); this may have something
to say to Beverly's field of interest,
since tidal forces are themselves in a
sense a pale shadow of gravity waves.</span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial',sans-serif;
COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE: 10pt"
lang="EN-GB">Thanks all,</span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial',sans-serif;
COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE: 10pt"
lang="EN-GB">Grahame</span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
<div style="TEXT-ALIGN: center" class="MsoNormal"
align="center"><span style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times
New Roman',serif; COLOR: windowtext; FONT-SIZE:
12pt" lang="EN-GB">
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