[General] STR twin Paradox

[Albrecht Giese]

Dear John W and Grahame,


I think that I should explain a bit about this discussion between Wolf 
and myself. Why this discussion is as it is.


I find the topic of Wolf about conciousness very interesting and very 
important. So I have continued with this discussion. But, unfortunately 
in my view, Wolf is basing his thoughts on a wrong understanding of 
relativity. The finds that this "incorrect" theory 'SRT' is an 
indication of our human failure to understand physics and so of our 
misleading consciousness. - But not SRT is incorrect (as some of you 
have already and repeatedly written) but Wolf's understanding is wrong. 
- I am trying to give Wolf a correct understanding as a precondition for 
a successful development of the issue of consciousness. I see that this 
may be boring for those who have understood relativity. But what else 
can we do to get ahead?

Any ideas?

Albrecht


Am 24.08.2017 um 11:35 schrieb Dr Grahame Blackwell:
> Very well put, John - I totally agree.
> Both Albrecht and Wolf are addressing important points - but they are 
> quite different points.
> It's absolutely true that Albrecht has the right of it within the 
> context of the sort of stuff that this forum is primarily about. But 
> by the same token, Wolf is raising significant points, points that 
> just don't really happen to fit with the main substance of this group 
> 'discussion'.
> Wolf, I find your input fascinating, many times I've wanted to exclain 
> "Yes!" - but it tends too much to take us away from the physical-realm 
> based stuff that really needs to be pinned down if physics is to 
> progress at that level.  The consciousness issue also needs (very 
> importantly) to be addressed - I believe our progress will be severely 
> limited until/unless we DO address it - but as quite a different 
> topic.  (Maybe we need a separate discussion group...)
> Thanks, John, for drawing that very helpful distinction.
> Grahame
>
>     ----- Original Message -----
>     *From:* John Williamson <mailto:John.Williamson at glasgow.ac.uk>
>     *To:* Nature of Light and Particles - General Discussion
>     <mailto:general at lists.natureoflightandparticles.org>
>     *Cc:* Mark, Martin van der
>     <mailto:martin.van.der.mark at philips.com> ; Pete Delaney
>     <mailto:piet.delaney.2 at gmail.com> ; Darren Eggenschwiler
>     <mailto:d.e.a.eggenschwiler at gmail.com> ; Innes Morrison
>     <mailto:innesdmorrison at gmail.com>
>     *Sent:* Thursday, August 24, 2017 8:47 AM
>     *Subject:* Re: [General] STR twin Paradox
>
>     Dear Wolf and Albrecht.
>
>     Please forgive me if I am wrong, and you are both really
>     communicating deeply, but I do not think the two of you are really
>     communicating at all on any meaningful level.
>
>     Albrecht, you do not seem to get what Wolf is talking about at
>     all, and keep trying to draw him back to the limited grounds of
>     SR, which is quite irrelevant to most of what he is trying to say.
>     On another forum his approach would be taken to be the majority view.
>
>     Wolf, you should not be trying to go onto the grounds of the
>     argument with SR as this is not what you are about. You are going
>     to lose on those grounds as SR is perfectly self-consistent and
>     does describe the physics of synchrotrons perfectly. Albrecht is
>     right: otherwise they would not work. This is not to say that SR
>     is in any way the whole story. It is not, as is being discussed in
>     some of the other threads.
>
>     This whole back and forth has become a prime example of both of
>     you making up what you think the other is talking about and then
>     arguing with that instead of conducting a proper discussion with
>     each other. You are both arguing, effectively, with yourself. This
>     is not necessarily a bad thing, of course, as one or both of you
>     may come to the realisation that you have something to learn and
>     that is always a good thing. It has become pretty tiring for an
>     outside observer though.
>
>     Regards, John.
>
>     ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>
>
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